Rest In Piss Mobile XI

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Rest in Piss Mobile XI
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 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2020-12-16 06:02:22  
I'm not sure that's gonna happen, considering that it was an external company working on it and not SE themselves.
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By SimonSes 2020-12-16 06:29:19  
Draylo said: »
I wonder what that big announcement in 2022 is if they axed the mobile game.

You will be able to store Odyssey KI :)

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By SimonSes 2020-12-16 06:42:24  
Bahamut.Inspectorgadget said: »
The Mobile Gaming Market needs to crash and burn and never come back again.

99.9% of the "games" on Google Play are literally pay2win casinos.

Even the classics like OG Angry Birds and Cut the Rope are filled with microtransactions and face-raping ads these days.

Have you been playing Mobius FF? It was one of the best Final Fantasy game. Story was decent, especially crossovers with different Final Fantasy games. Gameplay was great and you was able to automate (and setting perfect auto deck was mini game on its own) fights when grinding and play manually when fight was tough. It was on phones and later on Steam too. It had very good system, where you didnt need to spend anything to play Story PvE (unless you wanted to play like 5h+ a day, every day). The only thing where pay2win mattered was climbing towers (PvE contest with monsters being harder on each floor). Still many people were able to place in top 100 without spending even 1$. Some wales were spending few thousands of $ monthly tho to get all supreme cards and most people spent at least 60$ 2-3 times a year for special supreme pull. Now the big twist is that this game was still cancelled too. Its one thing I cannot forgive SE. Totally *** move. Whats the conclusion tho? Dont really expect mobile game from SE where you wont be sucked from every $ you have, because they seems to have very high threshold for those game to be worth keeping alive.
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By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2020-12-16 08:05:52  
Leviathan.Draugo said: »
Hurray, maybe now they get back to focusing on that new expansion and/or HD remaster.
I was sort of wondering if maybe the recent surge of new players made them want to focus their resources elsewhere. Like, the idea was to use the mobile version to kill off the original, but now they know the original is still serviceable as a cash cow and they can lean towards keeping it active (one can hope?)

Definitely still curious as to what their 2022 surprise is. Most of the ideas floating through my head make me cringe and I just want it sorted out already lol
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By Shichishito 2020-12-16 08:07:14  
there are a few good mobile games although most of them seem to be ports and you can count them on one hand. stardew valley or terraria come to mind.

the WII U for example only sold 13.56 million times but i bet lots of its games are pure gold compared to 95$ of whats available on android. there are 2.5 billion android devices in circulation and even if only 1% of those are capable to run somewhat demanding games that be still 25 million. there has to be room for profit without relying on micro transactions.

i'll never understand how we got a decade deep into the smart phone era with pretty much nothing but pay2win and gotcha titles.
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By Onimaru 2020-12-16 08:21:56  
No loss there. It was destined to fail from the get go, but bruh.. 5 years wasted? those guys shouldve instead focused on enhancing the PC game as it's in need of some attention.

Also, NO ONE asked for a ffxi mobile game.
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By Thunderjet 2020-12-16 08:33:27  
SimonSes said: »
Bahamut.Inspectorgadget said: »
The Mobile Gaming Market needs to crash and burn and never come back again.

99.9% of the "games" on Google Play are literally pay2win casinos.

Even the classics like OG Angry Birds and Cut the Rope are filled with microtransactions and face-raping ads these days.

Have you been playing Mobius FF? It was one of the best Final Fantasy game. Story was decent, especially crossovers with different Final Fantasy games. Gameplay was great and you was able to automate (and setting perfect auto deck was mini game on its own) fights when grinding and play manually when fight was tough. It was on phones and later on Steam too. It had very good system, where you didnt need to spend anything to play Story PvE (unless you wanted to play like 5h+ a day, every day). The only thing where pay2win mattered was climbing towers (PvE contest with monsters being harder on each floor). Still many people were able to place in top 100 without spending even 1$. Some wales were spending few thousands of $ monthly tho to get all supreme cards and most people spent at least 60$ 2-3 times a year for special supreme pull. Now the big twist is that this game was still cancelled too. Its one thing I cannot forgive SE. Totally *** move. Whats the conclusion tho? Dont really expect mobile game from SE where you wont be sucked from every $ you have, because they seems to have very high threshold for those game to be worth keeping alive.

i disagree it sucked i played it for 5 mins even garbage 15 is better, the only good mobile FF was dimensions and that was designed before the bs Phone gaming was a thing.

sorry me very bad englayze
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By Idiot Boy 2020-12-16 08:47:23  
Ragnarok.Jessikah said: »
Definitely still curious as to what their 2022 surprise is.
I go in a vicious cycle of "Hey! There's hope! Yoshida wouldn't *** with people for no reason!" followed immediately by "Oh yes, HOPE. Let's see how THAT works out for you", rinse, repeat.
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By SimonSes 2020-12-16 08:58:28  
Thunderjet said: »
i disagree it sucked i played it for 5 mins

Not sure if trolling...

Its like saying game is garbage in middle of tutorial. Its like saying FFXI sucks after playing THF for 5 min, because you can only use auto attack and even "fast" dagger hits once every 3 sec and you run slow.

inb4 you can have opinion that FFXI sucks ofc. I just meant how stupid it sounds to base that opinion after playing for 5 min. You basically havent even licked the true gameplay, itemization and obviously story.
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By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2020-12-16 09:14:48  
Either way, I was more relieved when the news dropped than I thought I'd be. Despite the facade I put on for myself, I really wasn't all that keen on the leaked screenshots, and I've yet to play a Final Fantasy mobile game that I've liked.

In fact, Square-Enix ruined and then swiftly pulled the plug on the only mobile game I've ever enjoyed: Heavenstrike Rivals.
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 Asura.Karbuncle
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By Asura.Karbuncle 2020-12-16 09:30:49  
Phoenix.Dabackpack said: »
What's really bizarre to me about this is that they already made a mobile FF11 port for Japanese smartphones several years ago. It was called Final Fantasy Grandmasters. It was... a different kind of game, but it used the job system, basic story elements and Vana'diel lore, subjobs&job abilities, and endgame raids (each of the Avatar fights, Nyzul Isle, etc.). It even used the Trust system--- instead of forming parties with real players you could make a party of NPCs to solo certain content.




The game wasn't even that bad by mobage standards... it used cute chibi 3D models for the characters, had a fairly robust party finder system, a shout system, and plenty of ways to play with other people (if you joined an existing battle, you could help bring the mob down for a portion of the drop rewards). Player collaboration was super important, since each job had to time their debuff+buff uses with each other in order to clear high-end content. It was a little tricky at first since my Japanese isn't that good, but eventually I was able to see the regular patterns and ability cycles.

The progression system relied on gear iLvls and upgrading abilities to make them more potent or have more uses. It was... fine, it at least made sense. The gacha system was tbh kinda annoying, since you had two gachas: one for equipment, and one for job-specific abilities. On top of that, there were sometimes Trust Fests which used the same gacha system as the ability one. That's really my one complaint, as far as I remember. I don't hate gacha systems at all, I've seen some really well-implemented ones (Dissidia Opera Omnia is a good example in the West). Grandmaster's gacha system kinda sucked. But overall, this was a pretty good game, and the closest I've seen to true MMORPG-style interaction in a mobage.

So seeing all the drama and dumb ***revolving around this so-called "FF11 mobile port" kind of confuses me.

Is there an echo in here?

jokes aside, I do wish that game had come Global but I'm sure it'd of been super pooper, JP games always tend to be better quality/more generous due to the aggressive mobile market there and overwhelming amount of already solid games you have to compete against.

in GL they generally know whales gunna whale and don't care.

So, I guess I should say, I wish I could read Japanese back then so I could have enjoyed it better lol. When I tried it out they didn't have Trusts, and I don't believe they had Nyzul Isle either... but I did BCNM's against Behemoth lol. Back then the "strategy" for most fights was using Boost a couple times followed by a "big nuke" ability.
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By Wordspoken 2020-12-16 09:56:47  
Asura.Sechs said: »
Wish SE could buy the already done assets and transform that game into a single player version of FFXI that can remain as faint memory of what FFXI used to be even 10 years from now.

FFXI is a "numbered" FF after all. What is SE gonna tell their fans in 2035 when the FFXI servers will likely be closed and FFXI unplayable?
Will SE tell his fans "you can't play the eleventh title of the FF series, sorry"?

Providing an offline-only version, while only an imitation of what FFXI really used to be, would be better than nothing.
This is why I'm ok with private servers, if SE pulls the plug, they're the ones preserving FFXI.
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 Ragnarok.Jessikah
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By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2020-12-16 10:29:05  
Asura.Sechs said: »
Wish SE could buy the already done assets and transform that game into a single player version of FFXI that can remain as faint memory of what FFXI used to be even 10 years from now.

FFXI is a "numbered" FF after all. What is SE gonna tell their fans in 2035 when the FFXI servers will likely be closed and FFXI unplayable?
Will SE tell his fans "you can't play the eleventh title of the FF series, sorry"?

Providing an offline-only version, while only an imitation of what FFXI really used to be, would be better than nothing.
I've thought of this a lot too. I feel like whenever the servers do die, they'll come up with some way to keep it going. Maybe they can remake it offline with gameplay akin to FFXII. It's not like Square-Enix have been shy about remaking their games. And this is still one of the most profitable games they've ever made.
 
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By Idiot Boy 2020-12-16 11:10:51  
endxen said: »
6200+ estimated accounts
Not to quibble with your overall points about player base and viability, but if you're getting that 6200 number from the AH database page, that's the absolute minimum number of accounts that could possibly exist to generate the AH traffic we see.

My finger-in-the-wind math for the actual number is somewhere in the 80k range.

Not all of those players would want an offline version, and some people would buy the offline that wouldn't play the MMO version, so who knows how the actual economics of it would work out, but it's not quite as bleak as you say.
 
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By Idiot Boy 2020-12-16 11:27:21  
endxen said: »
Even if that number is 80,000 it would be a flop as far as cost of development would go for a game of this scale.

SE sold 3 million copies of Avengers and still caused them to have a 50M loss for the entire company for the second quarter.

Like I said, not quibbling with your overall point, just pointing out that the 6200 number is the floor: it's much higher than that in reality.

The fact of the matter though is that making an offline version wouldn't have to be that hard:
- The client barely has to change at all, and is really just stripping out the multi-player functions (tells, linkshells, player search, auction house, etc etc)
- You have it connect to a "server" like it usually does, only that server is just running locally. Darkstar-in-a-box, basically.
- Gambit system for the Trust NPCs

There's more to it than that, especially if you want a graphical upgrade (biggest changes would be around the system's economics/paring back gear options to make leveling hard again), but you could get surprisingly far with just that. Not sure how much fun that would be to play, but you could get there in a hurry if you put even a couple of real developers on it.
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 Asura.Beatsbytaru
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By Asura.Beatsbytaru 2020-12-16 11:38:27  
Idiot Boy said: »
Ragnarok.Jessikah said: »
Definitely still curious as to what their 2022 surprise is.
I go in a vicious cycle of "Hey! There's hope! Yoshida wouldn't *** with people for no reason!" followed immediately by "Oh yes, HOPE. Let's see how THAT works out for you", rinse, repeat.
Ah yeah, that feeling of reckless optimism is familiar from somewh.....
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 Ragnarok.Jessikah
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By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2020-12-16 12:47:43  
endxen said: »
Doubt they will remake ffxi for offline. Yes SE does like to "port" and milk everything they can from old titles. But there is a huge cost difference in having to completely redo a game of XI's scope and "porting" a title. "Port" takes minimal effort with little cost while XI would probably have a huge cost since it would have to be redone from the ground up. XI doesn't have a huge player base either, 6200+ estimated accounts doesn't sound like a risk any sane company would waste time/money on. Also many people have multiple accounts and only having "offline" play would cut that number of accounts way down too. It just wouldn't be an investment that would pay off for them.
I respectfully disagree. The people already playing Final Fantasy XI would probably be the most interested, yes. But how many people haven't played the game at all just because it's an MMORPG? How many people have yet to experience the fantastic story, world, and music just because they gave up before they even gave the game a chance? There are probably millions of people waiting for an offline FFXI.
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By Asura.Aeonova 2020-12-16 12:56:27  
Asura.Sechs said: »
Wish SE could buy the already done assets and transform that game into a single player version of FFXI that can remain as faint memory of what FFXI used to be even 10 years from now.

Aside from needing random farmables or crafted items from off of the AH and the high end content that takes an alliance, what part of FFXI isn't really single player now? I've been playing by myself for years at this point and no. I'm not some random BST that only solos because nobody will invite me to their exp party.

The only thing that comes to mind when thinking about what I've teamed up with people on in the last 5 years is random pick-up Sinister Reign and when I was doing some random assault that worked better with more people trying to find some random invisible item. A version of SR exists now that could be solo'd on the right job and the assault technically could have been solo'd, but it just would have taken longer / more attempts.

They could even add a chat AI bot that made it feel like "home":

 
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By Asura.Eiryl 2020-12-16 13:04:59  
Whats solo and what's not is merely a function of level. higher (i)lvl, higher meva, you just outpace the content you couldn't solo 5 levels ago. Beside the instagib gimmick *** like death or 5 tick doom that still lands when you're 80 levels higher than the mob.

If there was a XI offline people would buy it. All the things that make 11 ***are the result of online play. It'd be a solid 100+ hour main-line game with the missions and cutscenes. twelve-like trust-party and progress unlocks gear. People would buy that.

It probably wouldn't sell enough to be worthwhile undertaking though. Even though it would take basically nothing to do, it's still too much effort.
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By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2020-12-16 13:07:50  
Asura.Aeonova said: »
what part of FFXI isn't really single player now?
Exactly. Thanks to Trusts, most of the game can be played solo nowadays. And the parts that need real players could just be converted into the same late-game content that every offline Final Fantasy has.

The only difficult part would be to convert the larger-scale aspects of the game. The very roots of Final Fantasy XI are set in a foundation of community. What would they do with all that? Even a lot of the story is based around adventurers from every nation overcoming adversity and banding together for the common good. Not to say it can't be done, but it would have to be done very carefully.
 
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 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2020-12-16 13:15:24  
It would be just like any other numbered ff game.
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 Ragnarok.Jessikah
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By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2020-12-16 13:24:08  
endxen said: »
Its an acquired game play style that was/is not that popular for most people. Most people don't like the grind and want instant gratification in a game. That's why FFXI didn't do so well against WoW and other mmorpg that were out at the same time frame of its prime. The amount of money that goes into a game now vs. 18 years ago is staggering. FFXI cost 25M to develop, FFXIV cost almost 400M to develop. It would probably cost 150M+ to redo FFXI into an offline format. The game has to be redone since they never optimized the spaghetti ps2 coding/development environment when they dropped console support. It only had 500K active players in its peak, its not a game that any publisher would take on and expect to be profitable after production/development cost. SE has also made it quite clear that FFXI is not a priority any more, FFXIV unfortunately is.
That's like implying the offline version of Final Fantasy XVI is doomed to fail because its current playerbase is 0 (because it doesn't exist). Yet they're investing money to make it because that isn't the only gauge, nor the only market.

Look no further than the recent VII remake. They developed it and even marketed it as a game that would appeal to more than just the existing fans. The result was both fans of the original and people who had never played it before were all into it.

If an offline Final Fantasy XI were marketed as its own entity, people would be willing to try it. Past players, present players, fans of the Final Fantasy franchise, you name it. I have a lot of friends who refuse to play XI because it's an MMO, but they're dying to experience the game Shantotto comes from.
 
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 Ragnarok.Jessikah
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By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2020-12-16 13:33:06  
endxen said: »
Asura.Eiryl said: »
It would be just like any other numbered ff game.

100% True. The online is what makes XI and XIV unique and have continued value for SE.
I think Eiryl was disagreeing with you.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the implication is that the non-MMO Final Fantasy games have all been quite successful, despite having the finite storylines of offline games.
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By Asura.Eiryl 2020-12-16 13:40:00  
It wasn't a for or against just a fact.

XI offline would be basically identical to 12 with 6 a person party and more jobs. "how well" it would sell is highly contestable.
It would make less money than an MMO, obviously. $60 one time sale vs $150+ a year. Apples/Oranges
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