Killer Instinct: The Beastmaster Compendium

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Killer Instinct: The Beastmaster Compendium
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By phunky 2022-05-09 19:35:28  
Quetzalcoatl.Falkirk said: »
What does the best HP+ gearset look like for BST?

This should be BIS HP+ for BST unless I'm missing some obscure item.

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Unmoving collar +1 and Gelatinous Ring +1 R15.
Alternative to Happy egg is Charitoni Sling
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By Pent 2022-05-21 16:56:44  
Right Now I have Kariyeh Ring +1 and I am debating swapping it for Thurandaut Ring +1 for bst. What are people thoughts on it?
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By Nariont 2022-05-21 17:25:29  
Its a great pet ring, but kariyeh is so universally solid its hard to give up, just depends how often you rely on your pets i guess
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By SimonSes 2022-05-21 19:28:40  
Nariont said: »
kariyeh

Kariyeh isn't that great. It's usually on par with alternatives and sometimes it's worse. It's almost(?) never bis anymore.
Weatherspoon, Thurandaut, Shneddick, Orvail seem to all be better choices.
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2022-05-24 16:02:05  
SimonSes said: »
Nariont said: »
kariyeh

Kariyeh isn't that great. It's usually on par with alternatives and sometimes it's worse. It's almost(?) never bis anymore.
Weatherspoon, Thurandaut, Shneddick, Orvail seem to all be better choices.

This is heavily dependent on whether the user has Epaminondas' Ring. If not, Kariyeh +1 is very often one of the 2 next best rings for WS and is an excellent choice (and you can always redo the ring selection if you eventually get Epam or new better WS rings).

Personally, I've had Thurdandaut +1 in the past and I got rid of it... and I don't really miss it. And I used it more for PUP, which IMO gets a lot more out of a pet haste/atk/acc/DT ring than BST does. If Thurandaut had also had pet Macc/MAB, I might be a little more tempted for BST (for added effects on magical ready moves, and some more magical damage).

Weatherspoon is pretty job-dependent. Fast Cast is nice enough, but pretty inessential on mage jobs that can generally cap FC without it. The real draw is the light affinity, but there are limited jobs who really care about that (RNG for Trueflight and RDM for Seraph Blade are the biggest ones).

Orvail only matters if you're a serious crafter, but if you are that might be your pick. Shneddick doesn't impress me much as a minor convenience movement speed ring where most jobs have 18% movement speed options anyway, if not 12%. Personally, I'd rather go for battle performance unless it was just a mule.
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By Asura.Geriond 2022-05-24 16:13:38  
Schneddick is more than convenience since 18% movement speed items are often linked to piece with relatively low defense and magic evasion, which can matter if you're kiting or training groups. Going from Crimson Cuisses +1 to Sakpata Legs is a notable boost in survivability, for example. It's an even bigger boost to jobs without 18% items or without 18% items with ilvl.
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2022-05-24 16:52:44  
Asura.Geriond said: »
Schneddick is more than convenience since 18% movement speed items are often linked to piece with relatively low defense and magic evasion, which can matter if you're kiting or training groups. Going from Crimson Cuisses +1 to Sakpata Legs is a notable boost in survivability, for example. It's an even bigger boost to jobs without 18% items or without 18% items with ilvl.

Fair enough, though I suppose the consideration there is whether you kite groups of mobs often enough to make Schneddick a worthwhile upgrade.

For use specifically on BST, that's probably not something most people do a lot... but yeah, if you regularly pull groups of mobs on a PLD or RDM or something, maybe you care enough to dedicate the Adoulin reward ring to that purpose.

I still have some hope that Empy reforged armor will add more 18% movement pieces with the same level of strong ilevel defensive stats we've seen on the most current gear sets (like the base Meva values for Odyssey gear). BST being one of those where it would be nice to ditch Skadi +1.
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2022-05-24 17:18:25  
Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
Weatherspoon is pretty job-dependent. Fast Cast is nice enough, but pretty inessential on mage jobs that can generally cap FC without it. The real draw is the light affinity, but there are limited jobs who really care about that (RNG for Trueflight and RDM for Seraph Blade are the biggest ones).

BST gets similar use out of Weatherspoon Ring that other Light-WS jobs get, due to Primal Rend.
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2022-05-25 01:34:36  
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
Weatherspoon is pretty job-dependent. Fast Cast is nice enough, but pretty inessential on mage jobs that can generally cap FC without it. The real draw is the light affinity, but there are limited jobs who really care about that (RNG for Trueflight and RDM for Seraph Blade are the biggest ones).

BST gets similar use out of Weatherspoon Ring that other Light-WS jobs get, due to Primal Rend.

Yeah, it does get some use on BST - mostly for Aymur. Guess it kinda depends on what other jobs you use though. Someone who plays a lot of BST and RNG, and also has mage jobs that would like the FC ring? OK, that's more tempting.

If you were going to choose a ring ONLY for BST purposes? Eh, I think that probably makes Thurandaut a more appealing choice.

And someone who plays BST as well as several other melee jobs without significant light magical WS? Karieyh starts looking like a better all-around option if you don't already have the full array of BiS rings (Epam + Regal + whatever other more job-specific ones like Gere or Niqmaddu).

I guess what I'm trying to say is, Adoulin ring reward is very specific to the person choosing it, and really should be tailored more toward what jobs that person wants to gear (or whether they really want a super-specialized focus for one job while ignoring the rest... like perhaps a Thurandaut ring for someone with BST and no other pet jobs)
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By SimonSes 2022-05-25 02:37:58  
Karieyh ring is only good as +1 version. Most other rings are good even as NQ. Karieyh+1 is also almost never bis anymore and when it's bis it's by fraction of the %.

Thurandaut for BST seems very niche too. Pets are mostly for buffs and debuffs ready moves. Thurandaut only helps with melee hits and physical damage Ready moves when you are uncapped, both rather niche those days and even then Thurandaut isnt anything game breaking for those, just some mediocre att and accuracy. Biggest advantage is probably 4%DT for pet in situation where you really need to keep pet alive.

Weatherspoon is also niche for Primal Rend, but at least it's significantly bis option for that.
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By Asura.Chendar 2022-05-25 05:19:44  
I keep my karieyh+1 only because BLU doesn't really get much for ring options, otherwise I'd probably be swapping to weatherspoon in a heartbeat. Light affinity is really nice when it applies. Can see Schneddick being nice to have too though.

Thurandaut really only makes sense to me if you're really serious about PUP for the extra pet haste on it.
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By SimonSes 2022-05-25 05:53:30  
Asura.Chendar said: »
only because BLU doesn't really get much for ring options

For Expiacion?
Epam + Sroda for capped attack
Epam + Ilabrat/BeithirR25 for uncapped

Beithir is only 0.7% behind Karieyh+1 for capped too.
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2022-05-25 14:17:59  
SimonSes said: »
Karieyh ring is only good as +1 version. Most other rings are good even as NQ. Karieyh+1 is also almost never bis anymore and when it's bis it's by fraction of the %.

Thurandaut for BST seems very niche too. Pets are mostly for buffs and debuffs ready moves. Thurandaut only helps with melee hits and physical damage Ready moves when you are uncapped, both rather niche those days and even then Thurandaut isnt anything game breaking for those, just some mediocre att and accuracy. Biggest advantage is probably 4%DT for pet in situation where you really need to keep pet alive.

Weatherspoon is also niche for Primal Rend, but at least it's significantly bis option for that.

All of that is a a great breakdown for BST-specific purposes - which is mostly to say, none of them are super important for BST except maybe for an Aymur user looking to really pump out the Primal Rend damage. But to me, I'd pick the ring based more on other jobs, and if it happens to be of some use on BST, great.

Also a great point that Karieyh is only worth getting if you can get the +1.

SimonSes said: »
For Expiacion?
Epam + Sroda for capped attack
Epam + Ilabrat/BeithirR25 for uncapped

Beithir is only 0.7% behind Karieyh+1 for capped too.

Simon, I do agree with most of what you're saying. But the one big thing to keep in mind is that it's an unrealistic assumption to think that most people have Epam, Sroda, and R25 Odyssey anything.

For the player who has it all, sure, Karieyh +1 is not as impressive. But for the simple example of someone who doesn't have Epam (a ring that goes for 75m+ on some servers), Karieyh +1 is an extremely nice alternative for "free" that has good uses on most jobs for many WS. If you don't already have every other good WS option and you don't have a particularly compelling reason to choose one of the other rings (say, you're serious about crafting), it's a very reasonable choice.

FWIW, Kari+1 also has some use as an idle regain piece. Relatively minor perk, but it's helpful. As BSTs probably know from the Gleti's set, it can be pretty nice to get TP while running around, waiting for people, or while a party is buffing.
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By SimonSes 2022-05-26 10:03:55  
Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
For the player who has it all, sure, Karieyh +1 is not as impressive. But for the simple example of someone who doesn't have Epam (a ring that goes for 75m+ on some servers), Karieyh +1 is an extremely nice alternative for "free" that has good uses on most jobs for many WS.

For me personally getting +1 SoA ring is more endgame than cheese R25 beithir ring. I still don't have soa +1 ring and I have lots of R25 Odyssey gear. Also if you have mythic for BLU you probably have gils for Epam.

Now for BST alone I would rather have Weatherspoon, Shneddick or Thurandaut, because Karieyh is just super marginal gain (also only with capped attack) and Savage Blade has another good "cheap" option with MetamorphR15. BST also has access to Gere and Regal rings, which both are great options too for Savage, Mistral and Calamity.
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2022-05-27 00:24:59  
SimonSes said: »
For me personally getting +1 SoA ring is more endgame than cheese R25 beithir ring. I still don't have soa +1 ring and I have lots of R25 Odyssey gear. Also if you have mythic for BLU you probably have gils for Epam.

Depends on the person. SoA +1 ring can pretty easily be done solo by a player in little more than sparks gear, just needs a (not insignificant) coalition/quest grind, and maybe a helper to win the last SoA fight. It's not really much harder than getting, say, a Moonshade Earring. R25 ANYTHING for Ody requires the help of a highly skilled endgame group with a good spread of jobs, and a huge amount of time segment farming to even get into the fights for clears.

And yeah, perhaps Mythic owner = more likely to have the gil. But on the other hand, people can have nice/expensive things and still have a budget. We're talking about a ring in Epam that has a major price tag that could go to other more significant improvements. For about the same cost, you could get one of the following:
(a) A full 119 relic and a big chunk of the detritus to upgrade it
(b) 1500 HMPs to make an Empy
(c) Most of the Alexandrite to make a Mythic
(d) All of the Detritus to take any RMEA weapon from R0 to R15
(e) A Su5 weapon
(f) A couple of JSE+2 necks

I could totally understand someone thinking that putting the same amount of gil toward any of those choices (or other pricey upgrades) would be a better investment than getting a ring with an additional 1% WSD versus the next best WSD option that comes from a "free" mission reward.

Quote:
Now for BST alone I would rather have Weatherspoon, Shneddick or Thurandaut

That I can agree with. Well, at least I can for Weatherspoon or Thurandaut.

I get the argument for Shneddick from an all jobs perspective (and more valuable for some jobs than others). But from a strictly BST point of view, I don't really see it as that big of a deal to be able to replace Skadi+1 feet with a piece that has better defensive stats. YMMV, but I don't really find myself regularly running into situations where I'm on BST and it's vital for me to use movement speed gear while kiting multiple mobs. If you do, hey, knock yourself out. Or if you pick Shneddick for a wider spread of jobs, OK, it definitely has its use on BST too.

But IMO, it's waaaaaay more likely that the vast majority of BSTs will much more frequently run into practical situations where they'd want to... use Primal Rend, or use Thurandaut for physical ready move damage or pet: DT- purposes.
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By SimonSes 2022-05-27 01:40:37  
Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
It's not really much harder than getting, say, a Moonshade Earring. R25 ANYTHING for Ody requires the help of a highly skilled endgame group with a good spread of jobs, and a huge amount of time segment farming to even get into the fights for clears.

Technically not harder in the sense of skill and gear requirements, but please lets not make it even slightly comparable in term of grind.. ALL coalitions (like 6months of grind), ALL garden (hundreds of visits in garden EVERY day), ALL sub quests that in total take several more time than whole WOTG and whole SoA.

Getting R25 Beithir ring can be done in a week or two of 30min time investment per day. You could pay for V20 clear (probably not much for A2 clear) and cheese 5 moglophone runs with PUG.

End of this off topic tho :D
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2022-05-27 05:08:51  
I don't have a SoA+1 ring either, and I have been playing for many years.
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2022-05-27 15:54:58  
SimonSes said: »
Getting R25 Beithir ring can be done in a week or two of 30min time investment per day. You could pay for V20 clear (probably not much for A2 clear) and cheese 5 moglophone runs with PUG.

Week or two of 30min investment my ***. I've invested many dozens of hours into Ody, I have zero V20 clears and zero R25 anything. And I've got lots of well geared jobs, good gear, and friends with the same. I'm not saying my groups are the best, but we're certainly very far from the worst.

Perhaps some of this is also down to whether your server has an active merc culture. Mine sure doesn't, there are never Ody merc shouts or V20 PUGs, I have literally never seen anyone offering to sell slots for cheese RP fights, and almost never even see any pickup shouts for Gaol fights. Outside of relatively infrequent pickup segment farming shouts (which are likely not going to be great for segments based on the quality of most pickup groups), the experience on my server is that Odyssey is content you grind over a very long period of time with people you know.

Serious question: can you even actually bring the party into a V20 fight if you only had a win from leeching with a merc group? I thought the party leader entering the fight needed all previous tiers cleared at the current and all previous Vengeance levels (and if you got an "early" unlock, you do retain credit for that win but you can't use that for entry progress until beating all previous levels/NMs). Please lemme know if I am incorrect!

Assuming my understanding was right, that's 17 NMs x 4 (V0 V5 V10 V15) to even start on V20, plus the 4 T1 clears at V20 to access the ability. 72 NMs x 3000 segments = 216,000 segments at an absolute minimum just to get into tier 2 V20 fights. And that's wildly low, since it doesn't even count any losses on NMs (which are inevitable), nor the significant time to gear the jobs to win these fights, nor the coordination between group members to do this event that requires a party, nor beating multiple NMs to pump up a Moogle Amplifier.

I know sometimes on FFXIAH, people also make the wildly unrealistic assumption that people here are always just waltzing into segment runs for 10k/run. So far from the truth, it's more common for an average player to struggle to break 3k.

Just for argument's sake, let's say someone can average 5k/run (a laughably high estimate for the vast majority of the community). That's already an absolute minimum of 44+ segment farming runs, when you only get 1 new tag a day. Add more time since you're having to coordinate with other players to get that amount of segments. And of course, realistically you will need a lot more Moglophone IIs - absolutely nobody's getting 100% success rate on NM wins in a single fight. It's probably more realistic to at least triple (probably more) the amount of Moglophone IIs a player will need, when accounting for losses, Amplifier runs, RPing other gear, whatever.

So enjoy the many dozens of hours just farming segments, dozens more hours doing the NM fights, and then hope you've even got a job spread of highly skilled/geared players sufficient to actually win the hard fights like an Mboze or Ongo V15+.

Seriously, thinking about that just makes me say F Odyssey. Awful.

Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
I don't have a SoA+1 ring either, and I have been playing for many years.

Person who originally asked about rings did have a +1. The other person talking about BLU has an Epeolatry, so at least most of the way there if not finished.

But yeah, the Coalition and Mog Garden grind is real. It's very easy though, literally anyone can do it on their own. You're not gonna start from zero and finish it in a week, but stuff like Garden is literally just getting in the habit of remembering to click the thing when you log in daily and it will eventually get done.
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By Nariont 2022-05-27 16:00:26  
Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
But yeah, the Coalition and Mog Garden grind is real.
The furrow grind in particular is the worst part, the rest you could do mostly hand in hand with the coalition grind, quests are just busy work you can do at any point and a few at least at one point gave decent accessories, think most have lost their value.
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2022-05-27 16:05:52  
Nariont said: »
Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
But yeah, the Coalition and Mog Garden grind is real.
The furrow grind in particular is the worst part, the rest you could do mostly hand in hand with the coalition grind, quests are just busy work you can do at any point and a few at least at one point gave decent accessories, think most have lost their value.

The pet earrings and Homiliary are still pretty great. But yes, agreed with your comment. Furrow does suck big time. But, eh, get in the habit of logging out in your mog garden and hitting it whenever you log in is all it takes. And you do get other bonuses from doing all the Adoulin stuff: Ygnas trust, access to Ergon weapons.

Still a long grind, but very easy. F'ing laughable to compare that to clearing Odyssey to R20.

Anyway, this is so far from the original discussion about which rings are worth it. And hey, the original question was indeed someone who already had a +1 ring and was thinking of switching it. So it was kinda disingenuous that "oh but it takes a long time to get +1 rings" was even brought into the discussion...

EDIT: And sorry for the sorta derail that's getting far afield from BST-specific talk. I'll knock it off lol (but I didn't get here by myself! XD)
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By Asura.Secare 2022-05-27 17:42:53  
Phoenix.Capuchin said: »

Serious question: can you even actually bring the party into a V20 fight if you only had a win from leeching with a merc group? I thought the party leader entering the fight needed all previous tiers cleared at the current and all previous Vengeance levels (and if you got an "early" unlock, you do retain credit for that win but you can't use that for entry progress until beating all previous levels/NMs). Please lemme know if I am incorrect!

Assuming my understanding was right, that's 17 NMs x 4 (V0 V5 V10 V15) to even start on V20, plus the 4 T1 clears at V20 to access the ability. 72 NMs x 3000 segments = 216,000 segments at an absolute minimum just to get into tier 2 V20 fights. And that's wildly low, since it doesn't even count any losses on NMs (which are inevitable), nor the significant time to gear the jobs to win these fights, nor the coordination between group members to do this event that requires a party, nor beating multiple NMs to pump up a Moogle Amplifier.

If you're paying mercs (or tagging along for free) you only need 5 wins to be able to enter Raskovniche v20 and r25 a Beithir ring. It's just the v20 T1s and Raskovniche itself. You don't need to do the T3+ or get wins on the previous veng levels. The T1s and T2s are not that terrible on V20.
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By Veydal1 2022-06-06 11:41:16  
While I plan to mess around with all the jug pets on my own, I was curious to hear from more experienced BSTs on what they tend to use day-to-day.

- I've got the slug for attack / defense / HP down.
- Sheep when I don't have to worry about lowering my defense, otherwise courel.
- Chapuli for physical AoE cleaving

Are magical ready moves any good?

Would be interested in hearing how you guys fill out your roles in a group setting.

Is there a preferred pet for physical damage when you can't engage and you're primarily focused on the pet?

Sorry if I missed any of this mentioned in the guide or in the last few pages.
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By Nariont 2022-06-06 11:49:54  
acuex is i think still the best per-dmg nuke, coupled with the -mdb, while the damselfly's cursed sphere is your best spam move (1 charge, ken has +30 innate mab), if you needed to make easy sc/mbs the lizards still top for that iirc.
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By phunky 2022-06-06 12:07:14  
Usually how I pick my pets for day to day stuff is

1) Def down/-MDB
2) Killer instinct
3) Easy to SC with

So if you're grabbing CP/EP in dho gates you can double dip on defdown and KI using the bird, in Outer Raz Slug or genbu pet in crawlers nest.

If KI isn't applicable I'll use the raaz. Applies def down and easy to SC with decimation.
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By Veydal1 2022-06-06 12:22:12  
Thanks everyone, appreciate the info and tips!
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By Phoenix.Iocus 2022-06-14 22:05:35  
Asura.Beanen said: »
Odin.Wikitaru said: »
Asura.Bixbite said: »
Wear nyame, gleti boots and pet macc/dt pet dt in other slots. Summon tank, healer maybe the rdm trust that does frazzle. Then engage unleash and bstpet 1 spam.

Just tried this with LS on Ongo, RDM landed fuzzle and GEO uses geo-languor, we still have no luck on it. This is my set. Anything we did it wrong? Or can improve on?

https://www.ffxiah.com/item-sets/382658

The reason we are on it because we would like to have our mules get some RP as well. However we do not have wide range of jobs on them and it easier if one fight can be carried by bst method.

When you did this, did you try Rolanberry daifuku, Run Wild and Unleash spam? Also make sure you run in and hit the mob at least for a second for Tandem Strike.


Sorry to necro the comment out of context, but I figured I'd just use it for confirming.

Tandem Strike/ Blow apply to the entire fight so long as you have attacked the target at all and your pet is currently attacking it?

I assume you have to stay engaged.

Any info would be appreciated as I'm going from abyssea BST to gearing it for Mboze.
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2022-06-14 22:17:14  
You and the pet both need to be engaged to the target and have hit the target at least once for Tandem traits to take effect.
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2022-06-15 01:03:11  
Veydal1 said: »
While I plan to mess around with all the jug pets on my own, I was curious to hear from more experienced BSTs on what they tend to use day-to-day.

My go-tos, roughly in order of frequency I use them, are:
1) Bouncing Bertha/Chapuli for AoE/solid physical ready moves
2) Generous Arthur for party situations with def- on mobs
3) Vivacious Gaston for self attack+ buff in a party where mobs die too fast to care about applying slug def- (say, Dyna waves 1-2, Segment farming)
4) Warlike Patrick for the occasional magical AoE
5) Swooping Zhivago for some all-purpose def- and SCs with master
6) Daring Roland for some physical DPS and Jettatura terror (lasts a really long time, I like it for stuff like locking down Dyna-D NMs or NIN BST mobs that have more dangerous SP moves). Good 1hr physical ready move spam too.

Beyond that it's more niche use: leech for TP Drainkiss, occasionally Edwin or Patrice for a defensive leaning pet, or sometimes I just pull some random jug out for the hell of it when doing inconsequential stuff ;)

When Bestial Loyalty is down, I sometimes use NQ Chapuli if needing AoEs, but otherwise I'll just use a cheaper NPC jug from what I have on me. That's generally one of Arthur, Blackbeard Randy (I keep a stack of those almost exclusively for Call Beast), or Warlike Patrick.

Personally, I don't use sheep Rage all that much because in situations where I feel like I really want an Atk boost, mobs usually hit hard enough that I don't want the nasty Def-50%. I'll go for the more modest Lynx 20% attack buff with long duration and no negatives (and some decent other ready moves for para/silence and Charged Whisker AoE magic damage).

Depending on your WS, that might change what pet you select for SC purposes. I have Guttler/Doli (and workin' on an Aymur!), and I use Doli more for party/WS spam, but I like the Guttler for SC purposes on stuff like solo/lowman Apex mobs, since it plays nicer with Bertha and Zhivago for easy double-darkness SCs with master+pet (Onslaught > Pentapeck/Tegmina > Onslaught). Similarly for Aymur users, double darkness with Primal Rend > Pentapeck/Tegmina > Cloudsplitter is a good one.
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By Asura.Saevel 2022-06-15 16:50:38  
The bestest best jug ever.

https://www.bg-wiki.com/ffxi/Wispy_Broth

Why, because you gotta have a huge set of balls to show up without any TP moves and still fight.
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By Bahamut.Unagihito 2022-06-15 16:55:02  
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