For The Shinies! A Guide For Thief

I've seen TH go straight to 10(in chat log too) in Omen--I ended up chalking that up to the TH additional effect not showing up in logs if it procs during/slightly after a weapon skill animation. Reason i think that is the case is on RDM, enspell damage won't show up in chat logs during/after Weapon Skill animations even though the melee swings' damage does show. Sometimes it will be 2-3 rounds of melee swings before enspell damage starts to appear again.

Which actually also got me thinking of a way we can confirm that TH can NOT proc on multi-attack/offhand hits, as people would have noticed a jump from TH8 to TH10 during a single melee round if it could, outside of the above effect, and i don't think anyone has reported that?

I personally tested the Abyssea Atma a few weeks ago and to my big surprise the first proc I got was always TH9, meaning that despite me TPing in TH9 (8 from gear/traits, 1 from Atma), the Atma doesn't allow to break the initial TH8 cap.
I think I even made a post about it in this thread.

Years ago I also tested the opposite, TH4 for non-THF jobs, and in that scenario the Atma was working perfectly, first TH proc message was a TH6 one, meaning that the Atma allowed non-THF jobs to go beyond the TH4 cap for non-THF.
No clue if that got fixed, haven't tested it in years.



Edit:
I never tested the Kupower, which only works in old zones. I'm talking exclusively about the TH+ Atma.


Edit2:
We know that If you TH with the same amount of TH as the TH currently applied on the target (up to TH8 at least, unknown for higher values) you have roughly a 6% chance to upgrade on each dagger swing that lands on the target and hits for more than zero damage.
This is pretty much confirmed.
We also know that this chance is higher for hits under the effects of TA/SA and for Feint. Also for Weaponskills (which won't show the TH proc in the chatlog though).

We also know that the higher above TH8 the TH currently is on the target, the lower the chances to proc a level up (so less than ~6%). Altough it's been discussed wether this is naturally meant to be like that, or a consequence that we do not TH in more than TH8 because we were led to believe it would have no effect (some early tests by Melphina seemed to hint that TPing in more than TH8 might produce slightly higher level up rates).


With all of this said the big questions remain: can TH level up proc on multiattack procs? Can it proc from either hands or just from the MH hits?
Would be near to impossible to test. I wouldn't be surprised with the TH chance working only on the first hit of the main hand for each attack turn though.
Granted this would mean that the level up rate is higher than the approximate value of ~6% we observed so far, I think?

Omen does not have vorseals or blessings inside it, so it shouldn't have any oddness regarding first TH proc.

That could just mean you can't proc more than once in a single round, not necessarily that you can only proc on the first hit.

I've personally observed TH going from 8 to 10 or 11 without anyone in the party noticing the level up message.
Rare, but it happened multiple times.

Does this mean a chat packet, the same one, was lost for all of us in that party?
Does that mean I procced multiple levelups with WSs and they didn't show until I finally got a level up with a melee hit, hence showing in the chat log?

Who knows, but I'd be more leaning to think it's something like this, rather than TH proccing multiple times during the same attack turn and only the latest level showing up in the chatlog.

Hello and good evening all, I find the job thief very satisfying and love it, i read this forum as well as all the bgwiki info.
let me start off by saying i know my sentence structure will suck but let me try to communicate my interest as best as i can:

we all pay millions of gil for small incremental increases boosts to ws damage based off stats. i cant see where anybody posted about this at all. or maybe they have and i missed it?
in anycase this is something that would never be possible without windower or gearswap but this may be intersting if someone with superior knowlegde of lua and gearswap than mine own.

we have enhance Sneak attack on plunderers +1 gloves and enhance trick attack on pillagers +3 now i know i would not want to "WS" in this gear but shouldn't there be a way to enhance just the JA and then quickly swap into ws gear? for say stacked rudras? in theory it would be small increase but we pay huge amounts for those all the time. maybe some of you number crunchers and coders can either shoot me down or shed some light on this? edit- i know there is gear for enhancing abilities in gear swap but because of the very little delay between ja and the ws sometimes the ws will go off wearing the wrong gear is it possible to recode this to gauruntee this will swap?

Those enhancement effects don't work on activation.

I know. It's confusing. Some "enhance" work on activation, some have to be worn. it's annoying.

To get the effect of "enhances SA/TA" it has to be on at the time the actual attack lands. negating it's value.

so the gear has to be worn at time of hit?
aww thats a real bummer.


not to discredit because i do believe you because this sounds like something SE would do. but has someone tested this?

Been that way since the original AF gloves, and they werent worth it then either from what i recall

fair enough,
that really does suck.

Been looking ar Mummu +2 set and that DEX bonus is insane. Is there anything that beats out full Mummu for Rudra's and Evisceration?

start here https://www.bg-wiki.com/bg/Community_Thief_Guide

Come on bruh. I know that you know the answer.

Mummu has no crit damage, it has no attack, it has no wsd

Mummu +2 hands are the only really standout piece for Evisceration, otherwise there's better pieces for all other slots for other THF WS. https://www.bg-wiki.com/bg/Community_Thief_Guide#WS_Sets

While there are clearly better pieces for almost every slot, I'm not sure I'd call Mummu+2 "bad" for Evisceration in General, eh.
°-°
But I'm italian, we have low standards I suppose.

I mean what is "bad" what is "the definition" of "bad"

Is it 10% worse? Is it 20% worse? Is it literally 1 dps worse? is everything that isn't "the best" by definition "bad" or is it just "not as good".

Is 5/5 mummu "good enough". Is it "so bad you should quit because you don't know how bad it is". Is it merely sub optimal, but acceptable as a starting point.

"you" all define everything as either "the unequivocal absolute best possible" or "trash" there's no inbetween. Option A is good and everything else is bad.

This is so true, some folks have nasty habits of swinging towards absolutes. Whenever trying to coach a newer player I always try to encourage the safer bets or the choices that should be more sensible or consistent.

THANK YOU.

I am so sick of people just wanting a shopping list of gear for a job and instructions of how to use it, vs true knowledge of WHY that gear is chosen.

Give a person with zero knowledge of a job a shopping list and they see it as "well if I can't get XXX piece, I guess I'm screwed". Learn over time how and why those pieces were chosen, and you can make educated choices for acceptable, or even at times really good substitutions.

Just because you don't have the BiS option for a set doesn't mean you leave that slot empty (or the equivalent of)...you find an acceptable starting point.

thf guide takes the time to make 4-5 tiers of gear for each set, just saying. only so much hand holding you can do.

oh not specifically talking THF here. Sorry, I'm a casual visitor to this particular forum- was just speaking mostly on the general aspect of people seeking to gear up new jobs...more times than not I see a rush to get geared that supersedes the process of learning the job- its sets, reasons, and play style.

Aeneas/Twash is BiS? Or does Twash/Cento best when ACC allows?

r15 twash/cento will beat aeneas/twash by a fair amount.

I apologize if I offended anyone with my question, it was not my intent. Since I returned to the game like around two months ago, I've been slowly trying to get "caught up". But I'm also working on catching up my RDM and WHM, as well. So gil is a little tight.

Since I started getting multiple pieces of Mummu +2, I've seen some giant surges in my DEX, and my damage has definitely been increasing from what it was before, on both Evisceration and Rudra's Storm.

Atm I'm up to 3/5 armour + the ring. If it will keep upgrading my damage, I'm more than happy adding more pieces to it.

If there are feasible upgrades past that, I'm more than happy getting them, as well. But one thing at a time.

For now, Mummu +2 seems to be an upgrade for me, and it's cheap enough that I can still focus my gil on my other jobs. Or hold out until I can get a rarer piece.

I'm usually not one to go blindly into pre-made gear sets either. I like to see "what's out there" first, and build my way up.

Learning the "why's" and "how's" of a gear set is part of the fun in making them.

I do appreciate any input that was added to my knowledge. And I will take every piece of gear into consideration that was recommended to me.

Evisceration is a really good entry (and even endgame) ws for thf and the mummu set is excellent starting gear to use with it. Don't worry about offending anyone here we have no souls and our hearts are black.

Meh wak it isn't you, it's a general irritation in every thread from every player these days.

How far we've fallen.

That's basically always been true for FFXI players.

"Don't have Sniper Ring +1s? Go farm gil until you do."

Yeah but its more outspoken, more of the group do it now. It's the standard now vs the outlier then.

probably because its easier than ever for an average player to reach goals like REMA or +1 abjurations when it wasn't before

Is there a preference for Aeneas or Twashtar for mainhanding and R15? The community guide seems to be suggesting Aenas.

go back through the last few pages and there is quite a bit of discussion. it also depends on what you're doing.

Twash haz bigger rudra and more white dmg.