Sick Of Being Pushed Around

He's pretty much like this ingame, too. Lots of people tend to just avoid him.

No, that "honour" falls to Caitsith, once a shining beacon of helpful "get out there and do it" people, now a seething mess of infighting, bitching, ls bank thefts, drama, and some of the worst players of the game elevated to godlike status because they speak fluent /b/.

Its like Asura, only with a smaller population, therefore a higher saturation of ***.
There are still a few great people there, but at least four of them migrated with me to Siren to get away from all the bs.

So far, we all have nothing but love for Siren, other than me being unable to sell this damned Hocho.

lol, I figured that was the case when I looked at his profile and saw that the "***" comment has +39.

Well I just learned who to avoid. ^_^

Funny you mention that. Asura was my first. XD i left with some friends who apparently were seeking better economy when DRK was my only job. So i didn't have much experience on asura other than perpnos's linkshell that wanted to wait an hour because they were afraid to fight byakko on lightsday with 40 people. I pretty much learned the game on seraph (once i left finale).

sorry for getting off topic.

I agree with some of the stuff he said, even if other parts of it are ridiculously misguided. If you make it clear that you're really good at your job through performance, general game knowledge, and having above average gear for your job, people are a lot less likely to treat you like you don't matter.

The game has always been filled with people who will take advantage of you if given the chance, so you need to stop giving them the chance. Be aware of a linkshell's rules and lotting system before you join, and don't be afraid to leave. Too many people stay when their leaders are bending or straight up breaking the rules. Just don't tolerate it. If they won't have a discussion with you about your concerns or they disregard you, it's time to go. If you speak to them in a non-accusatory way about wanting to use your other jobs more in future events and it doesn't happen, or you don't feel like you're advancing your character or having fun, just leave.

He's also right about being dedicated and consistent. If you make no effort to establish yourself as an asset to the LS, people will just view you as another body. I'm a linkshell leader and there are absolutely people who join your shell, show up for events so they can collect gear, and then expect to dictate to you what job they'll come on and when. It's a little ridiculous when much of the "endgame" content in FFXI is a group effort. Most leaders don't ask you to come on a particular job because they hate you or they're bossy or any other petty reason; they simply need you to fill a particular role so the group can be successful. What people don't know, see, or consider is that a) gear and skill are not equal from player to player and b) players that have been there a lot longer than you have probably spent a lot of their time being the very job you're complaining about being. It's not fair to your older members to allow your newer members to come on their "fun" jobs while they're stuck in a rut, and they will let you know that they're displeased. Exceptions happen when you're not a dedicated or consistent member with above average gear. If someone comes in who plays their job significantly better than you do, don't be surprised when they are requested to play that job instead of you. The name of the event is not "[Yourname] gets their way today-herjar," and for good reason.

Oh, and seriously, don't whine about being asked to come as a particular job. When someone has just spent several of their own non-FFXI hours doing administrative tasks that could include updating points/attendance, maintaining a site and/or forums, calculating the monthly gil split for 30+ people, or reading up on strategies for a particular event where they need to not only learn their job, but the jobs that everyone else should be doing as well so they can give thorough instructions, or any other variety of tasks that need to be done, the very last thing on earth they want to do is get online to be bombarded with complaints about minor issues or requests for help with things that could easily be done on your own or through shout. Nobody considers that LS leaders need time of their own to play the game, because everyone has problems comprehending the fact that they alone are not the sole person in the universe who deserves consideration.

That said, not all leaders are that active or without help, but running a linkshell can be an overwhelming task. Nothing is more disappointing to your members than repeated failures that lose money, pop items, and time when those failures could have been avoided by being shrewd with your job selection. Endgame is just not a warm, fuzzy place and the fact is that some people are just not cut out for it. There's nothing wrong with that, it's just that successful events often require a level of performance and dedication that many people are not interested in and/or capable of putting forth.

And lastly, if you're not someone who enjoys endgame activities and linkshells, that's fine. Just realize that spending your time being bitter and nasty about people who are involved in that side of the game isn't doing yourself any favors. Stop moping, start your own chat/social LS, or LS that revolves around the activities you like and embodies what you think FFXI should be like. Nothing on this earth or any other is more pathetic than whining about how everything is terrible without doing anything at all to change your circumstances.

And don't use your *** to get ahead. Gives everyone else with *** a bad name when it goes sour, and it always does.

Make that +40 now.

Make that 41+

*** ignorant ***.

Its people like him that make the game miserable for others, please go die.

I can't find this '***' comment that you guys are talking about. Help me out please?

http://www.ffxiah.com/player.php?id=412623#home

Top comment.

Neg rep away!

Thank you very much, kind sir.

says the guy that everyone shits on cuz ur a troll who has a thing for dudes who wear jeans tighter than girls. LOL

in all honesty tho, my advice is the most realistic post here.. if its that hard to follow, end game just is not for the OP. end of story.

all those morals that everyone seems to be all for go out the window when u pick up an mmo, atleast with 90% of the people you find.

http://www.ffxiah.com/player.php?id=412623#home

I bet that you're one of the lowlife HNM tards that makes people post threads like this.

I can say for sure that I could not have gotten through my early FFXI days without the selfless help of so many players in my linkshell. Friendship is a precarious thing, but you know who your friends are (in this game, at least) when they're willing to spend 7 hours farming a key up for your final AF piece. :)

My advice: Find a good linkshell, and treat others as you'd want to be treated. Can't help out with the big stuff yet? Be willing to run little errands like checking prices on the AH, buying ingredients, raising, PLing, etc. I can't guarantee that you'll be treated with the same kindness you're willing to show, but even if 1% of the people you encounter are people with whom you've built a solid relationship with, I'd say your actions weren't wasted.

Also, try not to be a douchebag. Or a know-it-all. You have no idea how much that helps.

Wouldn't let me quote for some reason, but,

Bungie said, "says the guy that everyone shits on cuz ur a troll who has a thing for dudes who wear jeans tighter than girls. LOL

in all honesty tho, my advice is the most realistic post here.. if its that hard to follow, end game just is not for the OP. end of story.

all those morals that everyone seems to be all for go out the window when u pick up an mmo, atleast with 90% of the people you find."

Aren't you just someone to aspire to? /sarcasm. Just because a lot of people can be douchebags makes it okay for you to be one? Maybe that's your personal justification for throwing your morals out the window when you pick up this game, but it doesn't change who you are. Fact of the matter is if you have good morals you aren't going to screw with people in a game or otherwise.

Go back to the cool kid's club.

100% safe? I don't think so. The "players" may have diseases, and there's some kind of push for a permanent war economy... so, people die every day. It's just as much "dog eat dog" in the world as it is in MMOs.

"Real life" seems to be just as crappy as MMOs; they're both filled with delusional people who lack any morals, and its the asshats/psychotic ones that can afford any vertical mobility in the social strata.

As far as the graphics go, all I see when I go outside is a decaying suburbia. Nothing much to look at.

Sometimes you have to walk a little bit outside the decaying suburbia to find the good things. And not everyone is out to screw you over. But that is ultimately a choice you have to make. I chose to believe there are good people IRL as well as in the game, before becoming bitter, and I have been rewarded... but the moment you stop believing there's something better out there, you stop looking, and you stop seeing it.

No one says its easy and no one says that everyone is going to be nice to you or be your friend. But its worth it for the few that you find.

Ok something that really annoys me is people who take their time to look out for others only to be ignored for it.

Thats when i send the sarcastic "You're Welcome!" Tells.

Especially in Campaign, Yeh its everyone for themselves, but if you dont have RR and everyone feels the same, your screwed.

I just dont know why people find it acceptable to just let people go out of their way and use their time to help someone out, just to be ignored and un thanked.

Very rude and irritating.

You know, I find it strange that you would mention Campaign.

People thank me all the time when they ask for a cure, or a raise, or whatever when I'm doing Campaign...

And Asura is "supposed" to have the biggest *** on all servers....

Maybe people here have just had bad luck with others, and forget those who truly thank them for their time, and only focus on the negative aspects of humanity...

I remember when someone raised me once in Campaign, and got raped by the NM right after it.

Made me feel awful. :(

For the most part, with the exception of the emo drag and the troll, this has been as enjoyable a thread as I have ever read on this site. I've wondered how many people left on this game think like this, and with the exception of like...two people on my server, it saddened me to realize this train of thought has created a dying breed. So much so, I don't even log in anymore. xD It's nice to know that at the very least a FEW people still play FFXI for fun and a sense of unity.

The way I see it now, and have *ALWAYS* seen it is...this game is just not fun alone. And not fun if you're only goal is getting pixel armor that is worthless in life, and really will only depress you when you one day wake up and realize you spent five+ yers on a game that will one day shut down.

That said, I made that time worthwhile, just like you guys did. I laughed irl with online friends. I have met friends IRL because of FFXI (a few I still talk to), I will live the rest of my life knowing that even though it was a game, I supplied that same fuzzy feeling I got sometimes when I did things with friends, helped out strangers, played He-Man and saved somebody on PLD.

I will never forget my first week playing and having an alliance of 15 level 4s go in Horo Ruins and fight Gobbies. Or things like that. We play for laughs, not for a false sense of heirarchy, pride or online glory. (see: epeenorz). Because we have something better. Something 90% of selfish gear gobbling cockriders don't have. We have fun on a VIDEO GAME. Keep it up, guys. (b'A')b

/salute

directly to OP post *because I didn't read the 6 pages*

I been in about a dozen (4-5) end game shells and only one has actually been a dud (ok, maybe two), and guess what, I LEFT! There's no point in being in it even if its the "best linkshell" on the server. no point if your not having fun. The other few or so i have been in, ive enjoyed and made a dozen good friends out of each one (most of them i stay in til they break up or change shells). The linkshell I'm in right now (darkkrystal) is nice, they treat me right, and I have fun. I'm stuck red mage 99% of the time, but I actually like red mage, so its not a problem (see:avatar)!

Anyway, I could go on and on. Try server transferring, there's probably better things out there. When you are starting to dislike the game, something as small as a server change could make a whole new experience for you. This is what i did.

I am going on my thirteenth lv.75 job. If I joined an "established" hnmls right now, I am pretty certain I would be reduced to one job~or two at best. Being a person who has a multitude of job options, I don't like being type-casted as one particular job for every event. It's ***. I would rather be the "wild card" member who fills the holes, and in turn has relative freedom.

Now, some would say, "But, Ash!! RDM is the hole we need you to fill!"

--Bull--***--

I like playing RDM, but only as much as I like playing my other jobs. Most ls's will have their "prized mares" the inner-est circle of the inner circles of the most high. These will usually be your relics and almost always the people who get to play PLD and RDM/NIN. Those same people almost always have the job you will be "needed" as and they will rarely be seen on them themselves.

Then you have the sycophant career DD who get to fill that role every event. Yeah. Punish people for exping multiple jobs and allow people with only DD jobs and maybe a less useful support option or something to sit fat and happy.

Anyways, None of this was said in a spirit of whininess, but in a matter of fact apathy. If you cant handle being type-casted then you probably should retire from endgame, start your own shell, and or join a new shell before the inner-circle jerking begins.

I'm sick of being sick

These dynamics are true, but why do they happen and what is the solution?

I'll use an example from today, my LS (Happyending) did O2. For this fight, we needed 2 DD, 2 Tank, support, and the rest BLM. This was our first attempt at this fight, and this was the strategy we knew. We had only 16 people show up. Out of those 16, 1 has two DD jobs only, and the other has 1 DD job only. Guess who our two DD's are? There's no punishment here, it's just we can either take those two or cancel the event or lose. Options 2 and 3 are not acceptable.

So moving on, now we look at tanks. 3 of the possible PLD have serious MDB/MDT gear. 1 has BLM - we'll need him there. Of the remaining PLD's, none have the setup needed for PLD/rdm tanking (one doesn't have the sub, one doesn't have the gear, etc). The two tanks are therefore locked in place.

Now although it's true that the two tanks have RDM and BRD leveled, they clearly can't play those jobs. So we start looking to fill those holes, but first we have to make sure we have enough BLM since we can't even do the fight without that. Remember: we're down to 4/16 players already used up on job selection. Taking stock, we just barely have the 6 BLM we estimate that we can win with. All 6 of those are locked in place on BLM now since literally that's all the BLM we can muster, leaving 10/16 players used up. (The PLD who has to come BLM is counted in this mix.)

Of the remaining 6, the tank party needs a RDM, WHM, BRD, and the 5 x BLM party needs at least a RDM. This leaves 2 people. One of these needs to be a RDM or WHM to support the two DD's; of the two remaining, one has WHM. That leaves one person and since the party that person is in doesn't have refresh of any sort yet, and that person only has BRD to refresh with, they go bard.

Alliance makes itself right?

Well no, 'cause then I get 3 different tells about, "How come Suzy gets to come DRK again when I have to be on BLM and my DRK is better?". "How come so-and-so is on PLD and I'm on BRD when you know Jonny over there could cover you on PLD so that you can go BRD so that I can go on the job I want to play?" "How come certain people get to come as what they want but others can't?" Obviously it's inner-circle elitism, and not because Jonny can't handle it right now even though I know he's working on it, or because I need some sort of framework of people I can count on in key roles before I adapt others in, or because that guy who is always changing jobs actually goes from SAM to MNK to WAR - which barely means anything, but you going from BRD to WAR means everything. Or that guy falls asleep around a certain hour each night. Or that gal DC's twice a night at really bad times so she's better on a job we can afford to drop for a min randomly. Or that person is actually being dual-boxed so I need him on easy jobs he can handle 'cause we are short bodies. Or that person told me he has to go early because of RL reasons. Or ***you don't know about that I am dealing with over here, so please can you just not be so angry all the time and acting like we're trying to screw you?

It gets old. Trust your leaders to lead. If you don't, why are you in the shell? Or at least hold those types questions 'till later... and don't be hostile about it.

Anyway, the way I handle it is that when a person has a specific issue or request, "Can I not come on BLM tonight?", is this:
I'll try to make that happen as much as I can, even if it costs me crazy stress to shift 4 other people's jobs so you can not play BLM for 30 min in Einherjar. But... I won't do it if we won't win that way, and I won't do it if you don't ask for what you want in the first place.

What else can leadership do? People don't appreciate how much you have to take into account when setting up, or how much of a *** relief it is that there are people who will do the same job every time, and do it well. Well, some people don't - I think most people "get" that on some level, because why else wouldn't they be doing the job themselves? This is just a topic that has two sides to consider, and in my opinion both of them can be correct at the same time.

Happyending has a great crew, and considering we do all but things that require botting, we're pretty successful. We even manage to avoid sucking your soul away to accomplish anything. I'm not really bitching here, just offering some alternate perspective so people who read this might not feel so frustrated - people with both roles to fill.

I hate end game but love ffxi (and all other ffs). I never joined end game because it makes me want to punch a baby. But it turned people i knew WAYYYYY back when in to douches and *** because they were "elite". Now ive been playing FFXI since the start in US. I now have 3 kids and one on the way. I have spent 1/4 of my life playing this game. If i would have focused on end game because of how much i love this game i dont think i would still be married or have all the kids i do or have my own business. I put in many many hours in this GAME but when you join one of those shells it WORSE than a job. A job doesnt ask you to wake up all hours of the night. Waking up at 3 am for a min at a time every 30 min. and the shifts change depending on pop days and mobs and as the ls needs. there is NO reward for end game at all just fake satisfaction. Everything you want in end game someone else already has, or there is something just as good that takes less time to get and less people to get it. You want satisfaction get a better job, go to school, get a wife or go to the fing gym. Feel good about something that lasts because in 3 years when this game is 100% dead wtf do you have from the time you spent here? other than playing end game and being someones *** telling you what to do when to do it and how to play your job. You cant walk into a job interview and say "I learned my leadership skills from FFXI. get a life get a job get out of end game. :D ill be back after Christmas <3 daddy loves you

It's just bad game design that drives many to end up frustrated when attempting endgame. Sometimes when you play, you just wonder WTF they were on when they were thinking up some of the stuff they put in this game.