The Last Dance III: A Dancer's Guide *New*

Wearing a bunch of crit gear for TP is pretty overrated. It doesn't beat standard options for MNK and doubt it's any different for DNC.

Karambit are nice in Odyssey for trash and NM that are resistant to piercing damage.

Edit: I didn't go out of my way to make a crit set for them though.

I have a question about which Lustratio path you should use with Terpsichore's AM3 up. The OP on this guide suggests Lustratio Path A for Pyrrhic Kleos, but mythic aftermath is the only OaT that can proc on a weaponskill. If aftermath 3 is up wouldn't it be better to go with Lustratio path D instead of Path A? The difference is 6 less double attack, but 7 more strength and 23 more dex. I could see the head potentially still being better on the A path since it has a weaker path D augment, but lustratio +1 feet have a REALLY strong path D augment. And I'm curious if Terpsi's AM3 is enough to warrant an exception here.

Do you mean this for all jobs or just DNC specifically? They were just talking up a crit max tp white damage set for THF, why would it be overated? (Asking genuinely, not trolling)

edit: oh paged, is this in reference to H2H? Context, my mistake

THF has much better white damage than DNC so it's comparing apples to oranges. MNK already uses a bunch of crit gear in their standard TP sets already so IDK what is overrated about that because that's what they use and not only just for crits but meva / SB too. I don't think it would be worth using crit TP set for DNC like it would be for THF, different playstyle.

The "max damage" tp build you're referring to on the thief forms doesn't transition to dancer gameplay very well because not only does thief have a far higher triple attack rate, they also have synergistic job specific pieces (relic feet, cape, and neck, plus hetetroi ring) which boosts triple attack damage by 41%. As Crossbones said, thief's white damage capabilities exceed dancer's by a fair margin. Dancer is better at spamming weaponskills back to back, so it would rather go with the store TP rout than the crit rout. The two jobs just play differently is all.

(Still curious to know if any dancer experts could answer my question about lustraio path with terpsi aftermath up btw)

Yeah, wearing nothing but crit gear doesn't increase DPS and is pretty overrated. Some pieces like mummu hands and body can be considered, though

D should be better.

Thanks Simon, I appreciate it. I thought that would probably be the case, but I haven't had enough time with pyrrhic yet to feel comfortable making that assumption just off gut instinct. I'm definately looking forward to finishing Terpsi and seeing what it can do.

I should probably use my R15 Terpsi and DNC more, but too many jobs, too many daily farm >.>

Haven’t touched my r15 Terpsichore in months feels bad :(

Haha, I picked up dancer in anticipation of the whole "needing different jobs for Oddysey" thing because in my case I could use an extra job or two, and I'm thoroughly enjoying this one. Even if swapping jobs in the oddysey lobby never becomes a thing I'm glad to have it available. It has so much gear overlap between thief that I was only missing a few pieces anyway, and I just finished the artifact and relic upgrades so Terpsi is next on the radar. I can literally feel the difference between thief and dancer's playstyles too. Twashtar is a great weapon for both jobs, but thief definitely gets more out of the empyrean aftermath. Dancer really feels like it wants mythic aftermath up instead to help make up for the difference in attack rounds. I can already tell I'm going to enjoy terpsi when I finish it.

I have a max twash and r10 terp and everything else on my dnc is basically bis minus DM augs and the only time I play it is during rat ambu month. Then again I basically play rune brd or rdm 95% of the time in groups and rune brd rdm or thf outside of groups. I still think dnc is an amazing job but boy is it busy and there are only so many slots for dps.

I think terp is really fun to use especially with fan dance up (my default stance). You have basically unlimited tp and you can dps and cure all day. If they made changes to the debuff removal JA to make it aoe I think that would go a long way but that might be too OP.

Well, Contradance on that god awful timer basically ruins that AOE potential for Healing Waltz. I wouldn't even mind like, 1 minute re-use or whatever. It still requires you to take time away from dps to do other roles, so I feel like its a good tradeoff, since most groups will have a healer that prioritizes that anyways. Wouldn't be too broken imo.

Most people simply don't appreciate DNC. It get an even worse stigma than TH THF "why would you bring a DNC when I can bring a MNK". It's a very fun and busy job, I love it. I havent played it since Rat ambu either, wow....so sad :(

To be fair, Contradance is literally divine seal on half the cooldown. Although I suppose that should say more about the current state of divine seal than anything else. But dancer's status removal ability is meant to be a limitation, and I think it's ok for that to exist when its curing power is on par with a white mage. I mean, we literally have cure 4, 5 and 6 along with curaga 2 and 3 at our disposal. That's quite strong.

And as far as damage goes, my dancer's DPS is approximately 70-80% of what my thief's is, and that's really solid. I probably haven't even been playing it optimally either. Nor do I have Terpsicore yet, which I'm confident is a better main hand than Twashtar due to the different mechanics between the two jobs. I'm pretty sure with mythic added into the equation and more experience playing it I could close the DPS gap even further.

For what it's worth though, my dynamis group leader really wants to have a dancer on every run just because box step is so darn powerful of a debuff, and with presto we can cap its potency in 15 seconds. It's especially useful on content where geomancy effects are nerfed, and the rest of the group is in agreement on that. Dancer feels more cohesive than several of the jobs I've tried. I really like the whole package of support and offensive capabilities wrapped up into one. It's really solid, and a ton of fun to play. I'm really enjoying it.

I don't think Terpsi is better DPS than Twashtar. It's better utility and defensive weapon. Twashtar/Cento climactic Rudra is just too strong and DNC has highest skillchain bonus from all jobs, so not using it is a crime. Nothing beats Evis>Rudra>Rudra solo. Maybe in group if you can close darkness with Pyrrhic..

I think it's moreso the fact that I usually run content with groups where the melees just weaponskill spam and things melt. It's hard to skillchain on most things and trash mobs die from weaponskill damage alone. But I absolutely agree with you on the rest of your points. The skillchain potential is monstrous.

So I've finally made myself a Twashtar and am loving it. I'm curious though, What are the situations I'd want to use the normal TP set vs AM3-crit-focused set vs /war fencer set?

Im testing a lot today and using a lot of building flourish. I honestly see almost no damage improve on Pyrrhic Kleos with building flourish. Can someone else check if its really working?
One thing that comes to my mind is that im using /DRG. Maybe they somehow spaghetti coded DRG wsd triat taking priority above building flourish WSD bonus? I need to change sub and test a little more.

EDIT: Nah still barely any improve

Without
291TP return 48055
272TP return 41018

With building flourish
291TP return 49480
272TP return 42160

Doesnt look like 20% on all hits at all. Looks really close to 20% on first hit tho and tbh it felt like 20% on first hit since I came back in 2018. Maybe it was 20% on all hits forever ago. I would like to be mistaken, so feel free to check it yourself.

Sorry to barge in, but when was it ever applying on all hits?

I always knew that the WSD bonus applies only to the first hit, but the other bonuses (acc, att and Crit%) apply on all hits.

It's why Building Flourish is so nice with Tauret MH to spam Evisceration, no?
Instead of spending Finishing Moves on Climactic and Reverse flourishes, as you normally do when you want to spam Rudra, you just use Building Flourish and spend all FMs there, and spam Evisceration as much as possible.

That's how I always thought it worked honestly.

Pretty much every guide, video and sheet have it working for all hits XD

One of the most common shared strategy for using Terpsi is using building flourish for WSD bonus on Pyrrhic.

From this very thread


This is also BG wiki description.

Its all based on test done by Byrth in 2016 and it has been believed to be like that since then.

EDIT: I have a feeling this was changed from all hits to first hit in the same time they fixed that bug that was applying WSD from gear to all hits.

Hmm, that could be.
Odd that I was right by being... wrong. Strange coincidence lol

I thought there was some debate about whether or not building flourish applied wsd to every swing of multi hit too. In fact, on the first page of this thread in the comments malakef wrote



I remember some people questioned the outcome of that test and mentioned some other changes around the time he did it. I've been using building primarily with rudra's because of that understanding. However, with the addition of gleti's attire set the attack bonus applying to all hits on pyrric is a lot more relevant. If building enables you to utilize the full PDL limit on the set when you otherwise may not have then pyrric could stand to gain a fair amount of damage from it.

I doubt it. 25% attack bonus wont be enough to enable full PDL potential on Gleti's and even then the gain might not even be worth more than cost. Keep in mind that using building flourish require FMs. You need to somehow generate those FMs. You will ofc naturally make some using Box step, but you also need FMs for Climactic Flourish, because CF is just too good to ignore it even with Terpsi. Also using flourish is is at least 1sec delay and that delay leads to more damage loss than BF bonus would provide for Pyrrhic. There might be one scenario where BF could be used and thats when you are not engaged, but then it would also compete with Reverse flourish.

Slightly different subject, but I'm curious. Do you still think that 5/5 gleti's is good for tauret's evisceration spam then? You mentioned on the first day after getting the set that you thought it would replace other alternatives because of the PDL, but if you aren't capping attack other alternatives may be better. Admittedly thief's relic vest and artifact legs are better alternatives than dancer's meg vest +2 and lustratio subligar +1, but both use mummu wristbands which give a decent chunk of extra dex (and enable synergy with mummu ring). I like gleti's feet and head the most, but I'm still not sure if the other pieces are optimal or not. Gleti's does have a lot of attack on each piece though, and more so once you get the rank 5 augment. It's one of those situations where it's kind of hard to judge based on eyeballing the math.

Im in the middle of making video about Gleti's. Hopefully I will finish till tomorrow XD

I plan to retake my DNC and try to relearn how to play it. From what I've been reading, the TP set has changed. Is the one on the guide outdated? I have full Malignance Set and the set that is on the guide, what should I use? I'll probably use DNC for occasional ambus and Odysseys

Also, my daggers are Tauret/Aeneas R0 (planning to get Ternion+1 R15)

Anyone plug Gleti's Knife into a spreadsheet as an offhand option for Terpsichore? I'd love to see it compares with Twashtar.

I did, at attack cap Twashtar is still better than R20 Gleti's. Gleti's R20 is better than Twashtar for uncapped attack.

Here you can check my video about it and find updated sheet.

This is obviously anecdotal because I’m a dope and didn’t save my parser results...but I went out and tested Simon’s findings and can confirm that full Gleti’s is a nice size increase over a normal PK set. (At attack cap obviously)

Target: Dho Gates Apex Jagils/Crabs
DNC/WAR
Terp R13/Ternion r15

Buffs: Fury/Frailty (900 skill geo), honor/min/min, dia from korumoru, and lvl 10 sluggish daze. I believe this put me at attack cap for this target.

Noticed significant increase in PK damage going from “normal” PK set to the Gleti’s set. Maintained am3 the entire time and then had scoreboard report wsavg before resetting parse and changing set.

Normal set was averaging about 27k dmg, Gleti’s approx 30.5k dmg, which is very close to the 11% increase in PK damage Simon had in spreadsheet.