Jack Of All Trades: A Guide To Red Mage
Jack of All Trades: A Guide to Red Mage
I LOVE my offhand ternion dagger+1. With TA taeon and all the TA options we get, it fits very nicely.
Siren.Khary said: »
For meleeing, if you are main handing a sword, should you also offhand a sword or is it ok to offhand a Dagger? Does offhanding the dagger cause acc issues on the offhand?
Done so many spreadsheet combinations seeing if anything will compare.. nope...
Ternion +1!
1. Rdm has equal sword and dagger skill
2. 242skill va 228 is only: 12 acc 14att, and pretty much every 228 weapon has a lot of acc+ (which affects both hands) so in practice this just means ‘offhand att -14’
3. There’s an in depth discussion on offhand weapon choice a few pages back, only thing that’s changed is addition of raetic
Ternion+1 is great.
2. 242skill va 228 is only: 12 acc 14att, and pretty much every 228 weapon has a lot of acc+ (which affects both hands) so in practice this just means ‘offhand att -14’
3. There’s an in depth discussion on offhand weapon choice a few pages back, only thing that’s changed is addition of raetic
Ternion+1 is great.
How does Blurred Knife +1 compare to Ternion +1?
I was very close to pulling the trigger last time one came up on AH
I was very close to pulling the trigger last time one came up on AH
Bismarck.Arcos said: »
How does Blurred Knife +1 compare to Ternion +1?
I was very close to pulling the trigger last time one came up on AH
I was very close to pulling the trigger last time one came up on AH
I'm getting a ~4% difference with Ternion in the lead with my set.
Necro Bump Detected!
[54 days between previous and next post]
Hey all, I'm in the closing stages of gathering footage for an upcoming video guide on Red Mage.
I've done this a bunch of times in other forums and I've lurked here pretty often but is there anything you think new players to Red Mage absolutely need to know? I've already covered what I consider the essentials (Enhancing Duration, Frazzle II to Saboteur Frazzle III, subjob selection etc.) but I'd appreciate your input in case anything glaringly obvious has been missed.
Cheers.
I've done this a bunch of times in other forums and I've lurked here pretty often but is there anything you think new players to Red Mage absolutely need to know? I've already covered what I consider the essentials (Enhancing Duration, Frazzle II to Saboteur Frazzle III, subjob selection etc.) but I'd appreciate your input in case anything glaringly obvious has been missed.
Cheers.
Will you be filming a melee section?
tyalangan said: »
Will you be filming a melee section?
But I am going to emphasize that melee is second, if not third, to your typical duties on Red Mage.
I imagine job role selection, spell prioritization and which debuff to stack with sabateur based on the content being the key to play rdm well for new players.
I don't know if you covered spell prioritization so here's my thought:
One thing that I learned about spell prioritization is that sometimes it's not about what spell to cast, but what spell to omit from "waiting to cast" list. I bring rdm to ambuscade VD almost every month as main healer, compare with whm main heal, it's a hell lot busier on rdm since it's necessary to keep haste 2 up on everyone(v.s haste1 from whm isn't required with brd), and far too many debuffs that needs to keep up.
So eventually I just skip irrelevant spells or put them on lower priority to buy myself more time.
As a new player, I would say the toughest part would be knowing which spell makes bigger difference, which doesn't. And cast more important spell first. Which NM resists certain spell so hard that casting them is a waste of time, which spell can land easy.
Another thing to mention about spell prioritization is to communicate with geo and split the work load. Some spell cast by geo doesn't suffer from potency decrease.
And here's my thoughts about it, purely melee pt pov:
Dia3: I almost always prioritize this one first. More dmg more love.
Inundation: I only ever cast it if DD use different weapon type, and prioritize it if it's relevant.
Frazzle 2 + 3: I personally don't find this spell worth the time 80% of time, exception being important debuffs that must land, like silence on warlock and reaver in April 2018 ambu.
If NM has "down time" like invincible that DRK has time to cast extra absorb stat and not suffer from dps lose, maybe it's also nice to land frazzle before it. Its could be PITA to land absorb in VD without DS.
Silence: must cast on dangerous mage enemies. Since geo can cast it it's a nice spell to split with geo.
Distract3:I see a lot of people prioritize it, IMO it's not useless but far from important spells. Distract is useful that if NM has blind or Eva boost move, it helps with acc capping. If your DD sit at 92% acc or something it's also dps increase.
However it can be waste of time if DD 95% to 99% full time.
Para2: Great life saver since tp move and spell can be paraed.
Slow2:meh since majority of nm DMG came from tp move.
Addle2:useful with status ailment or magic DMG, and vice versa.
Regen2: regen is a great safety net spell on whm sch, more meh on rdm. Better than nothing but I put it on lower priority because of horrible potency.
Refresh3: People should cast this more on DRK, tbh. It's the difference between able to pop consume mana every min or not. Also useful on raetic WAR.
Poison2:lol. I only cast this if I'm bored.
Blind 1 or 2: lol no.
Accession en spell: Not so good with melee dps so low. Accession is better with na.
When it comes to crowd control:
New player should know Sleep -> sleep2 -> break or bind(in case break doesnt work) rotation. Also bind is great alternative to deal with charmed player if they are poisoned.
Bind lands on quite a bit of NM, so it could be useful "oh ***moment" spell.
GtavityII: I view it as a safety net spell for things that needs bind.
Since you covered SJ I think you have job role covered.
Hope that helps.
Edit: Also forgot to mention something new player should be aware of: for buff spells try not to cast them after it wears. Losing haste2 is huge dps decrease on DD, if DD lose haste2 when rdm is too busy to recast it kills pt dps.
Better to refresh important buff spells like haste 2 whenever there's time.
Edit2: Also worth mentioning that spell prioritization is case by case basis, depends on content and people. So new rdm needs to be somewhat flexible and observe, observe, observe.
I don't know if you covered spell prioritization so here's my thought:
One thing that I learned about spell prioritization is that sometimes it's not about what spell to cast, but what spell to omit from "waiting to cast" list. I bring rdm to ambuscade VD almost every month as main healer, compare with whm main heal, it's a hell lot busier on rdm since it's necessary to keep haste 2 up on everyone(v.s haste1 from whm isn't required with brd), and far too many debuffs that needs to keep up.
So eventually I just skip irrelevant spells or put them on lower priority to buy myself more time.
As a new player, I would say the toughest part would be knowing which spell makes bigger difference, which doesn't. And cast more important spell first. Which NM resists certain spell so hard that casting them is a waste of time, which spell can land easy.
Another thing to mention about spell prioritization is to communicate with geo and split the work load. Some spell cast by geo doesn't suffer from potency decrease.
And here's my thoughts about it, purely melee pt pov:
Dia3: I almost always prioritize this one first. More dmg more love.
Inundation: I only ever cast it if DD use different weapon type, and prioritize it if it's relevant.
Frazzle 2 + 3: I personally don't find this spell worth the time 80% of time, exception being important debuffs that must land, like silence on warlock and reaver in April 2018 ambu.
If NM has "down time" like invincible that DRK has time to cast extra absorb stat and not suffer from dps lose, maybe it's also nice to land frazzle before it. Its could be PITA to land absorb in VD without DS.
Silence: must cast on dangerous mage enemies. Since geo can cast it it's a nice spell to split with geo.
Distract3:I see a lot of people prioritize it, IMO it's not useless but far from important spells. Distract is useful that if NM has blind or Eva boost move, it helps with acc capping. If your DD sit at 92% acc or something it's also dps increase.
However it can be waste of time if DD 95% to 99% full time.
Para2: Great life saver since tp move and spell can be paraed.
Slow2:meh since majority of nm DMG came from tp move.
Addle2:useful with status ailment or magic DMG, and vice versa.
Regen2: regen is a great safety net spell on whm sch, more meh on rdm. Better than nothing but I put it on lower priority because of horrible potency.
Refresh3: People should cast this more on DRK, tbh. It's the difference between able to pop consume mana every min or not. Also useful on raetic WAR.
Poison2:lol. I only cast this if I'm bored.
Blind 1 or 2: lol no.
Accession en spell: Not so good with melee dps so low. Accession is better with na.
When it comes to crowd control:
New player should know Sleep -> sleep2 -> break or bind(in case break doesnt work) rotation. Also bind is great alternative to deal with charmed player if they are poisoned.
Bind lands on quite a bit of NM, so it could be useful "oh ***moment" spell.
GtavityII: I view it as a safety net spell for things that needs bind.
Since you covered SJ I think you have job role covered.
Hope that helps.
Edit: Also forgot to mention something new player should be aware of: for buff spells try not to cast them after it wears. Losing haste2 is huge dps decrease on DD, if DD lose haste2 when rdm is too busy to recast it kills pt dps.
Better to refresh important buff spells like haste 2 whenever there's time.
Edit2: Also worth mentioning that spell prioritization is case by case basis, depends on content and people. So new rdm needs to be somewhat flexible and observe, observe, observe.
Hey Rua, noob RDM here.
To me the most important part to learn for a new RDM, especially if new to mage jobs in general, is how to divide your debuffs.
How to create a spellmap associating every debuff with a different category (3? 4? I guess) and then creating specific sets to associate to each of those debuffs.
I mean there are so many stats you need to focus on to land debuffs, you need to strike a balance, and this balance changes according to the debuff because some stats might be useless for it.
I think this aspect is a key if you're trying to master the RDM job.
Also another very neat trick that I learned from Saevel and that might seem common sense but I would've never thought of it on my own, is the frazzle/distract one.
We're talking about a scenario when you already unlocked the T3 version of the spells.
To reduce the chances of wasting a Saboteur (since the JA gets wasted if for whatever reason you can't land the spell) first you land Frazzle2/Distract2 to check from the message wether F3/D3 are still up or not (Frazzle and Distract do not overwrite, but higher tier can overwrite lower tier). For this reason use custom macc-only-focused sets for Frazzle2 and Distract2.
Once you assessed the situation, use Saboteur and then shoot a Distract3 or Frazzle3 on the target, using your "regular" set for D3/F3 (which should have as much enf skill on it because of the potency tiers).
I mean, it's a pretty neat trick, I think it would be very useful for new RDMs to be instructed with tricks like this.
To me the most important part to learn for a new RDM, especially if new to mage jobs in general, is how to divide your debuffs.
How to create a spellmap associating every debuff with a different category (3? 4? I guess) and then creating specific sets to associate to each of those debuffs.
I mean there are so many stats you need to focus on to land debuffs, you need to strike a balance, and this balance changes according to the debuff because some stats might be useless for it.
I think this aspect is a key if you're trying to master the RDM job.
Also another very neat trick that I learned from Saevel and that might seem common sense but I would've never thought of it on my own, is the frazzle/distract one.
We're talking about a scenario when you already unlocked the T3 version of the spells.
To reduce the chances of wasting a Saboteur (since the JA gets wasted if for whatever reason you can't land the spell) first you land Frazzle2/Distract2 to check from the message wether F3/D3 are still up or not (Frazzle and Distract do not overwrite, but higher tier can overwrite lower tier). For this reason use custom macc-only-focused sets for Frazzle2 and Distract2.
Once you assessed the situation, use Saboteur and then shoot a Distract3 or Frazzle3 on the target, using your "regular" set for D3/F3 (which should have as much enf skill on it because of the potency tiers).
I mean, it's a pretty neat trick, I think it would be very useful for new RDMs to be instructed with tricks like this.
Also another thing that I see a lot of PUG RDMs are not considering is the difference between two basic DOTs like Dia and Bio.
Assuming you want to land a DOT at all, but that's another issue I guess.
Dia3 should be the higher priority if you have people doing meaningful physical damage.
If you're in a mage setup... why bother with Dia? At that point use Bio to reduce the Damage on the tank (and anybody else in range, like GEO?) instead of a spell like Dia which will increase the incoming physical damage on the target, with nobody dealing physical damage lol.
Oh and last but not least, emphasize that Addle isn't just useful for the Spell Casting Speed up, but also for the Macc down. At capped potency it's basically a mini-Vex.
Assuming you want to land a DOT at all, but that's another issue I guess.
Dia3 should be the higher priority if you have people doing meaningful physical damage.
If you're in a mage setup... why bother with Dia? At that point use Bio to reduce the Damage on the tank (and anybody else in range, like GEO?) instead of a spell like Dia which will increase the incoming physical damage on the target, with nobody dealing physical damage lol.
Oh and last but not least, emphasize that Addle isn't just useful for the Spell Casting Speed up, but also for the Macc down. At capped potency it's basically a mini-Vex.
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Addle 2 when geared is almost comparable to a Idris Vex(-125 ma eva vs addles 100.8) when it wasn't nerfed. When Saboteured with empy hands its around the ballpark of a bolstered Unerfed Idris vex. (250 vs addles2 225.8) Thats only going to get better as empy gets +3ed in future and possibly more enfeeble+ gear comes out. It poops on w/e vex and attunement puts out these days and its hardly anything.
Impact is also a great debuff to put on stuff as well
Impact is also a great debuff to put on stuff as well
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Ah, I saw that the BG Wiki had Addle II's "cap" at 70 but that's before Enfeebling Magic Effect+.
Makes sense. Addle II is absurdly good.
Makes sense. Addle II is absurdly good.
I thought Addle II was a -50 macc fixed value plus whatever bonus you can get from the dMND (cap at 20 when you're 100 MND above the target's)
That's a grand total of -70.
Where do you get the bonus to reach the -100.8 Macc value you're talking about?
Enfeebling Magic Potency? But there's only a total of +40 that I can think of (Relic+3 feet, Regal Gem, AF3+2 body, Ambu cape).
Even saying that it works with Addle II (has it ever been tested?) and saying it's a 40% bonus, it would be ~98 Macc, not 100.8.
I guess I'm missing something here, but what?
That's a grand total of -70.
Where do you get the bonus to reach the -100.8 Macc value you're talking about?
Enfeebling Magic Potency? But there's only a total of +40 that I can think of (Relic+3 feet, Regal Gem, AF3+2 body, Ambu cape).
Even saying that it works with Addle II (has it ever been tested?) and saying it's a 40% bonus, it would be ~98 Macc, not 100.8.
I guess I'm missing something here, but what?
I'm thinking from the Enfeebling Magic Potency, which is calculated as a % increase after all other calculations.
Assuming 70 as the baseline after dMND and optimal set.
44% of 70 is 30.8 (30 since SE typically rounds down?).
70 + 30 = 100.
Assuming 70 as the baseline after dMND and optimal set.
44% of 70 is 30.8 (30 since SE typically rounds down?).
70 + 30 = 100.
Oh yeah my math was wrong because I assumed Sayon at 10% like the old AF3+2 version.
Ok but that's assuming it works on Addle II and assuming it works on the final number (including the dMND bonus).
Granted it wouldn't be particularly easy to test alas, it wouldn't be the first enfeebling magic spell that doesn't benefit from the Enf potency bonus, would it?
Either way this is beyond the purpose of Rua's original question (that is: things we think would be very useful to put in a RDM video guide, thinking about players new to the job), sorry for carrying this way too off topic then, but it got me curious now!
Ok but that's assuming it works on Addle II and assuming it works on the final number (including the dMND bonus).
Granted it wouldn't be particularly easy to test alas, it wouldn't be the first enfeebling magic spell that doesn't benefit from the Enf potency bonus, would it?
Either way this is beyond the purpose of Rua's original question (that is: things we think would be very useful to put in a RDM video guide, thinking about players new to the job), sorry for carrying this way too off topic then, but it got me curious now!
Remember Sab is heavily nerfed on NM's, so assume only 25% of it's effect.
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Asura.Cicion said: »
Addle 2 when geared is almost comparable to a Idris Vex(-125 ma eva vs addles 100.8) when it wasn't nerfed.
Those numbers are accurate for post-nerf Idris, and Addle is not really amazing, but can be helpful if you're trying to resist multiple elements or without carols.
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In certain situations it's very useful to have a macro for dropping composure so you don't get the slowcast/recast penalty.
Windower makes this very easy with the cancel addon, but it can also be done manually. I'll generally use composure to get self buffs up, then drop it for other buffs. A perfect enhancing set doesn't benefit from the Empy Composure bonus anymore, so you don't need composure for buffs on other people if you've got a really good enhancing duration set.
Windower makes this very easy with the cancel addon, but it can also be done manually. I'll generally use composure to get self buffs up, then drop it for other buffs. A perfect enhancing set doesn't benefit from the Empy Composure bonus anymore, so you don't need composure for buffs on other people if you've got a really good enhancing duration set.
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Do you mean that the difference is small enough that you can afford to use a non-composure duration set?
Or did you mean that perf enha duration set is better than composure-based set regardless?
Because if it's the latter I think you're wrong and the best set for duration on targets other than self is a mixture of 4/5 AF3 119 and then the other items.
Or did you mean that perf enha duration set is better than composure-based set regardless?
Because if it's the latter I think you're wrong and the best set for duration on targets other than self is a mixture of 4/5 AF3 119 and then the other items.
The advantage of the first set, is it doesn't rely on having a buff that also gives you a +25% recast on the spell.
Edit:
First Set:
ItemSet 358731
Colada +4 Enhancing Duration
Telchine +10 Enhancing Duration
Ghostfyre +20 Enhancing duration
Haste II: Duration 200 seconds (JP spent on enhancing duration)
Expected duration: 8:24 seconds
floor(floor(200 * 1.75) * 1.44)
Second Set:
ItemSet 358732
Colada +4 Enhancing Duration
Ghostfyre +20 Enhancing Duration
Haste II: Duration 200 seconds
Expected duration: 8:54 seconds
floor(floor(floor(200 * 1.60) * 1.24) * 1.35)
You're right, there is a big difference in duration. I must have calculated something wrong or something.
Edit2: Correct numbers used
Aside from AF2+3 body which I still don't have, those are the same exact sets I use and yes, for buffing others the second is better than the first (with Composure up, of course).
That's like what, 35 seconds of difference in Haste2? Not really a big deal if you ask me, so your point of buffing others with composure down still stands.
I'm lazy, but when you have to keep haste2 up on too many targets I agree that putting composure down after buffing yourself might be a smart idea, the cooldown on Haste2 (it's like what, 9 seconds with Composure up?) is very annoying.
I actually need to keep this in mind myself because I feel sometimes I'd gladly give up those 35 seconds to get <4 secs recast on Haste2.
edit:
Granted I still don't have AF2+3 body so those 35 seconds would be a bit more in my case, atm, but still the logic behind what you said still stands true.
That's like what, 35 seconds of difference in Haste2? Not really a big deal if you ask me, so your point of buffing others with composure down still stands.
I'm lazy, but when you have to keep haste2 up on too many targets I agree that putting composure down after buffing yourself might be a smart idea, the cooldown on Haste2 (it's like what, 9 seconds with Composure up?) is very annoying.
I actually need to keep this in mind myself because I feel sometimes I'd gladly give up those 35 seconds to get <4 secs recast on Haste2.
edit:
Granted I still don't have AF2+3 body so those 35 seconds would be a bit more in my case, atm, but still the logic behind what you said still stands true.
Yeah, I know what I did. I failed to subtract 15 from 83 and I got 58 instead of 68. If you do the empy calculation with 58% for regular duration it comes out to the exact same time as the non-composure set.
Cerberus.Shadowmeld said: »
Yeah, I know what I did. I failed to subtract 15 from 83 and I got 58 instead of 68. If you do the empy calculation with 58% for regular duration it comes out to the exact same time as the non-composure set.
My only idea was maybe you were thinking RDM got x4 2% Bonuses via JPs but they don't and only get x4 enhancing skill+.
Yeah, I'm apparently bad at math all around yesterday. I'm actually off by 10% and I was doing 18% on Hands.... lol
Nice to know for your video, and don't forget to speak about the role of the RDM, mostly i love the job because of its a master of backup (heal, nuke, dd and sometime tank).
is dwspair armor still best ws set? Stats seem pretty high.
I'd have to plug in and compare body/legs relic vs jhakri but quick look would be (barring super high DM chironic):
Relic+3 head/body/legs
Jhakri+2 hands/feet
capped attack jhakri hands -> AF+3
Relic+3 head/body/legs
Jhakri+2 hands/feet
capped attack jhakri hands -> AF+3
alright. i forgot to mention that i just started divergence, so relic+3 is a bit off. so i guess then its between jhakri and despair?
Ran spreadsheet with uncapped vs capped on Savage Blade:
Jhakri vs. Viti. (the not so obvious slots):
Viti. Tabard +3: wins in both scenarios even with the lower STR
Viti. Tights +3: loses in both scenarios. The Jhakri Slops' STR out powers the attack in uncapped even.
Viti. Boots +3: loses in uncapped but ties capped (with my set remember)
Jhakri vs. Despair (only head should compete with jhakri):
Despair Helm: wins in capped, loses in uncapped
Some of these are VERY minor boosts (I'm talking less than a percent) but the good news is that you will be wanting the Viti. body and boots anyway so it's multi use which is great to see.
Jhakri vs. Viti. (the not so obvious slots):
Viti. Tabard +3: wins in both scenarios even with the lower STR
Viti. Tights +3: loses in both scenarios. The Jhakri Slops' STR out powers the attack in uncapped even.
Viti. Boots +3: loses in uncapped but ties capped (with my set remember)
Jhakri vs. Despair (only head should compete with jhakri):
Despair Helm: wins in capped, loses in uncapped
Some of these are VERY minor boosts (I'm talking less than a percent) but the good news is that you will be wanting the Viti. body and boots anyway so it's multi use which is great to see.
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