The Parthenon: A Warrior's Kyklos

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The Parthenon: A Warrior's Kyklos
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By Spaitin 2019-05-09 15:01:47  
Lili said: »
There's the usual problem of ambuscade +2: you can only get 15 fibers/metals per month (provided you get enough points), so all of those sets are going to take at least 2 months to build, if you don't already have the armor or the materials, and provided you can spam enough ambuscade to get all of it in the first place.
That isnt correct. You can get 2 +2 sulevia and 2 +2 flamma a month. so you can get almost all of this in a single month. Just checked with the NPC. can get 20 fiber and 20 metal total. so you can get the majority of this set. 10 each from gallantry, 5 each from hallmarks and 5 each from total hm. So only the set with the flamma body would take 2 months.
[+]
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By Lili 2019-05-09 16:05:30  
Spaitin said: »
10 each from gallantry, 5 each from hallmarks and 5 each from total hm. So only the set with the flamma body would take 2 months.

Totally true, I forgot the 5 from total hallmarks. Still need to do enough ambuscade, which for a returning player might not be easy, unless he has another job and/or friends to carry him through enough runs/sealed D-VD, but it's far more realistic in the short term.
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By CerberusFreaky 2019-05-10 02:37:13  
so, putting together an upheaval set now that I have Chango.

This is what I got so far
ItemSet 366620

TP set as follows
ItemSet 366621
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By Lili 2019-05-10 07:16:06  
CerberusFreaky said: »
This is what I got so far

Fotia does next to nothing for Upheaval. Change neck and waist to war beads and Ioskeha in your WS set.

Your TP set is not bad, tho a Valorous Mail with DA5 augment would be an improvement over relic body.
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By CerberusFreaky 2019-05-10 16:21:20  
Lili said: »
CerberusFreaky said: »
This is what I got so far

Fotia does next to nothing for Upheaval. Change neck and waist to war beads and Ioskeha in your WS set.

Your TP set is not bad, tho a Valorous Mail with DA5 augment would be an improvement over relic body.

Made the changes to WS set, I appreciate the input.
However, I don't like valorous body. For one, Relic has the same double attack, my set allows for a 5hit (or WS and 4hit) and have plenty of TP. Relic adds tons of acc and attack and magic evasion and magic def bonus.
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By Lili 2019-05-10 17:17:21  
CerberusFreaky said: »
However, I don't like valorous body. For one, Relic has the same double attack, my set allows for a 5hit (or WS and 4hit) and have plenty of TP. Relic adds tons of acc and attack and magic evasion and magic def bonus.

I know what you mean, and I have been debating for a long time about Valorous body vs Relic body - it seemed to me the latter was greatly underrated. However, as it turns out the 3 stp on Valorous Mail is what lets you change Telos to Brutal, and get 100% Double Attack while keeping x-hit, which is a lot better than one might think at first glance.

For accuracy:
Relic body is 35 DEX and 50 accuracy.
Valorous Mail is 25 DEX and 20 Accuracy base, plus augments. My Valorous has DEX 7, Accuracy 18, Attack 14, DA 5, which puts it at 32 DEX and 38 accuracy, so only a 14ish loss in accuracy as compared to Relic Body. This varies with augments ofc, but it's not going to be too far off.
Keep in mind that 100% DA set with R15 Chango and master WAR is 1272 accuracy... It's not like you'll be starved for accuracy on anything with that base.

Attack is not really something we are starved for lol. It might help a bit in low buff situations, but really not by much.

Sadly, he added Meva is not really as valuable as it might look like. Relic has 84, Valorous has 59, it's 25 more Meva and it's doing close to nothing - probably even nothing at all tbh. Now, if you make an high meva set that includes other AF/Relic pieces, things start to improve a bit...

Not that the set itself is bad, it's certainly functional, but Valorous + Brutal is going to be an improvement in WS damage for your standard TP set. Relic body+Telos+Regal Ring is best suited for a mid-tier accuracy set imo.

One big upside of your set is that it lets you avoid Oseem, which depending on how patient you are is an entirely valid reason to completely avoid Valorous :P
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By CerberusFreaky 2019-05-11 02:40:43  
Yea im 5/5 Valorous, but... never bothered to mess with them.
May I see your TP set?
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By Lili 2019-05-11 08:30:30  
I use what most everybody else uses around here, the 100% DA set that has been posted earlier in the thread:

ItemSet 350357

You can swap things around a bit depending on what's going on:
- if you have Fighter's roll on, you can swap in Relic legs +2/3 and Telos for more white damage
- you can put any other store tp ring instead of Flamma Ring, but Flamma gives some nice extra stats due to set bonus.
- Regal Ring is if you need the accuracy.
- the 3% TA ring is also an option
keep in mind that swapping store tp rings is situational, since removing the 5 stp in that slot means that you'll often land at 998 TP or around there. Good if you're soloing (Retaliation procs), are using store tp food, or have samurai roll, otherwise it's kind of a bummer.
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By CerberusFreaky 2019-05-11 22:23:15  
Gonna need to invest in a +2 neck, all other gear pieces I have, and of course a valorous body that is worth a ***.

Thanks so much for posting this.
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By Lili 2019-05-12 16:34:12  
+2 neck is amazing for so many things, you won't regret it.

You're welcome. Now come back to Cerb, Paoja feels lonely now that you guys all left!
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By CerberusFreaky 2019-05-13 00:52:34  
Million Dollar Question, Upheaval better with double attack - triple attack for BIS, or WSD?

And tell Paoja I'll come back to cerberus so he can chase me around omen to try to teleport me out of there >.>
 Asura.Yso
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By Asura.Yso 2019-05-13 01:06:42  
ItemSet 356900

This is what I use. Odyssean has DM aug WSD of >8%. Can swap fotia for beads +2 and Ioskeha +1.
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By Taint 2019-05-13 06:16:46  
CerberusFreaky said: »
Million Dollar Question, Upheaval better with double attack - triple attack for BIS, or WSD?

And tell Paoja I'll come back to cerberus so he can chase me around omen to try to teleport me out of there >.>


Low TP MA is better. Over 2k WSdmg is better. With Chango your obviously over 2000 with a just a bit of overflow.
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By CerberusFreaky 2019-05-13 11:22:15  
Lili said: »
I use what most everybody else uses around here, the 100% DA set that has been posted earlier in the thread:

ItemSet 350357

You can swap things around a bit depending on what's going on:
- if you have Fighter's roll on, you can swap in Relic legs +2/3 and Telos for more white damage
- you can put any other store tp ring instead of Flamma Ring, but Flamma gives some nice extra stats due to set bonus.
- Regal Ring is if you need the accuracy.
- the 3% TA ring is also an option
keep in mind that swapping store tp rings is situational, since removing the 5 stp in that slot means that you'll often land at 998 TP or around there. Good if you're soloing (Retaliation procs), are using store tp food, or have samurai roll, otherwise it's kind of a bummer.

Ok, I understand the need for 100% double attack set...
Neck 7, Brutal 5, Cessance 3, Val Body 7, Sule hand 6, cape 10, belt 9, legs 11, feet 9 = 67%
Gifts and traits 28%
That gives me 95 double attack, so where is the other 5 percent?
I know Flamma head gives 5 triple attack... does that count (add itself) towards the 100%? Or do people use BOii +1?
 Asura.Nuance
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By Asura.Nuance 2019-05-13 11:47:48  
Merits
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By CerberusFreaky 2019-05-13 12:03:58  
Asura.Nuance said: »
Merits

SOB, you are 100% right!!!! Thanks.
 Fenrir.Kaldaek
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By Fenrir.Kaldaek 2019-05-15 11:46:00  
Lili said: »
I use what most everybody else uses around here, the 100% DA set that has been posted earlier in the thread:

ItemSet 350357

You can swap things around a bit depending on what's going on:
- if you have Fighter's roll on, you can swap in Relic legs +2/3 and Telos for more white damage
- you can put any other store tp ring instead of Flamma Ring, but Flamma gives some nice extra stats due to set bonus.
- Regal Ring is if you need the accuracy.
- the 3% TA ring is also an option
keep in mind that swapping store tp rings is situational, since removing the 5 stp in that slot means that you'll often land at 998 TP or around there. Good if you're soloing (Retaliation procs), are using store tp food, or have samurai roll, otherwise it's kind of a bummer.

What's the augments on the body look like? Should I shoot for DA or DM augments with QA?
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By Lili 2019-05-15 13:21:16  
Fenrir.Kaldaek said: »
What's the augments on the [Valorous] body look like? Should I shoot for DA or DM augments with QA?

DA5 is what lets you have 100% Double Attack, and it is "easily" attainable year round with Fern stones, and doesn't take too long to get. Ideally with some Accuracy and DEX, but not too necessary since that set is not starved for accuracy anyway.

QA... imo it's not as great as it was before we could get 100% DA, especially if you only have it on body. If you also get it on head and hands then it's a different beast, but personally I'm keeping my da5 body and am trying DM augments on a separate body and head.

EDIT: What QA does is basically give you a change to WS immediately just one melee round after the previous WS. With 100% DA, you are guaranteed to never WS more than 2 melee rounds after previous WS.

When you give up 5 DA for some amount of QA, let's sat 3%, you gain 3% chance of WS > round > WS, in exchange of having to wait more than 2 melee rounds 4.6ish% of the time (adjusted for QA->TA->DA proc). And since DA is not capped anymore, suddenly you also gained a chance of having to wait 4 rounds before next WS... or more if you're really unlucky.

If you have 3 QA also on Head slot (instead of the 5 TA of Flamma) then the math starts to be more favourable, and Samurai roll changes things around a bit... but, personally, I did not find the tradeoff worth, as I prefer consistency, plus the unreliability of getting QA in the first place. The choice is ultimately yours.
 Valefor.Yandaime
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By Valefor.Yandaime 2019-05-15 13:28:25  
Fenrir.Kaldaek said: »
Lili said: »
I use what most everybody else uses around here, the 100% DA set that has been posted earlier in the thread:

ItemSet 350357

You can swap things around a bit depending on what's going on:
- if you have Fighter's roll on, you can swap in Relic legs +2/3 and Telos for more white damage
- you can put any other store tp ring instead of Flamma Ring, but Flamma gives some nice extra stats due to set bonus.
- Regal Ring is if you need the accuracy.
- the 3% TA ring is also an option
keep in mind that swapping store tp rings is situational, since removing the 5 stp in that slot means that you'll often land at 998 TP or around there. Good if you're soloing (Retaliation procs), are using store tp food, or have samurai roll, otherwise it's kind of a bummer.

What's the augments on the body look like? Should I shoot for DA or DM augments with QA?
You’ll want DA Augments. Enough to give the body 7% in total and hopefully a good chunk of ACC in there too. Apparently Multi-Attack rates do not directly diminish Single-Attack rates (meant to test, never got the chance) so hitting 100% DA is what’s most important. If you get a DM Augment with the necessary DA as well as TA or QA? Even better.

Or would the DA Nix the other Multi’s as well? Hmmm...

Random question: what’s the BIS Upheaval setup right now?
 Fenrir.Kaldaek
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By Fenrir.Kaldaek 2019-05-15 13:36:13  
Thanks all. Im already sitting on a acc26 da5 body... guess i dont have to waste my DM rolls lol
[+]
 Valefor.Yandaime
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By Valefor.Yandaime 2019-05-16 08:23:53  
Asura.Yso said: »
ItemSet 356900

This is what I use. Odyssean has DM aug WSD of >8%. Can swap fotia for beads +2 and Ioskeha +1.


I distinctly remember a discussion about Fotia Belt vs Ioshka +1 for Upheaval some time ago and iirc, it was ruled that Fotia’s fTP boost to the first hit would add more damage than off-hand hits from DA procs? Has this changed? Or am I mistaken?

For the case of the War. Beads +2, I agree and lean towards Beads because the Acc is better and there’s a very nice fSTR boost.

But Fotia vs Ioshka? I feel like it’s a wash? But with Fotia there’s that 1% chance of Free WS (very rare but awesome when it happens)
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By Spaitin 2019-05-17 17:02:52  
if it is a wash, go for the one with more acc.

Also, that convo was before r15 iirc.
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