Bravura/Ukon

Well its never wrong to mix and use different weapons. I just dont like the WAR's these days who equip Uko and think their so godly to just spam Ukko's Fury and not try procing. Wiped to a few shout groups that did Provenance Watcher and a couple of VW tiers because of that so I ended up sticking to my Bravura and benefiting my alliance instead of just dealing high damage. I'm not saying MT is stronger than Ukko Fury but it's definitely more beneficial.

Sadly, as Byrth quoted, the DEF Down effect from MT doesn't always land (and is likely to land less and less when dealing with higher level content), so the whole ideal of benefitting the whole alliance shrinks down to relying on the Eva Down procing.

The weapon itself is more beneficial to the user than to anyone else thanks to the Accuracy Boost, but as soon as you cap your accuracy it will rapidly fall behind Ukon.

That being said, both weapons are awesome and there should be no big shame in choosing either of them as opposed to some AH piece or stuff.

there is no shame but dont try to justify to me MT dmg taken benefitting the alliance because you have -20% dmt taken.. when any dd can have this if they actually gear swap..

as sheelay said the proc rate on the wep is crap. So it is not a alliance help because it barely procs on anything worth while.

As for ukon wars just spammin ukkos and not procing... those people are indeed morons, morons trying to win a parse and having 60% acc probably.... that has nothing to do with the weapon its the user.

The problem with bravura imo is it simply isnt unqiue, everything it does is done through some else, be it a warriors own ws (full break)
or dmg taken (gear) it just allows the user to have a better dmg taken set by adding a coupla haste pieces... but really... that aint a massive difference is it.

It certainly isnt a bad weapon far from it... but don't try and big it up to a standard that it simply isnt.

Bravura's hybrid TP/PDT is a good difference as opposed to Ukon's (unless you possess a dring/phos+1) if you utilized such sets (yes there are such situations) you'd know.

If there's one area I see Relics holding a clear advantage, it's turtlemode Legion. I'm in no position to speak for the strategy itself, but if you've got Metatron or Catastrophe up, your hybrid PDT/Haste/LegionAcc set will fare much better. Not only will the Relic go a long way on your Acc requirement, but those two AMs will cover some of your hybridization goals as well. I haven't seen a truly exemplary Bravura user, but the exemplary Apoc user I do some turtlemode Legion with does quite well for himself. Speaking as an Ukon user, it's damn hard to get enough Acc, PDT, and Haste in one set.

Then again, one more Acc buff to cater to Empy/Mythic users and the story could be quite different.

I'm not quite sure if your implying I don't know what a PDT MDT set is and that I do not use one...

I sincerley hope not...

This is correct and is one of the few scenarios where bravura is unbeatable. The few times where you don't PD a wave bravura will really pull ahead because of the ability to cap haste and pdt and still not lose a hit in your build.

Sadly, given the current strategies its very rare.

On another note, while I have read the research on def down, we really still don't know much about how often or when it procs. I have seen it proc on high end content (Odinv2) but its hard to really test. All the testing was done in 2010 wonder if now with the test server we could come up with a better understanding.

-Legion
-Meebles

Can throw in Odin II aswell, but he isn't particularly dangerous like the former.

-Non-PD Legion: (is getting more common now, due to preparation for the PD nerf) pretty much requires a Hybrid TP/PDT set (we are not talking your standard PDT set) or you risk getting decimated by each mobs "powerful" auto attack.

-Meebles: Most the bosses employ some dangerous abilities, I'd definately argue Bravura's utility (and apoc's) here.

What would a Ukon hybrid TP\PDT set look like vs Bravura for Legion?

[itemset]276148[/itemset
(Assuming 6 PDT on both dark rings, two PDT on both earrings, theres also a PDT ammo which idr name of. --Not including Dring/Phos+1)

[itemset]240776[/itemset]
(Assuming 6 PDT on both dark rings)



May need to quote me to see sets, I seem to have a problem posting this, aswell as quoting people.

and just noticed you said legion, so on the ukon PDT you'd probably be taking out a few pieces out of the already-not-capped PDT, for accuracy.

While Bravura rides 50 DT with little sacrifice.

Can use Phorcys Salade instead of mekira-oto too, you'll still cap haste, and gain some accuracy allready.

ah yeah

Or you could use Scherzo and TP without using a DT set instead of sacrificing a ton of gear haste/attack/acc.

Doesn't it wear off once it negates an attack, like migawari?

No, and if you stack it with Earthen Armor (and have a 99 G-horn), you can mitigate 95% of the damage of attacks that do >75% of your HP. As long as you can keep people above 75% HP and heal them quickly they essentially can't die.

The whole deal on this page goes back to knowing when to press a button or two and gear swap from an efficient TP set to a PDT or MDT built to take the hit.

As fun as it may be to be able to cap haste along with DT when under the effect of MT's aftermath, it is far from the ideal set you'd want to be TPing, and its' utility is cornered by the simple fact one can swap gear according to the situation.

It's not too far from that "Fulltime WS gear" meme.

Making a hybrid -DT/TP set is more reasonable than it used to be because so many of the monsters we fight have true AoE melee attacks. Harpys in Mul have a spinny melee attack (not a TP move) that's 360-degree AoE and does like 1200-1500 damage without mitigation. Mantis type monsters have a jumping attack that's also true AoE, and iirc Gallu type mobs have one that's true AoE as well. The reason I'm saying "true" AoE is because there's also so many conal melee attacks these days. It's not reasonable to swap between your DT and TP set every time the monster takes a melee swing, so it makes sense to make a hybrid set unless you're going to Scherzo and rely on good healing.

I would just Scherzo and rely on healing, because the loss of one minuet is less than the sacrifices even Bravura makes for their DT TP set.

As far as I've heard there's allready barely enough time in Legion, so yeah I always thought hybrid sets sounds better than they probably perform in action.

how much are you reducing with just a ghorn BRD?

you also didn't mention the Naraka's 4 hit thrust regular attack, and Gallu's triple punch (both regular attacks) which can do alot of damage too. Think the gallu was doing 1,600~1,800 triple punches non-MS. If you were at a too low HP, or a quick follow-up, don't think Scherzo alone is going to save you.

The sacrifice of DPS is picked up by the RNGs.

G-horn BRD (with AF3+2 feet) is -50% damage taken for attacks over 75% of your HP, so the 1800 damage triple punch would do 900 damage. Survivable.

Well it sounds good, on paper.

I did it last night. It went well.

God, for ***like that I really wish I were'nt a taru >_>

Scherzo/EA kinda remove some of the danger of being taru, in that a 1400 HP Taru WAR can be maximally hit for 74% damage before Scherzo procs (1036 damage, leaving 364 HP) while a 1700 HP Elvaan WAR can be maximally hit for 74% damage before Scherzo procs (1258 damage, leaving leaving 442 HP). Now, most melee hits in Mul are going to do >442 damage. It doesn't matter what your race is because you're dead either way without a cure. The real problem is being two-shotted with hits for 50% of your HP, because maybe an elf could survive while a taru couldn't. I transitioned our taru DDs (myself an a Ryunohige DRG) to Scholar in preparation for this strategy because it is higher risk.

With Earthen Armor and Scherzo, you could literally tank every monster in that zone while weakened without PDT gear. 2000 damage hit? You'd take 100 damage. Every hit would proc Scherzo. The problem is that Weakness gives 100% Slow and no one has 400 HP without it, lol.

Purposely weakened hundred-fists monk?

Heh, yeah. But if you're using a 2-hour you might as well be using PD.

Sept then you have a monk for the other waves, which does more damage then adding another Smn.

Edit:

Or just use it as a contingency.

Edit again to be on topic:

Is there any leeway gained with an Xhit using Bravura over Ukon? It's only a 6 delay difference so I imagine it doesn't...

That 6 delay is the difference between 13 and 13.2 base TP, and Bravura uses a 4-hit WS instead of a 2-hit WS, so it should be easier to 5-hit it than Ukon. I don't know if it's worth it, but there's definitely leeway gained.