The Beast Within -- A Guide To Blue Mage

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2010-06-21
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The Beast Within -- A Guide to Blue Mage
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 Ragnarok.Creaucent
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By Ragnarok.Creaucent 2024-11-04 08:09:25  
Phoenix.Iocus said: »
I'm looking at Delta Thrust for landing Plague with Efflux. Is there any significant difference between Dignitary's Earring and Njordr Earring?

Is 10 m.acc basically the same as 10 blue magic skill for landing additional effects? Everything else about the dignitary earring is better other than defense.


--
Follow up question for the same scenario is a maxed Aurist or Cornflower better for landing additional affects on physical blue magic?

R15 Aurist's would be better than Cornflower since its macc/acc+33 vs Macc+30(combined skill and macc), acc+7 dex+5.

What are you using for the other earring and do you have a Hashishin Earring +1?

ItemSet 397257

In that set you have the options of Crepuscular earring or Dignitary's earring and if you dont have Hashishin +1/2 you can use both of them.
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 Phoenix.Iocus
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By Phoenix.Iocus 2024-11-04 16:55:44  
Yeah I have a maxed Hashi+1. It's a very nice piece for only being +1.
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By Nariont 2024-11-04 21:44:19  
One thing to consider with delta is throwing in some subtle blow to minimize the tp given when you use the spell
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 Phoenix.Iocus
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By Phoenix.Iocus 2024-11-04 21:49:16  
Does Physical Blue magic give 100 tp per hit or some derived number from weapon delay? So more hits = more tp feed or is it static?
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By Nariont 2024-11-04 21:54:31  
100 tp per hit, so youre feeding 300~ tp to plague 1300~2k overtime(assuming no resists) with no sb

Chirch rings, relic gloves are some pretty hefty sb dumps
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By Shichishito 2024-11-05 01:38:29  
Dignitary's earring (10macc/acc 5 subtle blow) also fits in a delta thrust set, unfortunately I already use it in engage sets on the other ear but if you can incorporate it into your sets without clashing with engaged/idle/defense swaps it should fit perfectly. You lose out on some MACC but Can cap subtle blow I with just those 4 pieces plus subbing /NIN or /MNK and only miss it by 4 with /DNC or auspice buff.
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By Nariont 2024-11-05 02:44:32  
shame SB is one of those 5 or so traits blu never got a spell combo for, good thing we got vital ones like rapid shot though
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 Phoenix.Iocus
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By Phoenix.Iocus 2024-11-05 07:11:15  
It's too bad efflux bonus and blue magic skill is on empy legs because gleti's is very nice for SB.
 Asura.Atilas
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By Asura.Atilas 2024-11-05 09:05:49  
DaneBlood said: »
spicychai said: »
Thanks, I think I'll need to keep testing out battle to get grips with it!

Oh and I'm starting to see why Tizona is quite important for BLU; MP does drain slowly but surely. I'm sure there are ways to combat this e.g. magic hammer on susceptible enemies and battery charge (to an extent).

Tizona is a huge boost for BLU DPS

1: The MP you get back (+ refresh in idle gear) is sometimes enough that you dont need to set magic hammer or battery charge.

2: The AM3 is a huge boost for TP gain and works very well the malignance set for TP'ing


-- edit --
SHamelss self plug
but for the above you can always tinker around with my little calcualtor https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xnC7ETVxBDQ5jIgE7umoyryc6cL0VZyoUUe99QJrOIU/edit?usp=sharing

This is an example of much much Tizona turns the tide away from MA toward STP build for TP'ing
this is a basic malignances TP set (With no DW because i forgot)


MA set has DA on cape and uses petrove + Eponas rings
STP set uses STP on Cape and 2 chiric + 1
the rest are idetical

Before without AM3 multi attack has a higher TP gain. but once AM3 gets put into the mix, the STP based build pulls ahead.

I dont have blu on my main character but even for my Wife;s blu. I love Tizona

I recently got my first mythic weapon in the game for my main job BLU. I was reading, comparing and hesitant to start it but once I got Tizona R15 I just stopped equipping Naegling plain and simple. MP gain is one obvious play style change that allow to abuse MP heavy spell like Occultation, White Winds, Tenebral Crush, Entomb and others. TP gain with AM3 active is also an impressive change that allow to WS much more often than with a Naegling. That alone make it already better than Naegling...

However the part I often see overlooked in BLU DPS calculations is the fact that an active AM3 does grant +40DA and +20TA to the weapon like if it was in the description. Those 40DA/20TA do proc for TP gain but ALSO proc when doing any WS. That essentially translates to WS that have a lot more DA/TA procs and therefore making the WS damage much more stable and consistent at reaching damage cap. Pair that with Nyame R25 +22DA, subWAR 12DA, Sailfi Belt +1 (2TA 5DA), job trait 5TA and you have almost no chance to not have proc on every WS.

Even using Savage Blade with a Tizona will give much consistent high damage WS because of the DA/TA proc rate. Savage Blade -> Expiacion = Distortion allow for even more DPS gain in most situations where distortion is not resisted.

You can also abuse the Tizona AM2 to gain 100-120 Magic Accuracy from a single slot. Paired situationally with Sakpata's sword, magic accuracy food and you will land BLU debuff on a lot of stuff for added versatility.

Tizona is that good for BLU...
 Asura.Dexprozius
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By Asura.Dexprozius 2024-11-05 09:12:49  
Tizona is unironically one of the S tier Mythic weapons

Sure many people don't play BLU seriously, and its endgame application is niche, but the weapon itself is quite transformative to the job.

I don't think any serious blue mage would argue anything otherwise. If you like blu, it should be your main weapon.
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 Carbuncle.Maletaru
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By Carbuncle.Maletaru 2024-11-05 09:14:29  
Asura.Atilas said: »
Even using Savage Blade with a Tizona will give much consistent high damage WS because of the DA/TA proc rate. Savage Blade -> Expiacion = Distortion allow for even more DPS gain in most situations where distortion is not resisted.

Agree with almost all of your post, Tizona is insanely good and everyone has been saying this since the dawn of time, however, this is...eh...MA procs on SB do next to nothing for its damage, other than providing a tiny amount of extra TP. The WSD increase is absolutely tiny and unnoticeable in my experience.
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By Atrox78 2024-11-05 09:44:48  
Carbuncle.Maletaru said: »
Asura.Atilas said: »
Even using Savage Blade with a Tizona will give much consistent high damage WS because of the DA/TA proc rate. Savage Blade -> Expiacion = Distortion allow for even more DPS gain in most situations where distortion is not resisted.

Agree with almost all of your post, Tizona is insanely good and everyone has been saying this since the dawn of time, however, this is...eh...MA procs on SB do next to nothing for its damage, other than providing a tiny amount of extra TP. The WSD increase is absolutely tiny and unnoticeable in my experience.

I concur with Mal. AM 3 is only helping tp gain. Tizona is in the top 3 best mythics because it's job specific trait voids one of the most glaring issues with the job and Expiacion is a monster ws with great tp scaling and is arguably the best mythic ws in the game.
 Phoenix.Iocus
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By Phoenix.Iocus 2024-11-05 09:55:55  
Yeah when the useless moves thread was in full swing there was talk about no weapons are game changing and I agree, but I think Tizona is the only one I would even consider arguing against that idea.
 Asura.Dexprozius
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By Asura.Dexprozius 2024-11-05 10:41:02  
Atrox78 said: »
I concur with Mal. AM 3 is only helping tp gain. Tizona is in the top 3 best mythics because it's job specific trait voids one of the most glaring issues with the job and Expiacion is a monster ws with great tp scaling and is arguably the best mythic ws in the game.

*Cough* Leaden Salute *Cough*
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By Atrox78 2024-11-05 10:50:27  
Asura.Dexprozius said: »
Atrox78 said: »
I concur with Mal. AM 3 is only helping tp gain. Tizona is in the top 3 best mythics because it's job specific trait voids one of the most glaring issues with the job and Expiacion is a monster ws with great tp scaling and is arguably the best mythic ws in the game.

*Cough* Leaden Salute *Cough*

That's why I said arguably.....
 Ragnarok.Creaucent
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By Ragnarok.Creaucent 2024-11-05 11:49:34  
Asura.Atilas said: »
DaneBlood said: »
spicychai said: »
Thanks, I think I'll need to keep testing out battle to get grips with it!

Oh and I'm starting to see why Tizona is quite important for BLU; MP does drain slowly but surely. I'm sure there are ways to combat this e.g. magic hammer on susceptible enemies and battery charge (to an extent).

Tizona is a huge boost for BLU DPS

1: The MP you get back (+ refresh in idle gear) is sometimes enough that you dont need to set magic hammer or battery charge.

2: The AM3 is a huge boost for TP gain and works very well the malignance set for TP'ing


-- edit --
SHamelss self plug
but for the above you can always tinker around with my little calcualtor https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xnC7ETVxBDQ5jIgE7umoyryc6cL0VZyoUUe99QJrOIU/edit?usp=sharing

This is an example of much much Tizona turns the tide away from MA toward STP build for TP'ing
this is a basic malignances TP set (With no DW because i forgot)


MA set has DA on cape and uses petrove + Eponas rings
STP set uses STP on Cape and 2 chiric + 1
the rest are idetical

Before without AM3 multi attack has a higher TP gain. but once AM3 gets put into the mix, the STP based build pulls ahead.

I dont have blu on my main character but even for my Wife;s blu. I love Tizona

I recently got my first mythic weapon in the game for my main job BLU. I was reading, comparing and hesitant to start it but once I got Tizona R15 I just stopped equipping Naegling plain and simple. MP gain is one obvious play style change that allow to abuse MP heavy spell like Occultation, White Winds, Tenebral Crush, Entomb and others. TP gain with AM3 active is also an impressive change that allow to WS much more often than with a Naegling. That alone make it already better than Naegling...

However the part I often see overlooked in BLU DPS calculations is the fact that an active AM3 does grant +40DA and +20TA to the weapon like if it was in the description. Those 40DA/20TA do proc for TP gain but ALSO proc when doing any WS. That essentially translates to WS that have a lot more DA/TA procs and therefore making the WS damage much more stable and consistent at reaching damage cap. Pair that with Nyame R25 +22DA, subWAR 12DA, Sailfi Belt +1 (2TA 5DA), job trait 5TA and you have almost no chance to not have proc on every WS.

Even using Savage Blade with a Tizona will give much consistent high damage WS because of the DA/TA proc rate. Savage Blade -> Expiacion = Distortion allow for even more DPS gain in most situations where distortion is not resisted.

You can also abuse the Tizona AM2 to gain 100-120 Magic Accuracy from a single slot. Paired situationally with Sakpata's sword, magic accuracy food and you will land BLU debuff on a lot of stuff for added versatility.

Tizona is that good for BLU...

If you want consistent WS numbers you would be better off with /DRG than /WAR as the WS damage boost gives +7% or +10% to all hits. Especially if you are fully buffed and Berserk does nothing.
 Asura.Atilas
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By Asura.Atilas 2024-11-05 12:47:22  
Ragnarok.Creaucent said: »
If you want consistent WS numbers you would be better off with /DRG than /WAR as the WS damage boost gives +7% or +10% to all hits. Especially if you are fully buffed and Berserk does nothing.

True for /DRG, I do use /WAR when attack it not capped which is most of the case since I mostly do gaming solo or with a casual LS.

After the response from Maletaru I digged a bit more and found that I was indeed wrong about the usefulness of DA/TA on WS like Savage Blade and Expiacion. Seeing some Brutal Earring and Epona's Ring on some entry level WS set just made me think it was more important.

So Savage Blade and Expiacion have an unusual high fTP value (10.25 and 9.39) at 2k that also don't carry on any regular or DA/TA extra hits.

Can we still see some damage improvement other than TP gain ? Lets consider we have Thibron offhand and we ignore its damage. Doing an Expiacion (Base 2 hits) WS we can expect 1st hit at 9.39fTP + 2nd hit 1fTP + 1fTP (DA Proc) that translate to a 9.6% damage increase if DA proc 100% of time. Im I calculating it right ?

EDIT: Ohhh I get it, since the WSD damage only apply to 1st hit it will further reduce that 9.6% base damage increase... So if we have 50WSD the first 9.39fTP hit get boosted to 14.65fTP which reduce the DA additional hit improvements at 6.4% damage increase with 100DA ? Even worst with SB higher 10.25fTP or with more WSD%.
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By Nariont 2024-11-05 12:57:11  
mythic WS damage bonuses apply to all hits so its something like 1.49 ish on each additional hit. It's a boost when it occurs, just not a substaintial one for WS that arent replicating like say dnc's PK and not something you build around vs jsut stacking more WSD/stat mods to give the 1st hit the most impact
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 Phoenix.Iocus
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By Phoenix.Iocus 2024-11-05 14:38:33  
Yeah with /DRG and using PDL, those additional attacks from AM3 can be worth a little bit more, but they are something you get for 'free' or at least without having to spend gear getting them. If you have enough attack to use Gleti's Body or Legs then you can get some PDL + Multi attack to pepper in there, but otherwise I wouldn't be adding multi-attack to the discussed WSs other than the base Nyame so generously provides.
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By Atrox78 2024-11-05 15:43:34  
Asura.Atilas said: »
Ragnarok.Creaucent said: »
If you want consistent WS numbers you would be better off with /DRG than /WAR as the WS damage boost gives +7% or +10% to all hits. Especially if you are fully buffed and Berserk does nothing.

True for /DRG, I do use /WAR when attack it not capped which is most of the case since I mostly do gaming solo or with a casual LS.

After the response from Maletaru I digged a bit more and found that I was indeed wrong about the usefulness of DA/TA on WS like Savage Blade and Expiacion. Seeing some Brutal Earring and Epona's Ring on some entry level WS set just made me think it was more important.

So Savage Blade and Expiacion have an unusual high fTP value (10.25 and 9.39) at 2k that also don't carry on any regular or DA/TA extra hits.

Can we still see some damage improvement other than TP gain ? Lets consider we have Thibron offhand and we ignore its damage. Doing an Expiacion (Base 2 hits) WS we can expect 1st hit at 9.39fTP + 2nd hit 1fTP + 1fTP (DA Proc) that translate to a 9.6% damage increase if DA proc 100% of time. Im I calculating it right ?

EDIT: Ohhh I get it, since the WSD damage only apply to 1st hit it will further reduce that 9.6% base damage increase... So if we have 50WSD the first 9.39fTP hit get boosted to 14.65fTP which reduce the DA additional hit improvements at 6.4% damage increase with 100DA ? Even worst with SB higher 10.25fTP or with more WSD%.

Wsd gear only applies to the first hit. Wsd from /drg applies to all hits. /drg is almost always the best dmg option for blu, unless youre nuking. I only use /war if I'm tanking something on pull a d need the fast hate grab
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