Chango R15 Upheaval Vs Savage

Party-based performance is a useless metric unless it's the same person testing with the same group. Having two people use two different weapons like this makes it useless to try to get a comparison.

You are trolling now.

1. I used quotes in most of my comments here lol
2. You haven't said how much you your Savage do, but you have said this.




So since you prefer using Sword, then you hit for > 64k constantly, you do it at 1200 TP and you take 10-15% of mobs HP building that 1200TP.

Do you still want me to use quotes? :)

So you're saying because they're so close, changes in the other 5 people running with them matter less and we should be able to accurately compare weapons used in two different groups, with different randomly spawned mobs- some of which would be complete foolishness to use any kind of slashing weapon- without worrying about those other 5?

Gotcha.

because I cannot fathom how you use segment return as a measuring scale for deciding between 2 slashing weapons you at best are using 2/3'rds of the time, and my experience is about half the time. There's simply too many other factors to weigh in that can effect that result- as Simon said earlier, it would be like saying because Cooper Kupp wears Nike that the Rams wear the Superbowl. It completely ignores the other 10 people on the field with him, his personal talent for the position he plays, or the other team on the field.

And that's what this discussion has devolved into. We're comparing sneakers and trying to say how the choice in shoe effects the win. When aspects like coordination, familiarity with both the content and your role in it, and the randomness of family selection all weigh much more in the discussion.

You say lately that you're trying to point out your own personal experiences. But when asked about those personal experiences, I'm sorry but the math simply doesn't add up at times. And you reply within 2 minutes to a post by SimonSes almost every time he makes one over days, only to often misread what he's saying or complain about how others are misrepresenting you. The latter simply isn't happening.

We have questions, but they are reacted to with a defensive posturing and subject shifting. Example: of course I know every static is shifting people around, if for no other reason than Exemplar Points, and I never once implied you didn't try different setups/alignments of personnel. Yet you immediately jump to that defensive posture instead of dialogue. Oh well, time to go to the grocery.

have you guys ever considered walking away from an argument instead of continuing to yell at a wall for...3? days now

lol

This is what I've been wondering.

hey football ended last week I'm strugglin to fill my day with other random ***.

Guys, Ahfry is right.

You need to stop using flamma/tatenashi/niqmaddu gear and focus on gear that gives STP/TA/QA. it made a huge difference. I also decided to use the r25 nyame gear instead of keeping it in storage and WOW. This simple change in my playstyle made Naegling the clear number one weapon for warrior. Despite doing less dps and killing less mobs in sheol c than I normally do with Chango, i got more segments. I had 11k segments before we finished the first floor. It didn't even seem real.

Now this is where using the special fencer build that REQUIRES QA/TA/STP really shined. on the 4th floor the beastmen have around 100k HP right? well, I was able to one shot them with a 60k savage blade every time. I can't even explain how OP naegling is after that. I am thinking about /tossing my Ukon/Chango. They could NEVER do the things that Naegling does. I think it is because I used Berserk and warcry on the fourth floor. Something that I am sure that NONE of us ever even considered doing. Brilliant, I say.

Ahrfry... I am soooo sorry I doubted you. Your bizarre explanations seemed stupid and mirrored the ramblings of an imbecile. Now I realize you are a genius. A mad genius. Which is the best kind.

I've been watching this unfold from the shadows. It's a wild day in the metaverse™ when I agree with anything Celebrindal says, but somehow, here we are.

Coming from a group that regularly gets 10~12k segments because of how optimized our support team and DD synergy is, I gotta say Naegling Fencer WAR is not really the hotness. Plus, it feels like butts to play. I have the same complaint about Naegling DRG, too long to TP - your support are just going to snipe those mobs from you and you're going to get stuck in autotarget, swing resetting hell. Even supports mostly 1-shot stuff up to Floor 3/4 unless it's an unfortunate resistance.

If your supports are bad or anything less than optimal, I imagine Naegling pulls out on top though if we're throwing apples to apples.

If I were a main WAR and not just a Naegling/Loxotic WAR, I'd take advantage of the GAxe toolkit. Feels way better to play since your character actually does stuff.

P.S. Don't forget to buy my NFT commemorating this post as the first time Celebrindal and I have been on the same side of the table in a discussion. LOL

I disagree. Naegling will do even better, even if it does considerably less damage and kills less mobs, Naegling performs way better. It is the intangible quality of performance that is key. This is just my personal experience since yesterday, but you can't question the results. Over a dozen sheol C runs with 12K+ runs already. It is like you said, you need to focus on STP, TA, QA instead of using the old Flamma, Tatenashi, Niqmaddu and the like. And all that Nyame r25 gear you have? You gotta try it, just equip it. I know it looks like it sucks, but if you actually equip it, it performs much better than when you don't. If SE doesn't nerf Naegling soon, we will start seeing people farming 12k segments a floor! Maybe even solo with trusts!!!!


A few hours ago I wipped out my Naegling and popped a Viagra before doing an omen Kin and not only did the Dagon body drop, the Volte harness was dropped as well. But I would never use that noob gear. Dagon doesn't even have correct fencer TA on it. It is simply a play style correction and you too can have a solid naegling performance. The craziest part is I still got 12k+ segments on that Omen Kin run.


I bet Ruaumoko and his sexy voice are going to make a 1 hour video on the intricacies of war/naegling SB in a fencer build. Might take a year to fully research it though.

Me and Rua have talked about this recently, he loaths Naegling and the singlemindedness it's introduced into the community.

Well ***, I better start packing. The world is ending. :) <3

A lot of people hate Naegling because it is probably the best DPS weapon on like 4 jobs lol. On war I view it as "old faithful". It is almost never a bad option. It is always solid. Unless you have Haste samba though, it is probably outside of wars top 5 weapons. Id have to check it out, but I bet Farsha has better DPS builds than Naegling too.

Granted, I really love Farsha.


But yeah, I have noticed a lot of people just default to Savage, that is going to get worse as more people finish up their Nyame gear too. Just a guess though. I don't think the singlemindedness is anything new though. People STILL think Nirv SMN is the only good way to beat helms.

I personally love how Naegling made DPS bard a lot easier to gear. I personally have no issues with Naegling and it's place in the game.


JK, Naegling > all things

Basically, I use the Ukon TP set and 5/5 Nyame set for Cloudsplitter. then I spam Mistral/Calamity. It is fun.

Mistral and Calamity uses the SB set. Probably a couple of swaps available on calamity. But i haven't worried about it too much.

Farsha is a lot of fun in general, especially when you are the mob's target, but I find AM3 maintenance to be a drag depending on pulls/packs.

Re: Naegling, it's made the current endgame meta extremely dull.

Yeah basically the worst part of Farsha in Shaol C is AM3. If you get unlucky and have floor when it's a lot of swapping between slashing/blunt/piercing, then rebuilding AM3 on Farsha every time is a pain.

If you're going to promote a non-ilvl weapon at least mention the word accuracy..... This is a trash mob setup at best.

either trolling or you over-estimate how much acc it takes to make a non-ilvl OH work, it's dumb but it works great

On trash mobs.... good luck on wave 3 dynamis or helms. Unless you expect the brd to waste multiple accuracy songs on you.

You need about ~1450 accuracy on your offhand to hit voltes. Stop peddling snake oil...

Been a thing for atleast 3 yrs now, buffs/debuffs/now ML are a thing and you dont even need to cap OH acc to make the huge jump in ws dmg worth the trade off

You might want to check the topic at hand, it's Odyssea Seg farming which is just killing massive quantities of trash mobs.

In my normal TP set I have something like 1360 accuracy, now pile on my favorite food (Omelet Sandwich) and Honor March and I'm way way beyond the monsters evasion.

The comment for the TP Bonus Axe was more for the folks insisting on Savage Blading All The Things, so they can at least do it right.

Real men use Loxotic Mace +1