Random Politics & Religion #21

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2010-06-21
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Random Politics & Religion #21
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 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2017-03-30 15:04:09  
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
We know trump was surveilled.

False
We already have confirmation by the chairman of an Intelligence Committee and also by an ex-Obama Admin who helped surveilled Trump.

Are you so blind in your partisan mind that you can't see the evidence because you don't like it?
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By fonewear 2017-03-30 15:13:14  
Shiva.Nikolce said: »
Garuda.Chanti said: »
There were upwards of 1,000 paid Internet trolls

I want this job! someone, anyone please hook me up!!!

I'm totaly qualified!!!


Where did you get that picture of me ?
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 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2017-03-30 15:15:01  
And now, for something completely different:

In bid to block Gorsuch, Warren and Democrats overplay their hand

The Boston Globe, but people will still hate the source cause it doesn't fit their narrative.

Quote:
NOW THAT Democrats have scored a victory by defeating President Donald Trump’s plan to repeal and replace Obamacare, they smell blood in the water. But in pledging to block Supreme Court nominee Neil Gorsuch, they may be overplaying their hand and inviting bigger problems down the road.

The resistance to Gorsuch is based not on the nominee’s background, qualifications, or courtroom experience. Those are impeccable. He breezed through his confirmation hearings without any gaffes or slipups. No, the Democratic opposition is fanned by the suspicion that Gorsuch will somehow put the law ahead of his personal feelings.

This bizarre attitude was summed up by Democratic Senator Kamala Harris of California, who said: “Judge Gorsuch has consistently valued narrow legalisms over real lives.” In other words, a good judge should base his rulings on outcomes and not on the law itself.

Here in Massachusetts, Senator Elizabeth Warren accused Gorsuch of favoring the interests of big corporations over workers and consumers, as if what matters is the identity of the plaintiffs and defendants and not the legal reasoning behind Gorsuch’s opinions.

Warren’s opposition is particularly rich considering her own history, actually advocating for the corporations she claims to oppose.

During the time she spent as a
private attorney, Warren was hired by LTV Steel, in the 1990s, to assist the company, then emerging from bankruptcy, in arguing that it did not have to pay into its retirees’ health care fund. She also represented Travelers Insurance in 2009 in a bid to help one of the nation’s largest insurers gain immunity from asbestos-related lawsuits. Travelers won most of what it wanted. Needless to say, the results have been disastrous for asbestos victims.

Why is it that Warren gets a pass on her hypocrisy as she attacks the reputation of her opponents? If Warren engages in the same behaviors that she pretends to find in others, she should at least be reminded of her dishonesty.

And what is the evidence that Gorsuch is pro-corporate? Compared to Warren, Gorsuch is a slacker. The most oft-cited case is his dissent while on the 10th Circuit Court of Appeals in a decision in which a company was ordered to rehire a trucker fired for abandoning his load. Gorsuch said the company’s response may have been unkind, but it was not illegal.

At the confirmation hearings, Gorsuch addressed the law’s demands, and how what we might desire in terms of an outcome is not always possible. “Sometimes,” he said, “the answers we reach aren’t the ones we personally prefer. Sometimes the answers follow us home at night and keep us up. But the answers we reach are always the ones we believes the law requires. And for all its imperfections, I believe that the rule of law in this nation truly is a wonder.”

One of Barack Obama’s legacies as president is the “empathy rule” in judicial selection. Before nominating Sonia Sotomayor to the nation’s highest bench, in 2009, Obama said an important consideration was “that quality of empathy, of understanding and identifying with people’s hopes and struggles as an essential ingredient for arriving at just decisions and outcomes.”

Democrats have now turned that criterion into a weak excuse for filibustering Gorsuch’s nomination.

This is a dead end for Democrats. Refusing Gorsuch a straight up-or-down vote will force majority leader Mitch McConnell to do away with Senate rules that require 60 votes to break a filibuster. That means Trump can choose as his next Supreme Court nominee someone far more contentious and less empathetic than Gorsuch, and Democrats will have no one to blame but themselves.
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 Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2017-03-30 15:15:55  
fonewear said: »
Shiva.Nikolce said: »
Garuda.Chanti said: »
There were upwards of 1,000 paid Internet trolls

I want this job! someone, anyone please hook me up!!!

I'm totaly qualified!!!


Where did you get that picture of me ?

Encyclopedia Dramatica
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 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2017-03-30 15:17:28  
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
We know trump was surveilled.

False
We already have confirmation by the chairman of an Intelligence Committee and also by an ex-Obama Admin who helped surveilled Trump.

Are you so blind in your partisan mind that you can't see the evidence because you don't like it?

We have the confirmation by the FBI and the NSA saying it's not the case. What happened is incidental collection of information.

Sticking to the facts.
That is not related to Russia.

That was unmasked purposefully and illegally.

That there was a large possibility/probability that this was done to indirectly target Trump. (I mean, if it wasn't to target Trump, why did they unmask him and his associates?)

Just ask yourself this: What would Jesus Do you do if Obama was spied by Bush?
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 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2017-03-30 15:19:44  
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Are you so blind in your partisan mind that you can't see the evidence because you don't like it?

Evidence for anything I don't support is illegitimate and therefor not by definition doesn't matter. If the evidence is relevant then again by definition it must only be for something the cause supports.

Ultimately anything and everything is for the cause.
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By 2017-03-30 15:27:30
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By fonewear 2017-03-30 15:55:08  
What we need is a jump to conclusion mat:

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By fonewear 2017-03-30 15:58:30  
I made one for this whole Russia thing:

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 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2017-03-30 16:22:44  
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
We know trump was surveilled.

False
We already have confirmation by the chairman of an Intelligence Committee and also by an ex-Obama Admin who helped surveilled Trump.

Are you so blind in your partisan mind that you can't see the evidence because you don't like it?

We have the confirmation by the FBI and the NSA saying it's not the case. What happened is incidental collection of information.

Sticking to the facts.
That is not related to Russia.

That was unmasked purposefully and illegally.

That there was a large possibility/probability that this was done to indirectly target Trump. (I mean, if it wasn't to target Trump, why did they unmask him and his associates?)

Just ask yourself this: What would Jesus Do you do if Obama was spied by Bush?

Again, you are just injecting your own conclusions.
I didnt even mention russia, FBI NSA and the DoJ said they didnt spy on Trump.
You mentioned the incidental collection.

Some of that involves *gasp* not Russia.

Now ask yourself this: Why was that information collected, and why was Trump unmasked and that data spread to multiple agencies, especially agencies that should not have that information?

Don't worry, I know you won't answer. You never do.
 Cerberus.Pleebo
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2017-03-30 16:26:46  
Do you understand what 'incidental' means?
 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2017-03-30 16:32:23  
Cerberus.Pleebo said: »
Do you understand what 'incidental' means?
So?

Do you honestly think that foreign nationals who are not under investigation just happened to be targeted at the same time they were talking to Trump and his people?

Hell, even the best case scenario smells. Why would Obama's admin unmask Trump's team and distribute such intelligence to agencies that do not need to know?
 Cerberus.Pleebo
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2017-03-30 16:50:22  
You have no idea when these nationals were being surveiled or what pertinent intelligence was distributed with the incidentally collected info.
 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2017-03-30 17:02:17  
So, wait, are you inferring to multiple investigations into Trump now?

All the guy did was win an election! God you liberals just can't let it go, you got to punish the guy for beating your Chosen One™.

Then again, this is the party that loves to use lawfare on political opponents.
 Cerberus.Pleebo
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2017-03-30 17:04:54  
Oh you
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By 2017-03-30 18:02:37
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By Viciouss 2017-03-30 19:52:06  
So there is a report that the deplorable Mike Flynn who was justifiably terminated by two different Presidents is now offering to testify in exchange for immunity from prosecution.

Reuters

Quote:
President Donald Trump's former national security adviser, Michael Flynn, has discussed with congressional committees giving testimony in their investigations of potential ties between the Trump campaign and Russia, his lawyer said on Thursday.

The Wall Street Journal, citing officials with knowledge of the matter, reported on Thursday that Flynn had sought immunity from the Federal Bureau of Investigation and the House and Senate intelligence panels in exchange for his testimony. The newspaper said he had so far found no takers.

The House of Representatives panel denied the Journal report. "Michael Flynn has not offered to testify to HPSCI in exchange for immunity," committee spokesman Jack Langer said in a statement.

The FBI declined to comment. The Senate committee did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

Flynn was fired in February as national security adviser for failing to disclose talks with Russia's ambassador about U.S. sanctions on Moscow. The talks occurred before Trump took office in January.

Flynn's lawyer, Robert Kelner, confirmed in a statement that his client had held discussions with the House and Senate intelligence committees. His statement did not mention the FBI.

If its true, which wouldn't surprise me given how stupid he is, then thats cute and all, but he isn't going to get it. He will testify either voluntarily or by subpoena, that much is certain. I don't know what exactly he would be charged with, but it is kind of ironic because I believe it was Flynn that said people that seek immunity have committed crimes.
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By Viciouss 2017-03-30 19:59:01  
Update - Flynn's lawyer has confirmed the story is true.

CNN!

Quote:
Former National Security Adviser Michael Flynn is willing to testify before federal and congressional investigators, but only if he is granted immunity, his lawyer said Thursday.

"Gen. Flynn certainly has a story to tell, and he very much wants to tell it, should the circumstances permit. ... No reasonable person, who has the benefit of advice from counsel, would submit to questioning in such a highly politicized, witch-hunt environment without assurances against unfair prosecution," Robert Kelner, Flynn's lawyer, said in a statement late Thursday.

So, good for him. But good luck with that. He can be subpoena'd, and if he wants to take the 5th then thats on him. Curious about what he has got to hide.
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 Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2017-03-30 20:17:00  
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No reasonable person, who has the benefit of advice from counsel, would submit to questioning in such a highly politicized, witch-hunt environment without assurances against unfair prosecution

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Just take a little bit of nothingburger, put it as bait on your fishing pole, earn immunity to guarantee that the witch hunt can't touch you, and laugh at the tears of disappointment when what you say can't be used to hurt Trump. Sounds like a pretty good plan.
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 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2017-03-30 20:22:18  
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Quote:
No reasonable person, who has the benefit of advice from counsel, would submit to questioning in such a highly politicized, witch-hunt environment without assurances against unfair prosecution

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Just take a little bit of nothingburger, put it as bait on your fishing pole, earn immunity to guarantee that the witch hunt can't touch you, and laugh at the tears of disappointment when what you say can't be used to hurt Trump. Sounds like a pretty good plan.
Even better, throw it in the face of the democrats/liberals and say "Hi Benghazi, how are you doing?"
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By Viciouss 2017-03-30 20:24:17  
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Quote:
No reasonable person, who has the benefit of advice from counsel, would submit to questioning in such a highly politicized, witch-hunt environment without assurances against unfair prosecution

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Just take a little bit of nothingburger, put it as bait on your fishing pole, earn immunity to guarantee that the witch hunt can't touch you, and laugh at the tears of disappointment when what you say can't be used to hurt Trump. Sounds like a pretty good plan.

And its not gonna work. Fortunately, the Senate is smarter than Flynn. His willingness to testify is irrelevant, just subpoena him.
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2017-03-30 20:26:33  
Viciouss said: »
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Quote:
No reasonable person, who has the benefit of advice from counsel, would submit to questioning in such a highly politicized, witch-hunt environment without assurances against unfair prosecution

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Just take a little bit of nothingburger, put it as bait on your fishing pole, earn immunity to guarantee that the witch hunt can't touch you, and laugh at the tears of disappointment when what you say can't be used to hurt Trump. Sounds like a pretty good plan.

And its not gonna work. Fortunately, the Senate is smarter than Flynn. His willingness to testify is irrelevant, just subpoena him.

Either way you're getting nothing useful, so whatever the Senate wants to do works, I guess.
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By Viciouss 2017-03-30 20:29:27  
Well if it sends him to prison that works, right?
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2017-03-30 21:02:05  
Viciouss said: »
Well if it sends him to prison that works, right?
Sure, right when they send Eric Holder to jail too.
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 Garuda.Chanti
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By Garuda.Chanti 2017-03-30 21:49:17  
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Viciouss said: »
Well if it sends him to prison that works, right?
Sure, right when they send Eric Holder to jail too.
Irrelevants are gray and have big ears.
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 Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2017-03-30 21:57:47  
Viciouss said: »
Update - Flynn's lawyer has confirmed the story is true.

CNN!

Quote:
Former National Security Adviser Michael Flynn is willing to testify before federal and congressional investigators, but only if he is granted immunity, his lawyer said Thursday.

"Gen. Flynn certainly has a story to tell, and he very much wants to tell it, should the circumstances permit. ... No reasonable person, who has the benefit of advice from counsel, would submit to questioning in such a highly politicized, witch-hunt environment without assurances against unfair prosecution," Robert Kelner, Flynn's lawyer, said in a statement late Thursday.

So, good for him. But good luck with that. He can be subpoena'd, and if he wants to take the 5th then thats on him. Curious about what he has got to hide.
Meh, more juice for the smoke machine.

(No tinder)
 
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By 2017-03-30 22:16:45
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 Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2017-03-30 22:24:30  
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
A couple months ago it was all about how you are guilty if you ask for immunity.
I wonder who "probably" said that?.
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By Shiva.Nikolce 2017-03-30 23:09:14  
Phew! For a second there i thought it was me...
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