Omen Findings

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Omen Findings
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By volkom 2017-01-18 22:51:19  
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Lyramion said: »
Bismarck.Ihina said: »
Hmm, I'm starting to think that body drop is based on some kind of randomized chance.

Blasphemous ! I once got a DRing to drop...

- facing east
- while it rained in Zitah
- having eaten a 4 leaf mandragora bud
- new moon
- fed my chocobo at 11.30 the day before

All this directly contributed to the drop and has to be seen as hard fact.

Gotta get creative. Every drop from Omen is either a Babylonian, Assyrian, Sumerian or other ancient deity-named drop. People are confirming 666 Omen gets treasure floors. Has anyone confirmed if having the Mark of the Wild Beast does anything for drop rate? Possible tarutaru child sacrifice before boss death. Full moon worship?

Leave it up to someone to figure that out...

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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2017-01-19 02:26:38  
Odin.Llewelyn said: »
Setup was SAM THF BRD GEO WHM RDM

RDM was on T1 spam duty to keep the regen down. I just did 4-steps on SAM using Kogarasumaru to ease the timing on the SCs since Slow Spikes suck. Sometimes I'd open for the THF to close Darkness with 3000 TP Rudra. SV/CC Honor March/Madx2/Scherzo/Min at start (those songs don't mean much when they keep getting dispelled by Interferece under 25%; best to get the most out of them at the start). GEO opens with Blaze Frailty/Indi-Vex/Entrust Fury. At the 10 min mark when songs wear off, GEO does Entrust Precision.

Getting it to 25% actually wasn't too terrible as long as its Regen is constantly being kept in check. It was after that when it started spamming Interference and flooring my acc by dispelling songs where it became a huge headache. We don't bring a tank so I have to sit in a hybrid set to keep myself from dying, but that also means I have a lot less accuracy than I could have.

Obviously there's room for improvement in the setup, such as replacing the RDM with another GEO, but personally I'd prefer going on the jobs people need cards on and trying to make it work. Maybe worth noting that both myself and Ihina were triple boxing, making it quite a headache reapplying buffs and stuff at the end with the dispel spam, so I believe a group of 5 or 6 real people will have a much easier time than we did.


So I just attempted melee Kei and we failed horribly. Setup was RUN THF COR GEO GEO WHM. I started off using malaise/frailty on my Idris GEO with the idea of full circle + run before 75%. But my melee damage was terrible. Does it have significant PDT or something? I switched to malaise/languor and just used my THF to make SC and we eventually got it to 75% but I'm talking I was hitting stacked Rudra's at 475 damage, evisceration to follow for 20 damage. My melee damage didn't count for anything I was simply a different method of SCH. If we had a better mage set on our group I imagine we would have won, but I'm not seeing the benefit in attempting Kei based on melee damage. Do you hit reasonable WS numbers on SAM and it's simply a matter of needing to focus attack buffs?

Aside from runeists roll I wasn't having an issue on survival, and only time I dipped low seemed to be times I got Bio ticking away on me, so that was nice.

I'm trying to wonder if the COR swapped to RDM if they could land Frazzle/Distract III/Addle II and help nuke and use my THF purely as a SC mechanic if that could work, but my 2nd GEO likely needs much better gear before that would work. Also might need to look into if there are any upgrades for my GEO for landing spells in this content because Idris malaise/languor I was only MBing for a little over 14k, maybe 20k during bolster.
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By Lakshmi.Lenus 2017-01-19 02:32:13  
He takes horrible damage as long as his shield is up I think? You remove it by doing a sc or something
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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2017-01-19 02:46:58  
Lakshmi.Lenus said: »
He takes horrible damage as long as his shield is up I think? You remove it by doing a sc or something

I did multiple SC's and his shield never dropped. Unless his shield dropping is what gave me a 2475 Rudra's, lol. Is the shield tied to a particular element? I was sticking almost exclusively to Darkness SC, if I were to try again I could do a 3-step and stack the 3rd WS pretty easily during blaze spikes phase if I knew it was going to do noticeable damage, but then the darkness often healed him so I'm not sure that would even make a difference.
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By Odin.Llewelyn 2017-01-19 02:56:44  
Dropping the shield isn't related to any element. It always drops while an MB window is open and damage is total crap while the shield is up. The WS that closes the first skillchain and causes the shield drop still does not deal normal damage; damage is only normal after the shield is dropped, so you'll need 3-steps or higher to deal respectable damage.

Probably worth noting that ever since we changed to Light SCs, our kills have been much faster. THF went from dropping ~4% HP to ~9% HP in a single WS/SC after changing from closing 4-step Twashtar Rudra Darkness to 5-step Vajra Mandalic Stab Light. Kei (and probably all Caturae) resists Darkness heavily compared to Light.

Edit: In regards to the worry of SCs healing him, that only happens on the first skillchain that causes the shield to drop, which doesn't matter since the weapon skill closing that skillchain will still be very weak due to the PDT of the shield.
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By Bismarck.Ihina 2017-01-19 03:15:00  


Even though Rudra hit maybe 30% stronger, darkness was only a x1 multiplier compared to this.

While I'm at it, hope no one minds if I brag a little




And RDM can't land squat without outside support. Nuke, haste2, sometimes cure and dia3 are about all RDM will be doing.
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By Odin.Llewelyn 2017-01-19 03:28:27  
Those auto attacks scream "weak to piercing". Nice Ironclad Smiter screenshot, bro.
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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2017-01-19 03:30:55  
Alright, so I should have clarified the mechanics before going in, because I can certainly see a multi-step SC working out for damage now. Now I feel bad we didn't get the kill simply because of my ignorance of the mechanics.
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By Asura.Thorva 2017-01-19 03:31:46  
Bismarck.Ihina said: »
And RDM can't land squat without outside support. Nuke, haste2, sometimes cure and dia3 are about all RDM will be doing.
Find a better rdm.
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By Bismarck.Ihina 2017-01-19 03:51:33  
I am the RDM, and every slot is optimized besides mythic and rings, because I'm not paying 200m a piece each, and the three augmented pieces I'm currently using (head, hands and legs) are 5 or less from cap.

Even if you have a 50% chance of landing them, you won't be cycling through them anyways because it erases all its debuffs too quickly, and you have to be constantly nuking to keep its regen down, not to mention the other tasks pointed out earlier.
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By Asura.Sechs 2017-01-19 03:57:41  
While I'm sure you already know, a Grio with good augments is alas better than AG Mythic, when it comes to sticking debuffs.
Could argue about the Aftermath Macc but that's not really practical to keep up (and still has less enf skill anyway)
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By Asura.Psylo 2017-01-19 04:51:36  
Hmm i come RDM in omen, don't need geo buff to land distract or anything else on mini or mega boss.

So ok, its better to take a geo but i prefer 100 times to come RDM because i love play this job than come geo to just put indi/geo entrust and something try to land a debuff.

Quote:
While I'm sure you already know, a Grio with good augments is alas better than AG Mythic, when it comes to sticking debuffs.

With the new shield from Kei, i don't think.
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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2017-01-19 05:01:48  
Asura.Psylo said: »
With the new shield from Kei, i don't think.

One reason I want to do Kei, it might validate my +269 Idris!
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By Asura.Sechs 2017-01-19 05:11:11  
Idris 269 with AM2 up and Culminus is already very good, arguably on par (better? Hmm...) than a Grioavolr with good augments.
Well, if we exclude builds which require MB damage augs on Grio.
But keeping AM2 up is a pita anyway.

With the new shield it might become a competitive (better?) option even without AM2 up!
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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2017-01-19 05:41:14  
Asura.Sechs said: »
Idris 269 with AM2 up and Culminus is already very good, arguably on par (better? Hmm...) than a Grioavolr with good augments.
Well, if we exclude builds which require MB damage augs on Grio.
But keeping AM2 up is a pita anyway.

With the new shield it might become a competitive (better?) option even without AM2 up!

Yeah, currently Grio wins ever so slightly over Idris/Culminus. And just checking and my Idris/Culminus actually does around 160 more damage on t5's than Grio (INT+20, mab+25) but mathing it out I have less macc with Idris. And it's MACC+38 on this shield, and should be similar, likely more damage as well than Culminus (INT+13, MAB+18 vs MDMG+75). So this shield should have me retiring Grio for nuking...and enfeebling...and enhancing. So this shield ends my GEO using a staff. No more blinking, my whm will appreciate that.
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By Sylph.Oraen 2017-01-19 05:55:26  
Unless you're still using a handbell. The struggle never ends for GEO's blinking woes.
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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2017-01-19 05:59:22  
Sylph.Oraen said: »
Unless you're still using a handbell. The struggle never ends for GEO's blinking woes.

So switching from Dunna to a Tathlum keeps a GEO blinking?
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By Sylph.Oraen 2017-01-19 06:08:43  
Yuuup. Same with Ninjas and Shuriken > Ammo. Total pain in the ***.
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By Asura.Sechs 2017-01-19 06:10:15  
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
Yeah, currently Grio wins ever so slightly over Idris/Culminus. And just checking and my Idris/Culminus actually does around 160 more damage on t5's than Grio (INT+20, mab+25) but mathing it out I have less macc with Idris. And it's MACC+38 on this shield, and should be similar, likely more damage as well than Culminus (INT+13, MAB+18 vs MDMG+75). So this shield should have me retiring Grio for nuking...and enfeebling...and enhancing. So this shield ends my GEO using a staff. No more blinking, my whm will appreciate that.
Granted that Idris269+newshield would be an excellent compromise for enfeebling, I'm not sure it would be better than Grio Lady.

Let's check:
Idris269+Ammurapi = 255 + 78 + 13 = 346
Grio+Grip = 228 + 92 + 16 + 19 = 355

I used the augments I have on my Grio (25macc, 16enf skill. Macc goes up to 30 though, not considering Dark Matter of course) and the macc+15 grip. Arguably you could use the 5macc/5enfeeble one as well.
This second setup also offers additional amounts of Enf skill, which might grant slightly higher potency to Frazzle/Distract... and that's it? Don't think it matters for anything else.


Now though... it all revolves around conversion rates.
In my example I simplified a 1:1 conversion rate for everything.
This is almost accurate for INT/MND and Enfskill conversions, but I have no clue if it's accurate for Macc Skill.
If it really converts at 1:1 then Grio is slightly better than Idris (I wouldn't call ~9 difference anything "huge").

BUT is the macc skill conversion rate is worse than 1:1, then of course this would make the difference bigger, favouring Grio setup since it has more "raw" macc, and less macc skill.



Regardless of this, wouldn't you still swap club for staff because of Oranyan? For enhancing magic.
Speaking of which, Oranyan alone + 15macc Grip is already 310 btw, pretty nice considering the "effort" you have to go through to get 269 Idris or good augs on Grio =/
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By Odin.Llewelyn 2017-01-19 06:15:19  
Asura.Sechs said: »

Regardless of this, wouldn't you still swap club for staff because of Oranyan? For enhancing magic.
Not when you add a 6% enhancing duration Gada.
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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2017-01-19 06:19:58  
Asura.Sechs said: »
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
Yeah, currently Grio wins ever so slightly over Idris/Culminus. And just checking and my Idris/Culminus actually does around 160 more damage on t5's than Grio (INT+20, mab+25) but mathing it out I have less macc with Idris. And it's MACC+38 on this shield, and should be similar, likely more damage as well than Culminus (INT+13, MAB+18 vs MDMG+75). So this shield should have me retiring Grio for nuking...and enfeebling...and enhancing. So this shield ends my GEO using a staff. No more blinking, my whm will appreciate that.
Granted that Idris269+newshield would be an excellent compromise for enfeebling, I'm not sure it would be better than Grio Lady.

Let's check:
Idris269+Ammurapi = 255 + 78 + 13 = 346
Grio+Grip = 228 + 92 + 16 + 19 = 355

I used the augments I have on my Grio (25macc, 16enf skill. Macc goes up to 30 though, not considering Dark Matter of course) and the macc+15 grip. Arguably you could use the 5macc/5enfeeble one as well.
This second setup also offers additional amounts of Enf skill, which might grant slightly higher potency to Frazzle/Distract... and that's it? Don't think it matters for anything else.


Now though... it all revolves around conversion rates.
In my example I simplified a 1:1 conversion rate for everything.
This is almost accurate for INT/MND and Enfskill conversions, but I have no clue if it's accurate for Macc Skill.
If it really converts at 1:1 then Grio is slightly better than Idris (I wouldn't call ~9 difference anything "huge").

BUT is the macc skill conversion rate is worse than 1:1, then of course this would make the difference bigger, favouring Grio setup since it has more "raw" macc, and less macc skill.



Regardless of this, wouldn't you still swap club for staff because of Oranyan? For enhancing magic.
Speaking of which, Oranyan alone + 15macc Grip is already 310 btw, pretty nice considering the "effort" you have to go through to get 269 Idris or good augs on Grio =/

I'm blanking on where you get the +92 with Grio? My Grio is 228 + 14 base + 25 augment + 10 skill (which can likely go a bit higher but it's what I have) and +10 grip.

Now SE has confirmed the "magic accuracy skill" portion is roughly half of what it is. So that 228 is 114 and the +255 is 127.

This makes Grio 114 + 14 + 25 + 10 + 10, so +173.

Which makes Idris 127 + 40 + 38, so +205.

Though I have Grio/Enki at (at least) +29 INT/MND and Idris/Omen at +13, but I'm unsure how those factor into things in terms of accuracy.
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By Asura.Saevel 2017-01-19 06:40:56  
Grio isn't about magic accuracy, though that's nice, it's about +skill with large portions of +MND for RDM. RDM's best enfeebles are based on skill and MND, notably Distract III and Addle II. We prefer having a RDM in the "healer" slot for non meleee runs because they offer an incredibly diverse skillset and are flexible to whatever NM we get.

The only debuff that is annoying to land is Frazzle III on the final boss and only because Cacturai have resistance to everything dark based. If the GEO has focus up I can usually land it or if I use JA's but honestly it's not worth it as I can land everything else just fine and it will erase debuffs so need to reapply often.
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By Asura.Sechs 2017-01-19 06:50:51  
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
I'm blanking on where you get the +92 with Grio?
Checking on my calculator it seems I added 38 additional macc for no reason in my Grio calculations, derp.
No clue where it comes from, Ammurapi shield maybe lol? I apologize ><


Quote:
Now SE has confirmed the "magic accuracy skill" portion is roughly half of what it is. So that 228 is 114 and the +255 is 127.
That post was very confusing and proceeded with other examples in a second post that we 100% know to be not true, so I'm not sure if we can trust what they said in that initial post... maybe something got lost in translation, I dunno.


Odin.Llewelyn said: »
Not when you add a 6% enhancing duration Gada.
10% on Oranyan is Multiplicative
6% on Gada is Addittive
I haven't tested it myself but was told that 10% on Ammurapi is also Addittive.

10% Multi > 16% Addittive

Now if Ammurapi is Multi then it's a different story, because it would be the same value as Oranyan, plus another additional 6% Addittive.
(Values on Grio are also Addittive btw if someone was wondering)
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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2017-01-19 06:54:49  
Asura.Sechs said: »
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
I'm blanking on where you get the +92 with Grio?
Checking on my calculator it seems I added 38 additional macc for no reason in my Grio calculations, derp.
No clue where it comes from, Ammurapi shield maybe lol? I apologize ><


Quote:
Now SE has confirmed the "magic accuracy skill" portion is roughly half of what it is. So that 228 is 114 and the +255 is 127.
That post was very confusing and proceeded with other examples in a second post that we 100% know to be not true, so I'm not sure if we can trust what they said in that initial post... maybe something got lost in translation, I dunno.

Both of those points only give Idris major points to leading in magic accuracy.
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2017-01-19 06:56:09  
16 additive with 50% telchine is 166%.

10 multiplicative is 165.
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By Asura.Sechs 2017-01-19 06:57:58  
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
Both of those points only give Idris major points to leading in magic accuracy.
I wasn't arguing against that anymore since when I found out the 38 I added by mistake!

The only point that remains in favor of Grio+Grip build is for the additional +21 Enf skill which can potentially grant you more potency for stuff like Frazzle and Distract, but I'm not really sure it matters that much for a GEO/RDM and regardless probably not worth the loss of macc.

I don't even use Grio on GEO lol, but that's because I'm lazy, I honestly thought it to be slightly better than Idris :D
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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2017-01-19 07:04:19  
Asura.Sechs said: »
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »
Both of those points only give Idris major points to leading in magic accuracy.
I wasn't arguing against that anymore since when I found out the 38 I added by mistake!

The only point that remains in favor of Grio+Grip build is for the additional +21 Enf skill which can potentially grant you more potency for stuff like Frazzle and Distract, but I'm not really sure it matters that much for a GEO/RDM and regardless probably not worth the loss of macc.

I don't even use Grio on GEO lol, but that's because I'm lazy, I honestly thought it to be slightly better than Idris :D

If the skill is only half effect as SE stated, it should be slightly better than Idris. But if it's not, and then with this shield, Idris should take over. And my GEO is my one-job alt, so having the absolute best is kinda the goal, 3 wardrobes of stuff for GEO and all, lol. And the fact my GEO is so strong is part of why I can do a number of the things I do. Certainly seen people try to replicate me but with a lazy GEO dualbox and they can't make it work.
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By Asura.Sechs 2017-01-19 07:08:52  
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
16 additive with 50% telchine is 166%.

10 multiplicative is 165.
On SCH I saw better results with Oranyan. Maybe Perpetuance is *** up the calculations?
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By Asura.Saevel 2017-01-19 08:09:30  
Asura.Sechs said: »
The only point that remains in favor of Grio+Grip build is for the additional +21 Enf skill which can potentially grant you more potency for stuff like Frazzle and Distract, but I'm not really sure it matters that much for a GEO/RDM and regardless probably not worth the loss of macc.

/RDM enfeebles are static and don't use skill for potency.

Distract is -35 evasion and Frazzle is assumed to be about the same. In contract Distract / Frazzle III from RDM main scale with enfeebling magic as the following.

Quote:
Potency = [Floor(4/21)(Enfeebling Skill - 190)] + Floor(dMND/5); where dMND/5 caps at 0 and 10.
Caps at 610 Enfeebling Skill.

RDM also has JSE pieces for +24% potency. Not sure if the Uk'uxkaj Boots are worth it as they don't have skill or magic acc and those are both needed to hit real targets. My set has -107 Evasion for Distract III without using JA's.

Addle II doesn't use any Skill but does use dMND

Quote:
Potency of increased spellcasting time varies between 25% and 40%.
Magic Accuracy Penalty = floor(dMND/5) + 50
dMND contribution caps at 100 dMND (20 Magic Accuracy penalty), for a total of 70 Magic Accuracy Penalty.

So 70 * 1.24 (Ux boots are only worth like -4 magic acc here) for -86 magic accuracy, -90 with Ux Boots. Again no JA's are used.

For party support Haste II / Flurry II when appropriate and Refresh III is now 13 MP/tick with AF+2 body. Recently got the gear to hit cure power cap on RDM without needing Light Arts, so it's got pretty powerful cures.
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By Sylph.Braden 2017-01-19 08:26:30  
Obviously this doesn't apply to all bosses, but I can definitely land any debuff on Kin when he's absorbing magic damage. Pretty sure all elemental resistances are floored in that state since Frazzle works as well as anything else, although with erase spam I just try for Addle II along with Dia/Inundation.
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