Jack Of All Trades: A Guide To Red Mage

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Jack of All Trades: A Guide to Red Mage
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 Cerberus.Tacothecat
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By Cerberus.Tacothecat 2018-09-11 22:59:34  
I popped back to back 45k on Gin before I died, same buffs. I need brd str songs and entrust str from geo to make the damage closer. My goal has been trying to finally break 60k on Maju, but so far I have only done 59k
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By Afania 2018-09-11 23:03:12  
Savage blade drama episode 5, 6, 7 inc.

Edit:
Not interested in this discussion anymore since poster has a history of:

1) claim it isnt uncommon to do 50k savage blade on rdm then post a 50k ws SS on an NM with damage taken+ mechanics.
2) post a video of rdm doing sub 40k ws with brd cor geo buffs on apex and falsely claim they dont have any buffs, and dmg would go higher with more buffs.
3) post a video of himself doing 30k ws on T1 NM then find excuse like "I'm undergeared" as if that proves 50k ws being common is legit.
4) belittle other jobs by saying rdm would toast them for dps.
5) (most important of all) proceed with personal attack and call others immature because they point out flaws in the argument.

If you want others take your opinion about a jobs dps potential seriously in a discussion, you need a better method than this.
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By Boshi 2018-09-11 23:06:23  
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 Asura.Byrne
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By Asura.Byrne 2018-09-12 03:06:57  
Afania said: »
Edit:
Not interested in this discussion anymore since poster has a history of:

1) claim it isnt uncommon to do 50k savage blade on rdm then post a 50k ws SS on an NM with damage taken+ mechanics.
2) post a video of rdm doing sub 40k ws with brd cor geo buffs on apex and falsely claim they dont have any buffs, and dmg would go higher with more buffs.
3) post a video of himself doing 30k ws on T1 NM then find excuse like "I'm undergeared" as if that proves 50k ws being common is legit.
4) belittle other jobs by saying rdm would toast them for dps.
5) (most important of all) proceed with personal attack and call others immature because they point out flaws in the argument.

If you want others take your opinion about a jobs dps potential seriously in a discussion, you need a better method than this.

That's cool. Other people can still be interested in that conversation if they want to be though, right? We don't need your permission do we?

Also you seem to just conflate everyone who has disagreed with you on this point as all being the same person. I'm pretty sure the Apex mob one was me, but then again Apex Bats have an attack down TP move, so that's why I said it was "not ideal". Then again I guess it's impossible for you to just take someone on their word instead of assuming everyone has the worst possible intentions.
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By Afania 2018-09-12 07:03:57  
Asura.Byrne said: »
Afania said: »
Edit:
Not interested in this discussion anymore since poster has a history of:

1) claim it isnt uncommon to do 50k savage blade on rdm then post a 50k ws SS on an NM with damage taken+ mechanics.
2) post a video of rdm doing sub 40k ws with brd cor geo buffs on apex and falsely claim they dont have any buffs, and dmg would go higher with more buffs.
3) post a video of himself doing 30k ws on T1 NM then find excuse like "I'm undergeared" as if that proves 50k ws being common is legit.
4) belittle other jobs by saying rdm would toast them for dps.
5) (most important of all) proceed with personal attack and call others immature because they point out flaws in the argument.

If you want others take your opinion about a jobs dps potential seriously in a discussion, you need a better method than this.

That's cool. Other people can still be interested in that conversation if they want to be though, right? We don't need your permission do we?

I was referring OPs post who quoted your video, not your post.

Also I never say you are not allowed in the discussion. Go ahead, keep going if you have a valid point to make.

My point is that if you want to have a dps discussion, then at least be scientific with data, and be civil if other said your point is not data nor evidence.

Post a video of every ws doing sub 40k then proceed with "oh not optimal because attack down" is not a good evidence to proof 50k argument. Nor post a SS on an NM with damage taken mechanics.

If others don't believe you with evidences like this, don't get mad and call others hater.

Quote:
Then again I guess it's impossible for you to just take someone on their word instead of assuming everyone has the worst possible intentions.

Pretty big assumption about people isn't it?

In dps discussion on a public forum, we value parse data in a controlled environment, calculations sim or spreadsheet maths.

Arguments like "I got attack down in a video" "I do 50k > proceed to post SS on a NM with dmg taken mechanics" or worse yet "If you dont believe me you are hater and ***" are emotional arguments, not data.

I don't give a damn about people's "intention". I only ask for data, not emotions and feelings.
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 Valefor.Gorns
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By Valefor.Gorns 2018-09-12 08:39:36  
Cerberus.Tacothecat said: »
First time I have done any real playing lately, but I wanted to show this since there are some doubtful people. This literally just happened about 15 minutes ago. And I know there are some aspiring rdm that want to see this.

I did not have temper on due to the buff copy, I also did not have brd or geo str buffs, this was just regal neck cors, rema brds, and idris geo with self buffs and sublime sushi

https://imgur.com/a/7RxYrfn

Could you please post your melee, CDC and SB sets ?

Thankx !
 Asura.Byrne
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By Asura.Byrne 2018-09-12 09:38:57  
Afania said: »
Asura.Byrne said: »
Afania said: »
Edit:
Not interested in this discussion anymore since poster has a history of:

1) claim it isnt uncommon to do 50k savage blade on rdm then post a 50k ws SS on an NM with damage taken+ mechanics.
2) post a video of rdm doing sub 40k ws with brd cor geo buffs on apex and falsely claim they dont have any buffs, and dmg would go higher with more buffs.
3) post a video of himself doing 30k ws on T1 NM then find excuse like "I'm undergeared" as if that proves 50k ws being common is legit.
4) belittle other jobs by saying rdm would toast them for dps.
5) (most important of all) proceed with personal attack and call others immature because they point out flaws in the argument.

If you want others take your opinion about a jobs dps potential seriously in a discussion, you need a better method than this.

That's cool. Other people can still be interested in that conversation if they want to be though, right? We don't need your permission do we?

I was referring OPs post who quoted your video, not your post.

Also I never say you are not allowed in the discussion. Go ahead, keep going if you have a valid point to make.

My point is that if you want to have a dps discussion, then at least be scientific with data, and be civil if other said your point is not data nor evidence.

Post a video of every ws doing sub 40k then proceed with "oh not optimal because attack down" is not a good evidence to proof 50k argument. Nor post a SS on an NM with damage taken mechanics.

If others don't believe you with evidences like this, don't get mad and call others hater.

Quote:
Then again I guess it's impossible for you to just take someone on their word instead of assuming everyone has the worst possible intentions.

Pretty big assumption about people isn't it?

In dps discussion on a public forum, we value parse data in a controlled environment, calculations sim or spreadsheet maths.

Arguments like "I got attack down in a video" "I do 50k > proceed to post SS on a NM with dmg taken mechanics" or worse yet "If you dont believe me you are hater and ***" are emotional arguments, not data.

I don't give a damn about people's "intention". I only ask for data, not emotions and feelings.


You are allowed to continue to not believe them if you wish, it's reasonable to be skeptical of claims. That does not mean you have to be an over-emotional primmadonna that goes to every thread where someone says something even remotely similar to a claim that triggered you somewhere else and ***down their mouth just because you feel like it.

Look, I don't even dislike you as a person; people who keep healthy skepticism in a discussion are important; just make sure you're not making an *** out of yourself for no reason while doing so.

Instead of earmarking a discussion like the one brought up here and simply expressing doubt, you say some sarcastic ***about some other thread where you had a different argument (often times from an entirely different person), and mistakenly treat each person as though anything any of them have said is somehow fair to attribute to all of them.

Sure, it may be fueled by exasperation, but that doesn't mean your argument is somehow less emotional. It may be rational, but that doesn't make it non-emotional.
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By Afania 2018-09-12 10:04:04  
This is the post that I made to suggest the target has damage taken+ mechanic, thus not valid to use as a target in a ws avg argument.

Afania said: »
Since its apparently episode 3 of savage blade drama months go....

Glassy gorger and Kirin are 2 NMs that seem to take abnormally high ws dmg. Besides Fu of course.

So I'm already aware 50k ws is possible on that....on more than a couple of jobs.


The first sentence is little bit sarcastic considering OP was the one who literally called me an *** a month ago when I said 50k is not common, I wouldnt say it's over emotional nor even "mistakenly treat each person" when it's not about you.

So are you done with your lecture yet? I thought you are done a month ago. And this discussion has absolutely nothing with you, you just happened to have a video referenced by another guy.

Asura.Byrne said: »
Sure, it may be fueled by exasperation, but that doesn't mean your argument is somehow less emotional. It may be rational, but that doesn't make it non-emotional.

More like people who got mad and react strongly by taking things personal.

In the case of OP, he was careless with his choice of words on a public forum discussion. When others correct him because of his word choice he assumes others are just being ***.

If you want to participate on internet discussion, and have tendency to exaggerate things, you better to be prepared when others challenge the claim.

Here is another thread that when people claim I'm exaggerating I posted an SS to counter it instead of calling them immature ***.

https://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/51608/dev-tracker-discussion/74#3370584

So why cant OP do the same? I mean, he did. But so far the only 50k SS posted are done on an NM with dmg taken+ mechanics. And that's done after he got mad.
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By geigei 2018-09-12 10:07:17  
On a sidenote, landing a 50k ws then getting oneshotted doesnt make you a good dd.
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 Valefor.Gorns
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By Valefor.Gorns 2018-09-12 10:29:12  
Afania said: »
This is the post that I made to suggest the target has damage taken+ mechanic, thus not valid to use as a target in a ws avg argument.

Afania said: »
Since its apparently episode 3 of savage blade drama months go....

Glassy gorger and Kirin are 2 NMs that seem to take abnormally high ws dmg. Besides Fu of course.

So I'm already aware 50k ws is possible on that....on more than a couple of jobs.

Well tbh, who cares about the fact that the NM has damage taken+ mechanic as long as Tacothecat states the buffs he has on ?

You take it as a show-off post like 'look guys I can do 50k SB on xxx NM'

To me, the point is not the WS dmg figures as themselves (40 or 50k in this case) but more to consider these numbers as something I can compare to (with same buff on of course).

If when I SB on this NM and I do 30k whereas this guy does 50k, that only means to me that I have big room of improvment.
 Valefor.Gorns
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By Valefor.Gorns 2018-09-12 10:29:30  
geigei said: »
On a sidenote, landing a 50k ws then getting oneshotted doesnt make you a good dd.

This too.
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By Afania 2018-09-12 11:28:00  
Valefor.Gorns said: »
Afania said: »
This is the post that I made to suggest the target has damage taken+ mechanic, thus not valid to use as a target in a ws avg argument.

Afania said: »
Since its apparently episode 3 of savage blade drama months go....

Glassy gorger and Kirin are 2 NMs that seem to take abnormally high ws dmg. Besides Fu of course.

So I'm already aware 50k ws is possible on that....on more than a couple of jobs.

Well tbh, who cares about the fact that the NM has damage taken+ mechanic as long as Tacothecat states the buffs he has on ?

You take it as a show-off post like 'look guys I can do 50k SB on xxx NM'

To me, the point is not the WS dmg figures as themselves (40 or 50k in this case) but more to consider these numbers as something I can compare to (with same buff on of course).

If when I SB on this NM and I do 30k whereas this guy does 50k, that only means to me that I have big room of improvment.


Well sure, you are free to use the data however you wish. But the entire context of this discussion is drama happened a month ago. So if others interpret the data differently from you, that means you weren't part of drama, nor the one being attacked.

That NM also has absorb buff mechanics associate with DT-. So it may not be the gears causing 20k gap. I think it's overall a bad target to discuss ws dmg anyways.
 Ragnarok.Phuoc
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By Ragnarok.Phuoc 2018-09-12 11:47:47  
Valefor.Gorns said: »
Afania said: »
This is the post that I made to suggest the target has damage taken+ mechanic, thus not valid to use as a target in a ws avg argument.

Afania said: »
Since its apparently episode 3 of savage blade drama months go....

Glassy gorger and Kirin are 2 NMs that seem to take abnormally high ws dmg. Besides Fu of course.

So I'm already aware 50k ws is possible on that....on more than a couple of jobs.

Well tbh, who cares about the fact that the NM has damage taken+ mechanic as long as Tacothecat states the buffs he has on ?

You take it as a show-off post like 'look guys I can do 50k SB on xxx NM'

To me, the point is not the WS dmg figures as themselves (40 or 50k in this case) but more to consider these numbers as something I can compare to (with same buff on of course).

If when I SB on this NM and I do 30k whereas this guy does 50k, that only means to me that I have big room of improvment.

If you and him do SB on the same target with the same buffs and debuffs on the enemy and he does 20k more than you then yea there's a big room of improvement for you.

It's all about those buffs/debuffs really.
 Valefor.Gorns
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By Valefor.Gorns 2018-09-12 12:14:37  
I agree with you, this NM is surely not the best to compare and discuss WS sets.

But still, I tend to think - I may be wrong - that his WS set should be quite good to reach these figures, and Im curious to see what it is so that I could say if mine is better, approx. same or worse than his.

Also I do have read all those pages of drama, not because we don’t post means we don’t read.
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By Afania 2018-09-12 13:11:20  
If you want a more accurate understanding of where should your ws damage sits compare with better gears, try blu spreadsheet and modify it.

That's far more valuable data than a random 50k SS from an NM with damage taken + - mechanics.
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By Boshi 2018-09-12 13:39:06  
Boshi said: »
For savage it's (barring DM):
head: relic+3
body: relic+3
hands: jhakri+2 attack uncapped, af+3 attack capped
legs: jhakri+2
feet: jhakri+2

for CDC:
head: volte capped, taeon 3/3/2020 uncapped
body: volte>ayanmo barely attack capped, taeon 3/3/2020 uncapped
hands: volte attack capped, jhakri uncapped
legs: relic+3
feet: thereoid.
taeon 3/3/20/20 means 3critR/3critD/20accatt

Savage:
ammo: floestone
neck: caro uncapped attack, Duelist's+2 capped attack
ear1: Ishvara
ear2: Moonshade, 3k Moonshade swap: Regal capped, Tati+1 Uncapped
Ring1: Epaminondas's Ring
Ring2: (SoA: Karieyh +1) > Capped attack Rufescent / uncapped Shyuku
cape: str30/accatt20/wsd10
belt: Prosilio+1 uncapped, Metalsinger capped (rarely a favourable swap)

Feet are the best slot to get a DM aug on atm out of body/legs/feet

CDC:
ammo: yetshila+1 onry
neck: fotia
ear1: Mache+1
ear2: Mache+1
Ring1: Ilabrat
Ring2: Begrudging
cape: dex30/accatt20/critR10
belt:fotia

ayanmo can be a low-acc swap at feet

(unrelated but Paeapua > Ginsen for tp)


ANYWAYSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
let's cut the need to try and show off Savage numbers once ever 2 months off and get back to the VERY interesting post that all this nonsense made us skip over:
Shiva.Cziella said: »
these were nq path C for dynamis sword
sword enhancement spell +300%
elemental weapon skill dmg % (doesn't say a number)

i'm guessing nq is 300, hq, 350, hq2 +400% and the 3rd augment +DMG like all others
base enspell dmg unresisted with gear is 103 without weapons (106 with x2 swords)
+400% would make enspell base dmg... 515-530?
(I also think Orpheus's works, wonder if they're multiplicative)
Even if it only works on the mainhand... When your macc allows the white dmg on this is pretty ridiculous in theory.
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 Leviathan.Celebrindal
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By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2018-09-12 13:55:22  
gonna go and safely assume that +enspell is only for the Su5 weapon (yea, with lower values for Su3/Su4 versions) and so that means its only going to give that +dmg while that weapon is mainhand and ONLY on the hits for the dyna sword?
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By Aerix 2018-09-12 14:49:42  
Boshi said: »
(unrelated but Paeapua > Ginsen for tp)

Pretty sure that only holds true on the spreadsheets. TA becomes less valuable the more you stack and with Temper II you already have a very high base. Ginsen not only offers STP but also Acc/Atk.
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 Asura.Topace
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By Asura.Topace 2018-09-18 19:25:24  
When does the Duelist torque beat incantors for enhancing duration? When it reaches 10%?


Also does anyone have a rdm lua they can post? The OP is so descriptive in the sets mine doesn't go nearly that detailed.
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By Asura.Hadroncollider 2018-09-18 19:36:31  
I think I understand the Question in Detail... but it makes no sense.
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 Asura.Topace
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By Asura.Topace 2018-09-18 19:45:47  
Asura.Hadroncollider said: »
I think I understand the Question in Detail... but it makes no sense.
I have duelist torque+1 that's at rank 1 atm. At what point can I swap out the incantor torque with it without losing any duration.
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By Shiva.Cziella 2018-09-18 19:52:15  
I believe someone posted in the BG-Wiki the HQ2 of RDM sword that came from the jp-wiki, it says Sword Enhancement spell +500% and elemental weapon skill damage +100%

That makes for some big enspell dmg, and some good sanguine blades, sanguine isn't the best sword WS, but it's decent and seeing how most ppl favor leaden salute set ups, spaming sanguine blade while they do malaise/languor/rayke/gambit for Leaden, it could turn out some nice extra damage, while not killing the SC.
 Shiva.Cziella
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By Shiva.Cziella 2018-09-18 19:56:21  
Asura.Topace said: »
I have duelist torque+1 that's at rank 1 atm. At what point can I swap out the incantor torque with it without losing any duration.
Incator's torque has no enhancing magic duration, just magic skills +10 (which can translate to +10 enhancing) but enhancing skill alone does not contributes to duration at all (only to barspells i think? but those cap low skill), only potency to certain spells.
 Asura.Topace
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By Asura.Topace 2018-09-18 20:02:04  
Shiva.Cziella said: »
Asura.Topace said: »
I have duelist torque+1 that's at rank 1 atm. At what point can I swap out the incantor torque with it without losing any duration.
Incator's torque has no enhancing magic duration, just magic skills +10 (which can translate to +10 enhancing) but enhancing skill alone does not contributes to duration at all (only to barspells i think? but those cap low skill), only potency to certain spells.
Ohhh thanks!
 Carbuncle.Galaga
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By Carbuncle.Galaga 2018-09-21 23:46:34  
Duelist Torque (at least the NQ) seems to be bugged. The Enhancing duration bonus only applied to self-cast. Enfeebling duration bonus was working as expected.
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 Asura.Chiaia
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By Asura.Chiaia 2018-09-22 01:58:27  
Carbuncle.Galaga said: »
Duelist Torque (at least the NQ) seems to be bugged. The Enhancing duration bonus only applied to self-cast. Enfeebling duration bonus was working as expected.
Do you mean it only seems to be working on stuff you cast on yourself but not stuff you cast on others or did you mean you thought it would extend the duration if others cast on you also?

It's not duration received so it will not help if others cast on you.
 Carbuncle.Galaga
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By Carbuncle.Galaga 2018-09-22 12:33:47  
Correct, I tested it on RDM by casting Haste II on myself and our LS (and trusts) in my enhancing duration set w/ Composure.
Torque was only Rank 12 (12% duration bonus)

Haste II self : went from 24:09 to 25:50.
Haste II others : stayed at 8:38.
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 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2018-09-22 12:51:32  
Are you talking about times you measured yourself or times displayed by the "timers" plug in?
 Cerberus.Shadowmeld
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By Cerberus.Shadowmeld 2018-09-22 12:52:17  
Was this tested using the timers plugin?

If so, usually have to wait for someone to update the plugin before it handles new equipment.
 Carbuncle.Galaga
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By Carbuncle.Galaga 2018-09-22 13:15:51  
Times were all measured in game with "wears off" messages. Did a few more tests today under more controlled conditions (Neck only equipped, no gearswap, etc) to verify.

After Chiaia's post, I tested a SMN/WHM casting Haste I on me with the neck, as I was suspicious.

Without neck 3:00 as expected,
With neck on ~3:21

So it looks like it's incorrectly acting as Received duration.
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