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It isn't just about BLU vs RDM, but it is a useful example. So is BLU vs DNC, BLU vs NIN, BLU vs MNK, BLU vs anything.

If going all out on BLU for DPS, you are correct, you won't be stopping to cast. Except, perhaps, inbetween mobs, at which times specialized DPS have really nothing to do. So, advantage: BLU
If going all out for DPS and something goes wrong, specialized DPS have nothing else to do but swap gear and clench their cheeks. BLU could do that, if it will be enough. Or stop to cast something. If they live and the specialized DPS dies... Advantage: BLU

Each event, each battle, is its own instance. Its own microcosm. BLU doesn't need to be everything at once, ever. And that is why it is too good as designed, given how the content, the game itself, is designed.

We simply disagree on what a basic competence level is.

My points stand lol, i've done up to VD this month so your attempt to make me look bad failed and this tend of scrubs trying to be forum bullies is getting old and again, before talking ***about XX job get informed first, you are very ignorant.

It is if you dual wield clubs!

I'm pretty sure WAR is better.

Edit: You can clearly see who is the person trying to make the other look bad, you called me out I showed you whats the deal~
Live with it and move on, no need to embarrass yourself :)
Please share with us your VD strat on BLU without MP, I would really like to know how you pulled it off without shadows~

also a DRG with a Staff~

Hundred fist dual wielding! Hundred clubbing!

I'm getting a little tired of this, as I'm sure you are too, but I'd still like to address a few things:


1. Stopping in between mobs is a specific example, and even still doesn't really support your point. That sounds like CPing, and even then if you're in a good CP group, you should have new mobs sleeping and ready to be engaged, meaning if you are going to cast stuff, you're not going to be able to engage and get tp or WS on the new mob. If it's a single NM, moot point, and if it has adds, same deal as the cp party.

2. Every DPS specialist has something they can do, with the possible exception of drk in situations where they can't get a good drain off. SAM has Third Eye and Seigan, DRG can shed hate, WAR has Defender and defense bonus traits and probably something else I can't remember, and Drk has drain1/2/3. A Lionheart RUN does crazy damage and has tons of tools available to survive, not to mention has an elevated base parry rate and can resist a lot of status debuffs. The jobs which BLU directly competes with (NIN, THF and DNC come to mind, basically the non-pet hybrid DDs) also have plenty of things they can do, and none of them rely on MP. They also do very good damage in the hands of an experienced and dedicated player. BLU may have a wider range of possibilities, but as stated before, they do come with costs if you make use of them, and every tool that every DD job has access to is merely a supplement to a DT- set that every DD should have. The situation is not as dire as you're making it out to be.


If the job specifically designed as the ultimate jack of all trades that can swap roles to fit the situation is not allowed to tweak itself to fit different situations, then what is the point? I define basic competence as the ability to function adequately (but not optimally) in a given role, to an extent that makes either the job worth bringing for that role (assuming no better choice is available), or the specific spells/abilities worth using for that role, but with a specialist still preferred for it if available. If you cannot function in the roles to a level that is worth bringing as a backup or last resort, you are a Jack of No Trades, and the job is either useless or is no longer the job it was originally intended to be.

"Ultimate" and "jack of all trades" should never appear in the same statement. That is where we disagree.

CP is endgame. Until close to Master, job points are a great way to maximize a job. Much of Omen is CP party with objectives. Not only could a BLU be in charge of sleeping the mobs you describe, something specialized DPS could not generally do and certainly not AOE. BLU is also uniquely positioned to complete Omen objectives on its own. Build a diverse party, or just use BLUs is my point.

Third Eye and Seigan are as useless to save a SAM as counter is to saving a MNK. Two JAs also would not go off as quickly as a spell. DRG could shed hate... Sacrificing anyone else in the area/next person in danger. Defender? Really? Of these examples, RUN comes closest to being able to DD and save everyones bacon like BLU can. It can AOE protect a party from magic damage, but I'd pick Sudden Lunge in most cases. Not all, but most. BLU can also cure itself and others much better than RUN. I go through each to show I've given consideration to all of your thoughts. However, my position is not that other jobs are not viable. My point is that BLU can replace any other job in most situations. It creeps far too closely to the specialists. Each of your examples has a slightly less effective or equal answer to an "Oh shi-!" moment than BLU has. A jack of all trades, master of none would not have better, comparable but never worse answers to a situation.

To your last point, BLU is rarely brought as a back-up to any of the roles it plays. It is brought as the primary member to play the roles, any role, it is given. If a BLU is brought for haste, there doesn't need to be a primary haste. If a BLU is brought to sleep, there doesn't need to be a primary sleep. If a BLU is brought to DPS, there doesn't need to be another type of DPS to get the job done quickly. On and on.

That is all.

Consider this... Has this ever happened?

"I'm sorry everyone, we can't do X. All I can find looking for party are BLUs."

I'm sure it has happened quite a bit, lol

"CP is endgame."

That's all I needed to hear.

Yep. Other than the fact that BLU really is not as good at these things as you think they are, most players are not geared or experienced enough to do any and every role on blu. Most just try to DD, and suck at it. My blu is only geared and spec'd for DPS (with various spellset versions depending on what support spells are most useful for the content) and cleaving. I don't bother making a dedicated main-healing gear and spell set because I have WHM. I don't bother making a dedicated tanking gear and spell set because I have RUN.

Wut?

But that's not a very good point, because bringing a diverse party is BETTER than just using blus. The fact that you CAN use only blus on some stuff is a by-product of having this style of job in the game. Of course you can bring a bunch of JOATs and have each take a different role and be successful, it's the nature of a job that can tackle multiple roles. But it's sub-optimal gameplay.



And? So what? If you have a tank, then the next person in the hate list is probably going to be the tank. If not, or if all the DDs have surpassed the tank, then bouncing hate around is how everyone stays alive until control is regained.

Yea. You said they couldn't do anything, and +25% Def is not nothing, esp when coupled with Prot5 and a DT set. It's not amazing but it makes a difference if you have to turtle up.

Resistance to Sudden Lunge (and most blu hybrid debuffs if I'm not mistaken) builds incredibly fast, and is subject to 2 separate accuracy checks (phys acc and macc). For magic damage mitigation, Valiance and OFA are superior by a mile, as is Odyllic Subterfuge. It's not even close.



The role it is most often given is as a sturdy DPS with a few tricks to help, mostly Mighty Guard. And you still need a haster, because MG is only what, 15% haste? Backline sleepers are usually preferable if you have them, but you cannot honestly be upset that drg and war can't sleep mobs. They get to top the parse instead. BLU gets to have tricks up its sleeve. And the idea that if you have blus, you don't need other kinds of DPS is utter BS. Depending on the content, BLUs might be enough, but they won't be the fastest, and their SC options are pretty limited. Just one fusion-having DD makes a big difference for SC damage.

But not to an equal degree, and that is the point. You need to get over the fact that a well-designed jack of all trades style class is SUPPOSED to be able to do everyone else's job, just not as well and not necessarily all at the same time. That is the core mechanic, and it works fine. Nobody who is really trying to beat endgame content is intentionally bringing only blus to fill every role because it's the best strategy. It isn't.

Deja Vu.

The power growth gained from CP far outweighs the benefits from most any other activity in this game. If "powering up" through killing NMs, camping the AH or crafting for gear constitutes endgame, so too does getting three stars to float over your head. Sure, it can be solo'd. But so can any AG'd REM.
Any endgame mob at this point gives CP.
Omen is the newest content, and is considered endgame. It is largely one big CP party with objectives.

Also, if you can hear the words on your screen... You may want to look into that.

In this context, "endgame content" refers to the difficulty of the content, not the rewards. Apex Crabs are not Reisen HELMs. Stop equivocating.

Also, just to clarify, when I said "back-up", I meant either temporarily in an emergency, or as a substitute due to not having access to a specialist. A blu being invited to main tank is a backup in the sense that if you could have a PLD or a RUN, you'd have them tank instead. Just so we're clear.

Just because you don't bother doesn't mean it can't work better than it honestly should.

Was a response supposed to be here? Using a JA has a unique delay.

See above. It isn't a radical position.

Subjective. It works better than it honestly should.

Then shedding hate wouldn't be optimal to bounce hate around, it takes itself out of the running. Jump is completely self-serving, hoping that something a bit more sturdy is there to eat all the hits. Jump would be used for a lot of reasons, TP-gain, keeping hate on a tank to proactively prevent an "Oh shi-" moment, but it isn't a great choice in the event a tank goes down *if* the recovery strategy is to bounce hate. You are looking everywhere but at the obvious truth I'm sharing with you.

You believe this, but feeling CP is a part of endgame strikes you as odd?

Varies by content and gear set. Try gearing it and using it more, I think you will come to love it.



Pair Mighty Guard with Refueling.
DRG tops the parse? And WAR needs help with haste that BLU does not. If you are going to consider the benefits of WAR in a vacuum, that only helps itself, to fairly compare, you must do the same for BLU.
On most content, BLU is more than enough. Which is why you use it to wreck sht, as you said in a previous post. There is no sense in pretending it is less than it is.

That is precisely the complaint. Especially in an environment that restricts BRD, COR and GEO buffs.

Ok, I've had enough of the self-righteous ignorance. Carry on.

I agree with oyama that blu isnt the best in all circumstances because for example, taking into consideration these situations:

- You do T4/helms nuke style, blu doesnt really fit here outside T3 and below where another nuker would be better.

- You do Tr/helms ranged style, unless you wanna entomb albumen adds for resleep blu is pretty there for MG and support heals if any.

- Situations where your other group DDs are exceptionally geared/skilled/very good like ejiin or primex and you are gonna zerg hard stuff down, i'd rather have the blu change to geo/cor/support.

And i cant really think of any other endgame situation really, you wont replace a brd-cor-geo for buffing purposes or a whm-sch for healing, blu have unique buffs/heals and while it can do them pretty well, those jobs do their speciality better imo but blu complements said jobs with unique buffs and damage mitigation spells.

I personally dont do blu past omen content lvl (140) because i i personally think out of the 4 strats i tried vs sky T4 and reisen helms, smn AC wins hands down in efficiency and speed, heck even in the last aeonic i made with my last group, we were carrying 2 leechers lol.

We all agree that BLU isn't the best in all circumstances. But it can fill into most any role much better than it should, often to the point that it is comparable to a specialist for said role.

At the higher levels of content, there will always be a few roles BLU could not assume. I'll try to limit it to two. It helps that you brought up Reisenjima, since vorseals really help BLU with any MP concerns.

I'm pretty sure the only HELM widely done nuke-style is Zerde. It would be a poor choice to replace the BLMs with BLUs, so that is a role I wouldn't change. The BLMs also cover stunning, so that leaves: GEO bubbles, making skill chains, tanking and healing.
I haven't tried it, but would be interesting to see if two BLUs could tank and heal through the short fight. BLUs could definitely slug it out and make Lights, replacing the SCH. There would be some trial and error, but I think it is possible.

Anything done RNG-style could also and has been done melee-style. Wouldn't be able to replace the BRDs, CORs or GEOs, for sure. But BLUs are less likely to need BRDs, anyway.

Anyway, those are my two cents.

The fact you are arguing over something so trivial is lol. You can bring MNK dds with support and be withing a minute or two of BLU DDs.

BLU is just pretty good at a lot of things. And, to do those other things, it comes at a loss of DPS.

BLU is great at a lot of things. With the best tank, healing and support available, MNK has been shown to be capable of beating Albumen. But that is MNK's specific job, to DPS, yet BLU is able to do better damage, faster and with greater survivability.

Let's be honest, anything we discuss here is trivial. Any concern we have about FFXI is a first world problem.

BLU is great at cleaving. Good at a lot of others. Almost all the other things require Tizona or vorseals

Tizona and vorseals are not the only form of refresh available to BLU. Tizona is a game-changer, though. I wouldn't discourage anyone from making one if they are serious about BLU.
BLU is incredible at cleaving.
Also great for straight up DPS, debuffing (attack down, sleeping, gravity'ing), stunning, status-removal, AOE curing, buffing (defense, haste), refresh... The list is quiet extensive and complete. That is why it is so popular.

I'm grasping at straws here:
Only when I came back to the game like 2 years ago.

Level BLU, WAR/DRK/DRG sucks they said.

But all BST was also the mind set at the time too.

It was pretty short lived though, and ignorance was partially to blame.

Having to /anon my WAR in souveran and sub whm just to get some JP. The struggle was real :P

Its like it suddenly clicked that more jobs than BST could self skillchain. Also purely MBing Apex Apex was inefficient imo. Atleast with shout groups.

Those were dark times. Now everybody wants to WAR

I love BLU for Mighty Guard/Short fights. They pair well with different DDs.

A lot of things do not land on end game things. Even with the best gear. Without Tizona or vorseals you won't be able to maintain MP if you are meleeing/having to spam spells.

BLU is what? The 4th-8th? Dps, I wouldn't call that great. Buffing anyone else is on a 10 minute timer. On fodder/low man situations BLU is great.

New equipment added to ambuscade?

I'm not sure about BLU being 4th-8th, I run a nearly perfect BLU (Tizona, Almace, HQ Adhemar Set, etc) And I still usually come out on top in Ambuscades and Omen runs against SAMs WARs and DRKs that were pretty well geared. Actually only lost parse once vs a DRK against Sovereign Behemoth and even that was within 1-2%. Maybe it was an issue of buffs/lack there of? Idk. But I wouldn't dismiss BLU so easily. At least not well tempered ones.

Sure hope that means we gonna get +2 version of the 5 remaining sets!

NOMNOM AYANMO+2! :Q__ __ ___ ____

With people on one side describing BLU as it's the fusion of Jesus, Buddha and Krishna for DDs, a lot of other people feel so "offended" by this exagerated lie that they feel the need to exagerate in the opposite direction and claim BLU is so shitty it's almost as bad as MNK.

I'm hyperbolizing here but it's not so far from what happened hey!
As it often happens, the truth stands somewhere in between those extremes.