Nin Update..

ok after a few hours of playing with it heres the low down.

Yonin: Frankly..it sucks. Too much -acc and not enough enmity+ to make up for it. Better off just straight tanking without it. Besides..it only works of the mob is facing u -.- which most of the time it wont be.

Innin: actually this ja works really well. Was getting close to 4/10 crit average on campaign mobs and I never saw a miss. The Enmity- is quite a bit. 1k Blade: Jin followed by 3 provokes with emnity+7 gear and still didnt get hate from a mnk. Acc+ is a good bit as well id guess close to 10? correct me if im wrong.

All in all i think Innin was a good addition but Yonin is severly broken for a nin that wants to tank well. Too much -acc not enough enmity+ (as said before). Enmity +7 (again from gear) + Yonin with provoke still could not keep hate off of an average geared sam. Also, the acc down must be pretty severe. With Yonin on with full ws gear, Blade:Jin only hit for 50 dmg (wtf...seriously...) but with Innin it hit for almost 900.

Just a bit a info on them incase some of you hadnt had the chance to try them out.

Edit: The evasion boost from Yonin is actually pretty high it seems. Tanking without a SH and still evaded 7/10 attacks from imps.

I believe for practical uses Yonin would be intended for NM/HNM tanking with estaff where you aren't really concerned with melee stats. Good to know Innin is performing well, though.

yea...sadly people still see Nin as a tank and not a DD no matter what abilities/gear u have lol.

I suppose Yonin will be good for soloing in cases when you're eating sushi to make up for it. Or really delicate fights such as Charby for example. Hopefully SE tilts the scale in a future patch to make it worthwhile for party/merit uses.

I can definately see Yonin being used for god fights where u will be kiting or somethinkg like charby (as stated by Artemicion) but yea for general party use it fails. U will see the mobs *** more if you use yonin than if not

I'm assuming it's a double edged sword that ends up being counter productive to its cause. In other words, within the accuracy it takes away, you're doing less melee damage/hits and thus losing more enmity than the amount given can make up for it.

pretty much.

I don't know why they even thought about giving ninja negative accuracy under any circumstance. That's like taking away a crippled man's wheelchair. Not cool.

Well yonin is supposed to be like the opposite of Innin..so More acc less enmity...more enmity less acc..kinda like light and black arts for sch i guess.

Actually Yonin gives a near-100% Ninja Tool Expertise too. So now you cheap-*** noob NINs can spam the elemental wheel and Ninjutsu debuffs with no excuse.

Also, gives +25 Enmity.

Edit:+25 enmity is pretty damn close to +25%, meaning Ninjutsu (NIN's main source of hate) is highly modded enmitywise. I would not be surprised in the least if a NIN/DNC could hold hate off a PLD now.

Edit2: I lied. It's actually 100% Ninja Tool Expertise. Now 1 Shihei is all you need. ^^

I think that's the point of Yonin. To spam Ninjutsu for hate instead of meleeing.

I forget, do they share the same recast or are they interchangable like Hasso & Seigan are? If they are, I see alot of nifty switch-a-roo opportunities to take advantage of.

No, both 5min same line

They share the same timer, like Accomplice and Collaborator for Thf.

share same recast and are u sure that its 100% expertise? if so..then Yonin isnt as useless as i thought (i havnt tested the tool expertise yet)

Well ***. I guess it's best to leave them off until the situation calls for its need.

My Nin friends tested.
It proc'd every single time.

NICE! So..i guess the new nin tanking setup will be wind/earth staff spamming ninjitsu. Thanks for that info! I suddenly love ninja now..

I smell the usual post-update maintenance here, that will be fixed I guess.

I did not have an acc problem with Yonin at all. nin/dnc ate sole sushi and used quickstep and i did not have the acc problem I keep hearing about. I evaded more and kept hate while duoing in Xarcabard {s} only acc pieces i wear are SH and O-hat the rest are eva pieces/haste pieces

>:o it better not be! thats the only thing that makes Yonin useful..

Well, alot of this depends on what you're fighting, but for what you were wearing, eating and debuffing on the mob should definitely account for better accuracy, even with Yonin active.

Does he have it merited

One had 4/5, other had 5/5.

its true...100% proc..staff tanking ftw

Each merit in Ninja Tool Expertise is roughly 5% activation rate correct? So assuming you capped it that would be roughly 25% of the time... So it's fairly safe to assume that Yonin gives at least 50% proc rate... perhaps more realistically 75% proc rate which is really really good.

Yonin gives loads of evasion and enmity. my nin friend pulled hate off my 2-3 round polearm swings on a torama by walking in front of it, and landing a single hit. -acc did not seem to be a problem, and the evasion boost helped him to evade every single attack from adamantoise (well, casted ni once, and later helped tremendously for duoing Ose (got my AJ ;D)

Edit: 100% ninja tool expertise without merits for sure, he only used 1 tool the whole time down there(onzozo), cuz he forgot to put up yonin

I really doubt SE would be awesome enough to give us a 45% cap on ninja tool expertise alone. They're just not that nice with us, even with recycle. Wiki says it's 5% per merit and I'm just gonna assume that's what it is, besides why would it go above and beyond 100% with the use of the JA and capped merits? It should either hit 100% evenly or be just slightly below it at worst.

Bah, don't ninja delete your post when I make a lengthy response to it D:

Lol quote that ***!

yea im tired, i thought wrong, 25% is what it is, i was mixing thoughts of Koga tekko and then i thought 25% was base and it IS 5% per merit lol