IiPunch - Monk Guide

To Sechs, that was my fault on VSmite, I only had it listed at 1000 TP because its mod is only Crit Rate as you said. With Impetus up and Standard BRD/COR Buffs it was putting an 80k Average with Vereth which is nutty O_o; but it makes sense with forced DA and healthy chunks of PDL to work with.


Ahhh ok it was erroneous then, good to know. At 2000 TP it was still equipping Moonshade and Mpaca Cap for the full 950, so effectively 3000TP WSs. Literally every major WS was 80k+ with Howling Fist Averaging 88k without Aria.

I almost wonder if an argument could be made to hold TP to 2000 but only if using Ampulla and SAM roll just from the sheer weight of that boost. Obviously WSing ASAP if Warcry is on in those same conditions. Or would still be a loss?

As an aside, why limit to 99k? The hard cap is 99k so if the average polls above that, I’ll just know it’ll cap out frequently. Or does it mess with the Sim in some way?

Edit: Grammar Fixes

This isn't true or we have wrong info on fTP/WSC Maru Kala.

I'm more leaning to anecdotal shenanigans. You are probably compering Warcry Disasters and Hover shot Sarv to 1000TP Maru Kalas or uneven buffs scenarios (MNK without Berserk might not be capped).

Disaster
60% STR, 60% VIT 3.05~6.10~9.15 fTP
Base weapon damage: 380
Max fstr: 50

Maru Kala
60% STR, 60% DEX 3.092~7.516~11.94 fTP
Base weapon damage: ~300
max fstr: 24

Same buffs, capped attack, no warcry, bis sets, Median:
Maru Kala, WS asap : 65434
Maru Kala, WS 3000TP : 129839
Disaster, WS asap : 56161
Disaster, WS 3000TP : 118204

I always thought the most effective tp range to weaponskill on monk was in the effective 2500 to 2800 range. Raging, howling, tornado and dragon all scale harder from 2k to 3k than they do from 1k to 2k, and we get tp so fast that going from 1k tp to 1800 tp happens in a flash anyway. Same goes for maru kala actually. Victory smite is the only weaponskill I think makes sense to fire off as close to 1k as possible. Even with godhands I think it makes sense to hold tp until 1500 to 1800 and use the full 950 tp bonus to really take advantage of the 2-3k range tp scaling on our weaponskills. I very frequently hold tp until 2k with varga.

This is without hoxne ampulla mind. I'll get the thing sooner or later. Right now it's still a little steep to buy off the auction house.

If you sim without the 99k cap, it will take WSs above 99999 to inflate avg. Like for example avg of 160k, 160, 80k, 80k is 120k. While in game avg would be 89.999 because those 160k would be capped to 99999.

Understood.

Yeahhh I remember seeing that as well. I’ll have to dig through and find the page and quote it but I distinctly remember it being mathed out to hold TP even with Godhands to capitalize on that spike. Unless self-Skillchaining of course.

I'm going off my own experiences. I have four primes now and I've had time to use each and every one of them. I've geared to their strengths and I've become pretty familiar with what they can do. I run with a static and I consistently have very similar buffs. My bard is fully decked out with all the bells and whistles, so I always have aria. I follow a similar playstyle with all my remas, consistently weaponskilling in the effective 2500-2800 tp range on them. All of my major tp scaling weaponskills; sarv, maru kala, ruthless, rudra's, and disaster have tp scaling that favors weaponskilling closer to effective 3000 tp than sooner, and my warrior and monk both have similar dps focused builds that put up big white damage numbers while silmultaneously getting fast tp.

From every experience I've had with these weapons, in every scenario, disaster does more damage on average than maru kala. Generalizing I would say it's about 20 to 30% more. Sarv does even more damage than disaster on average, but the nuances between ranged tp fight versus flat melee means I can't really compare the two. Maybe this difference is because Laphria has a higher base damage, maybe it's because I have more PDL on warrior than I do on monk, maybe it's because of some other factor, but maru kala has consistently ...always, and every time I used it, fallen short of disaster. And the numbers each weapon outputs are always similar.

I'm not going off spreadsheets here. I'm going off real in game experience playing with these primes under full party buff , in real fights in real content. The weapons are different and that plays a part. But I do not believe maru kala is as good as disaster. It is very strong. Varga is an incredible weapon. I prefer varga to godhands now. But I prefer it because of the whole package that varga has. Extremely high white damage. Check. Fulltime empyrean aftermath 1 effect. check. Very high base damage with great stat mods so the usual monk rotation is all working at peak numbers. Check. And it has a unique weaponskill that benefits from the WSD meta, so my nyame and WSD gear really shines with kala, and it skillchains darkness which monk has no other good way of making solo. Check!

Maru kala is STRONG. it's just not AS STRONG as the 2 handed prime weaponskills.

With Godhands Footwork and using Hoxne you definitely don't want to wait at all if you are in high attack scenario, because you will be doing 90k+ Tornado anyway and there is very little or none WS damage to gain. If you proc TA on one hand it's guaranteed 99k too.

Even assuming lower attack scenario and Howling Fist, waiting for 1500TP doesn't change dps at all. Lower ws frequency, higher white damage and higher WS damage will even out to the same dps level. waiting for 2000TP start to be a dps loss.

Maru Kala is the same. Holding tp is generally dps neutral.

Ofc if you have warcry from WAR you always want to WS asap.

You are compering apples to oranges. Are you using both at the same TP with same buffs in the same fights, or are you talking about different fights, different buffs, using warcry and possibly MS.

If you are not capping attack, berserk will push Disaster numbers by a lot compered to Maru Kala. If you are fighting targets with DT, tomhawk will push Disaster numbers too.
Unless it's proven wrong, Disaster higher numbers are because of buffs/debuffs, not WS itself. Like for example take MNK to Sortie basement bosses and pair it with WAR and GEO, so both have Warcry up and high attack and report then.

EDIT: I also assume you have bis gear for Maru Kala, right?

This is going to become a point of contention between some posters going forward I can tell. I don't own Hoxne ampulla yet. I intend to buy hoxne ampulla in the future, and I do intend to use it, but it will be sparingly. there is going to be a rift between players who are more wealthy versus those who generally farm enough gil to maintain their needs and get by. I fall into the latter camp. When I have something I want to buy I will go out of my way to increase my farming efforts, but otherwise I tend to let my gil income flow in more passively from dailys and monthlys.

I will not be changing my playstyle to revolve around the ampulla, and in most cases I won't be using it. It's not necessary to clear casual content and it's extremely expensive to maintain for the benefit. I will base most of my discussions around the assumption of NOT having the ampulla active, even though I do intend to indulge myself and use it from time to time. I'll have sets both for and without the ampulla.


And this is fine. DPS neutral is just that. It's a difference in play style. Neither one is going to make a significant impact on your overall numbers. Most jobs nowadays have roughly an 85% weaponskill to 15% white damage spread. Samurai leans more heavily toward a 90% to 10% spread, whereas monk and thief lean more toward 70 % weaponskill to 30% white damage or even 65% / 35% ratio. But for the most part we are in a meta where the bulk of a players damage comes from their weaponskill numbers. DPS neutral does not significantly impact that scaling one way or another. There is a valid argument to holding tp, especially when we multi attack and over tp so fast that weaponskill animation delay starts to become a factor.

We are not in the 75 era anymore. Going from 1000 tp to 1800 tp happens in a single attack round nowadays, and sometimes you can overflow to 2200 accidentally in the flash of an eye. I don't believe this "immediately weaponskilling asap at 1k" is nearly as impactful in real practice as some make it sound. Not when we're all walking around with 80% WSD in our sets and spamming savage blade -esque skills that scale HARD from 2k to 3k.

I will acknowledge the amulla does change that. And it is a personal prefernce that I am omitting the ampulla from the bulk of my discussions. I'm fine with you mathing it out, and encourage it. You're giving us some VERY good information to make the best use of the ampulla simon, and I will be using it sometimes. But for non ampulla play, i do not believe my playstyle is wrong. And I know how my primes work. I stand by everything I said firmly.

EDIT:


Of course. I said I took the time to build these sets to optimize them. This is mine. Nyame is rank 30 . Bhikku earring is about 75% max potency, with 11 strength and 11 dex. I suppose I could swap epa ring for regal ring, and Hesychast's crown +4 is an interesting option over Mpaca's, but I'm pretty sure mpaca's is the better choice. This is my set. It's as good as it gets. Cape is full strength and 10 WSD.

ItemSet 400222

Your set is bis set for uncapped attack.
For high attack set you are missing a lot of pdl.

High attack scenario with aria this set should be doing around 78785 median if you wait to ~1750TP.
Now below set would be doing over 92k
*bhikku+2 earring would be even higher, almost 93k but I like to have 25% SBII in WS set too and it's very rare earring anyway. I know you have different TVR ring, but this is generally what you are loosing in term of damage at high attack scenario.

20M drop today, down to 150M, 8 in stock. Gonna be sub 100M by March