Did Amplifiers Change In Any Horrible Way Sep14?

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did amplifiers change in any horrible way Sep14?
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 Siren.Codegen
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By Siren.Codegen 2021-09-15 01:10:29  
http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/polnews/news26535.shtml

"The following known issues have been addressed:

-During the Sheol: Gaol Odyssey battle content, the bonus for earning Reinforcement Points during the three rounds were given even if the clear requirements were not met."

I am worried that, say, taking a v15 to 94% is no longer enough to get bonus RPs, or that you can no longer get ~800 RP using amplifiers during 3x fights on each fight after you get the 3200RP on the first amplifier.
If anybody notices anything like that or knows what actually changed, please post here...
 
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 Asura.Syto
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By Asura.Syto 2021-09-15 01:45:55  
Most likely they fixed it...

This was a bug. Many knew this from the beginning..

It is against the longevity plan they had to keep people playing till end of 2022's next content..

Took them 3 months to fix it... or...did they just add more bugs instead?..lol

Here's SE's new Dev Team for you...

Someone will confirm soon.. Let's see if they fixed this bug..
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 Asura.Zidaner
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By Asura.Zidaner 2021-09-15 03:54:24  
Can you still get the 800RP from just doing a single amp run to 94%? I mean it's not as good as 3100 but it's something? ;/
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By SimonSes 2021-09-15 04:20:15  
Asura.Zidaner said: »
Can you still get the 800RP from just doing a single amp run to 94%? I mean it's not as good as 3100 but it's something? ;/

None said you cant get 3100.
None said anything has really changed yet.
Its speculation until someone test it.
My bet is 50/50 on either not being able to get amplifier bonus when you don't kill all 3 NMs, or just some random bug being fixed that most people don't even know occurred under some conditions, that doesn't change anything at all.
 Asura.Brennski
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By Asura.Brennski 2021-09-15 04:24:32  
Just did Gigelorum with an Amplifier, got it to 85% and left with 813 RP.

So still getting boosted RP from partial kills.

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By SimonSes 2021-09-15 04:33:29  
Asura.Brennski said: »
Just did Gigelorum with an Amplifier, got it to 85% and left with 813 RP.

So still getting boosted RP from partial kills.


Yeah, so now I am even more sure it's 3 kills for amplifier bonus, or some bug most of us haven't even know about.
 Siren.Codegen
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By Siren.Codegen 2021-09-15 05:03:54  
Yeah I also tried soloing Arebati V15 and got 803 points for getting it to 90%. I actually messed up because the first battle I forgot to use an amplifier and got only 9 points, then the second try I forgot to use a reraiser and finally I stopped messing up and got that 803 points on arebati v15.

There is still a small chance that the first time it worked because I already had the charge from before, but that this 90% time out will not have charged my amplifier for the next time.. but maybe I am being too pessimistic.


But probably it's even more likely that they had introduced a new bug in the most recent update that most people didn't even notice and maybe they just fixed that, let's hope that's the case, hopefully someone can confirm the 3x wins case soon
 Shiva.Thorny
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By Shiva.Thorny 2021-09-15 05:27:22  
'Please don't make us actually do the content ;(' ..pathetic.

Don't worry, it's related to an actual bug, you can continue playing your login-to-win game:
https://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/54555/the-odyssey-strategy-and-discussion/154/#3591529
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By SimonSes 2021-09-15 05:37:57  
Shiva.Thorny said: »
'Please don't make us actually do the content ;(' ..pathetic.

Don't worry, it's related to an actual bug, you can continue playing your login-to-win game:
https://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/54555/the-odyssey-strategy-and-discussion/154/#3591529

I would for sure want it to be actual multiplier (it would actually let you get more points in some fights :P), but I also think it's too late now? It would be totally a big middle finger to any new/return players that would come after such change. Its a shame it wouldn't like that from the start.
 Shiva.Thorny
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By Shiva.Thorny 2021-09-15 05:39:34  
Not exactly sure what I'd advocate as the ideal fix, given they left it for as long as they did. But, the idea that people consider doing 6% damage and timing out a valid farming strategy for the current hardest content is just disappointing. What do you even need augmented gear for if you don't care to tackle the hardest stuff out? You struggle with weaker content, so you want to basically cheat odyssey to have an easier time there?
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 Asura.Zidaner
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By Asura.Zidaner 2021-09-15 05:40:34  
I am in the process of doing a charge run with 3 partial kills. Will post the results so we can stop wondering what they "fixed".
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By SimonSes 2021-09-15 05:45:49  
Shiva.Thorny said: »
Not exactly sure what I'd advocate as the ideal fix, given they left it for as long as they did. But, the idea that people consider doing 6% damage and timing out a valid farming strategy for the current hardest content is just disappointing. What do you even need augmented gear for if you don't care to tackle the hardest stuff out? You struggle with weaker content, so you want to basically cheat odyssey to have an easier time there?

Yep it kinda weird, but I guess it's just the fact it's not meant to be competitive game, you can challenge yourself or not. None stops anyone from doing it the way I do it (3NMs with intention to kill them all), which in non competitive game is the target right? Make challenges available for those who want them, but don't make casuals left behind.
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By Draylo 2021-09-15 05:46:04  
They should just patch it, regardless of who came before and did it already. Then they should increase max moglophones to 3.
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By SimonSes 2021-09-15 05:50:00  
Draylo said: »
They should just patch it, regardless of who came before and did it already. Then they should increase max moglophones to 3.

Yeah, I guess everything would eventually pass anyway. I don't mind it. It would only be positive change for me anyway, unless maybe not against Mboze 100% of the time XD
 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2021-09-15 06:05:05  
It's truly unbelievable they can fix every OTHER bug besides the one that matters. If they haven't addressed it by now, someone should simply ask them directly if this is intended. Because their actions imply they meant for this to happen.
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By RadialArcana 2021-09-15 06:10:22  
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
It's truly unbelievable they can fix every OTHER bug besides the one that matters. If they haven't addressed it by now, someone should simply ask them directly if this is intended. Because their actions imply they meant for this to happen.

It's obviously intended, or they would have fixed it long ago.
 Shiva.Thorny
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By Shiva.Thorny 2021-09-15 06:13:12  
RadialArcana said: »
It's obviously intended, or they would have fixed it long ago.

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/58187-Sheol-Gaol-rewarding-too-many-RP-for-failed-runs-when-using-Mog-Amplifier.

They put it in accepted bugs months ago. I think it's more like cruor or sparks; they know it's detrimental to balance, but they also know enough players would rather have the game be joke-easy that getting rid of it would cost more subs than keeping it.

They'll fix it eventually, and pretend it was unintended the whole time.
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 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2021-09-15 06:17:03  
I doubt they will lose large subs over amplifiers glitch. Most players aren't doing three 5% method, a lot struggle just getting clears or one v15 kill because they lack segments. I would guess it's some technical coding behind it that makes them hesitant to try to patch it. Because it operates off of veng difficulty of the previous battles, they might have it coded really weird and changing it could mess it up even further
 Shiva.Thorny
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By Shiva.Thorny 2021-09-15 06:20:02  
There is no world where it is difficult to fix. It's simple arithmetic, they are either voluntarily leaving it or unaware despite the accepted bug.

Only the enhanced amplifier is based off prior vengeance, and all they have to do is take the stored value and multiply it by (obtained RP / NM max) instead of adding it as is.
 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2021-09-15 06:50:33  
Has anyone tested the vengeance levels of the 3 previous fights (something not V15 x3) to confirm if they even really are taking the average of the three and calculating the bonus for the enhanced amplifier-fight? They could have gotten really lazy and just did the calculation on the enhanced amplifier fight, and ignored what you did previously.
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By SimonSes 2021-09-15 06:58:23  
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Has anyone tested the vengeance levels of the 3 previous fights (something not V15 x3) to confirm if they even really are taking the average of the three and calculating the bonus for the enhanced amplifier-fight? They could have gotten really lazy and just did the calculation on the enhanced amplifier fight, and ignored what you did previously.

What do you mean. If you get 8x points if you make 3x V10 or 1x V15 and 2x V10? Pretty sure the answer is no. AFAIK the bonus is indeed lower if you make fights at lower V levels.
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By Seun 2021-09-15 07:11:38  
Could someone please point me in the direction of the game that rewards you for struggling, adapting and overcoming difficulty rather than facing it briefly, dying and then hiding in the corner while you AFK/Netflix for 12 minutes?


I tried explaining how the Odyssey RP system works to a few friends who play various MMOs. One of them just said "no", but the other responses all had one word in common. Exploit.


I liked the ties to unity upgrades and how that works. I also thoroughly enjoy the flexibility of ABC speed/stealth runs and the variety due to placement, mob type, damage type ect.


The RP system is just... gross.
 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2021-09-15 08:42:18  
SimonSes said: »
If you get 8x points if you make 3x V10 or 1x V15 and 2x V10?

You should get 8x bonus from a boosted amp regardless of the difficulty. It's the total points from the average of the three that is calculated that would be different.

What I am questioning is the calculation on the first step (3x NM kills). Has anyone actually checked to see if, in fact, the game does validate that you did V# x3 (average), and stores that value onto your next amplifier? We always do V15 with boosted amps, so it wouldn't surprise me if nobody bothered to check any of the lower value Vengs and if the stored calculation for killing 3 NMs actually functions properly. If they were lazy in implementing this bonus/"exploit", they could very well be boosting whatever the difficulty of the enhanced (amp use) NM is and not the average of the three previous fights. And if we only do V15 boosted amp fights, we would have never known the calculation on the previous step was broken.
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By SimonSes 2021-09-15 09:01:48  
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
SimonSes said: »
If you get 8x points if you make 3x V10 or 1x V15 and 2x V10?

You should get 8x bonus from a boosted amp regardless of the difficulty. It's the total points from the average of the three that is calculated that would be different.

What I am questioning is the calculation on the first step (3x NM kills). Has anyone actually checked to see if, in fact, the game does validate that you did V# x3 (average), and stores that value onto your next amplifier? We always do V15 with boosted amps, so it wouldn't surprise me if nobody bothered to check any of the lower value Vengs and if the stored calculation for killing 3 NMs actually functions properly. If they were lazy in implementing this bonus/"exploit", they could very well be boosting whatever the difficulty of the enhanced (amp use) NM is and not the average of the three previous fights. And if we only do V15 boosted amp fights, we would have never known the calculation on the previous step was broken.

You dont need to use amplifier at all when doing 3 fights to get bonus for next amplifier use.
AFAIK you need to make 3x V15 to get highest bonus multiplier. Doing lesser V will result in lower bonus multipliers, but I dont know the details.
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By FaeQueenCory 2021-09-15 09:06:12  
I can confirm that V15 v0 v0 nets no bonus at all, but it would be worth checking if V15 v1 v1 nets a lower bonus compared to V15 x3.
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 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2021-09-15 09:11:32  
It's a points system using a scorecard. Every time you deal more then 5% HP you get a point (likely exact value based on difficulty), when you exit the lobby the total number of those is recorded on your scorecard if it's higher then the existing scorecard value. When you use a Mog Amp you get a bonus based on that value, which is then reset to 0.

You can do
V15 Bumba (Win) -> V15 Kalunga (30% damage) -> V15 Ngai (20% Damage) -> exit (scorecard value saved)

Then V15 Ongo (fail) -> Exit, V15 Ongo (win) -> exit, V0 Sgili -> Exit. Your saved scorecard value is still present.

Amp V15 Bumba (Win 3500pts, scorecard reset) -> Amp V15 Kalunga (30% damage 830 points) -> Amp V15 Ngai (20% Damage 819 points) -> exit (scorecard saved again)

Or alternatively, what I'm actually doing right now since Nyame is capped and working Sakpata
V15 Bumba (Win ~300 points) -> Amp V15 Kalunga (30% damage 3200 points, scorecard reset) -> Amp V15 Ngai (20% Damage 819 points) -> exit (scorecard saved again)

What likely was going on is there was another way to get credit or a higher level of credit then we knew about and they just patched it out. If someone just walked in and got ~800 points for a partial kill, then partial kills are still giving scorecard credit which is what we are using for farming RP.
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 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2021-09-15 09:15:05  
SimonSes said: »
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
SimonSes said: »
If you get 8x points if you make 3x V10 or 1x V15 and 2x V10?

You should get 8x bonus from a boosted amp regardless of the difficulty. It's the total points from the average of the three that is calculated that would be different.

What I am questioning is the calculation on the first step (3x NM kills). Has anyone actually checked to see if, in fact, the game does validate that you did V# x3 (average), and stores that value onto your next amplifier? We always do V15 with boosted amps, so it wouldn't surprise me if nobody bothered to check any of the lower value Vengs and if the stored calculation for killing 3 NMs actually functions properly. If they were lazy in implementing this bonus/"exploit", they could very well be boosting whatever the difficulty of the enhanced (amp use) NM is and not the average of the three previous fights. And if we only do V15 boosted amp fights, we would have never known the calculation on the previous step was broken.

You dont need to use amplifier at all when doing 3 fights to get bonus for next amplifier use.
AFAIK you need to make 3x V15 to get highest bonus multiplier. Doing lesser V will result in lower bonus multipliers, but I dont know the details.

I havent mentioned using amplifier on the 3 initial fights at all. You say "you will get lower RP", but that's what they told us will happen.

I am asking about the details if anyone actually confirmed it:

FaeQueenCory said: »
I can confirm that V15 v0 v0 nets no bonus at all, but it would be worth checking if V15 v1 v1 nets a lower bonus compared to V15 x3.

V0 probably doesn't qualify because it doesn't give any base RP, so it probably cancels the entire process. V15 > 1 >1 would be ideal to test, then do a V15 amp and see what the rp reward is.
 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2021-09-15 09:19:36  
Asura.Saevel said: »
You can do
V15 Bumba (Win) -> V15 Kalunga (30% damage) -> V15 Ngai (20% Damage) -> exit (scorecard value saved)

Then V15 Ongo (fail) -> Exit, V15 Ongo (win) -> exit, V0 Sgili -> Exit. Your saved scorecard value is still present.

Amp V15 Bumba (Win 3500pts, scorecard reset) -> Amp V15 Kalunga (30% damage 830 points) -> Amp V15 Ngai (20% Damage 819 points) -> exit (scorecard saved again)

The bolded part is misleading. You don't need to deal any damage to the to the NMs beyond tagging it (and timing out) to earn the Bonus. You only need to attempt 3 NMs in a row. Gaining RP or damaging it at 5% thresholds is not required on the intial 3 fights. That's only for when you want to earn boosted RP from an Amp (enhanced or otherwise) on the following fights. I can confirm this part. You also won't lose an active bonus streak if you don't deal 5%. You just won't get RP from that NM.
 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2021-09-15 09:23:09  
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
You can do
V15 Bumba (Win) -> V15 Kalunga (30% damage) -> V15 Ngai (20% Damage) -> exit (scorecard value saved)

Then V15 Ongo (fail) -> Exit, V15 Ongo (win) -> exit, V0 Sgili -> Exit. Your saved scorecard value is still present.

Amp V15 Bumba (Win 3500pts, scorecard reset) -> Amp V15 Kalunga (30% damage 830 points) -> Amp V15 Ngai (20% Damage 819 points) -> exit (scorecard saved again)

The bolded part is misleading. You don't need to deal any damage to the to the NMs beyond tagging it (and timing out) to earn the Bonus. You only need to attempt 3 NMs in a row. Gaining RP or damaging it at 5% thresholds is not required on the intial 3 fights. That's only for when you want to earn boosted RP from an Amp (enhanced or otherwise) on the following fights. I can confirm this part. You also won't lose an active bonus streak if you don't deal 5%. You just won't get RP from that NM.

I listed what we were actually doing, we know we only need to deal 5% HP, and there have been fights where something went south and we barely squeaked through at 94% on Kalunga.

Our team only runs twice a week as a scheduled thing, the weekends are just doing whatever. I often have to help folks get clears on the weekend so my 3 fight streaks are broken up by lower tier fights, loses and so forth, all without effecting my scorecard. This behavior has made the system very flexible for farming RP, some of our team member still need Nyame RP, while others have moved to Sakpata and Gletti. Once no one needs Nyame we're shifting and adding Agwa to the end. Different people can have different RP needs but still farm together by shifting when they use their initial mog amp.
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