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Dev Tracker - Discussion
サーバ: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 19647
By Valefor.Prothescar 2018-02-28 17:31:16
The rewards aren't necessarily a problem since it's blindingly obvious that SE is trying to shift away from the boring, dead end vertical progression system that Abyssea, and even moreso Adoulin, introduced in favor of going back to the game's roots, which is far more sustainable when the game is running on fumes.
Problem is they're implementing it in the worst way possible. Dynamis was arguably the most hated event even back in the day when it was relevant, and they've somehow managed to make it even worse and more mundane than it was back then. Guess part of it is you don't get that surge of endorphins when you saw a Valor Surcoat or a Duelist's Chapeau in the loot list.
Regardless a lot of these problems can be solved by making the content more interesting and less of a chore. I guess though, at this point, the XI community has been coddled long enough to expect and feed off of instant gratification and "I need big numbers, WAY bigger than what I have now for it to be worth it!!!" syndrome, just like any other MMO, so maybe SE's plans to go back toward the old days of diagonal/horizontal progression won't work anymore.
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3753
By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2018-02-28 17:51:30
Oh I agree half the point of doing an iLvl Dynamis was to play on that sense of Nostalgia. My complaint is that there's no nuance to the event- they could have done more with pop methods for NMs ala Salvage (at least give us a brain puzzle now and then, I'm one who appreciates them. I know some just get annoyed) or unique moves like Omen bosses.
You're very right, Saevel, that a lot of the opinions on Dynamis-D boil down to personal preference, and you can't please everyone all the time. Just hey, if you're gonna recycle, at least make cool stuff with the rubbish you're re-using.
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Asura.Eiryl
By Asura.Eiryl 2018-02-28 18:22:44
Lock outs are never a good game idea.
They are a money idea, and a fantastic one. They've ensured you have content due to lock out for 10 solid years to come. Not good content, not fun content, not entertaining content. But Addiction content.
Lock outs are specifically designed to keep you playing paying.
Asura.Frod
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1204
By Asura.Frod 2018-02-28 18:27:11
Lock outs are never a good game idea.
They are a money idea, and a fantastic one. They've ensured you have content due to lock out for 10 solid years to come. Not good content, not fun content, not entertaining content. But Addiction content.
Lock outs are specifically designed to keep you playing paying.
The lockouts don't exactly amount to ***when you only need to clear the content once in order to progress. Currently you can take 6 days, go in and clear midboss each run. buy all the currency you need, and never have to deal with this festering shitpile again.
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3184
By Asura.Geriond 2018-02-28 18:29:20
At least, assuming you don't want any of the direct drop gear; some of them have niche uses.
Pretty damn low drop rate unless you're killing mega boss every single run, though, and few groups are interested in mega boss farming.
Asura.Eiryl
By Asura.Eiryl 2018-02-28 18:42:46
Lock outs are never a good game idea.
They are a money idea, and a fantastic one. They've ensured you have content due to lock out for 10 solid years to come. Not good content, not fun content, not entertaining content. But Addiction content.
Lock outs are specifically designed to keep you playing paying.
The lockouts don't exactly amount to ***when you only need to clear the content once in order to progress. Currently you can take 6 days, go in and clear midboss each run. buy all the currency you need, and never have to deal with this festering shitpile again.
I mean if you're dumb enough to drop 40m (ish) on the medals ((in addition to the other 20m for +3))... more power to you.
I don't know whats worse (or sad?), actually doing dynamis, or paying to skip it.
Bahamut.Agerine
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 431
By Bahamut.Agerine 2018-02-28 19:45:08
Dynamis would be a success if they reduced the event to 45 minutes. Upped the drop rate of medals. Reduced mob HP by 20% and reduced zone CD to 45 hours.
This would result in less reward overall.
Did it dawn on anything who's complaining that a majority of the population doesn't play more then a two or three days a week. Having to invest near 100% of their playtime to Dynamis, so that those with nothing else to do will complain about something else, is pretty bad game design.
Treat his like any MMO raid. Those are normally behind a 5+ day lockout timer with a bunch of pre-raids that need to be done to get the unlock. In order to get the rewards guilds are required to consistently farm them. This game used to be all about that style of content, in fact many people in this very thread complained that SE needed to bring that back.
That is one of the most down to earth things I’ve seen you say... and I have to agree. Idk I’ve been having lots of fun doing this with my LS and drops arnt the best, we all know that. But they do come(last 2 runs we got 19 drops in total plus a bunch of medals) and really, if my LS has fun doing it I’ll keep havin folks set up runs.
End of the day it’s another thing to do with the people I love playing this game with.
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Asura.Saevel
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9910
By Asura.Saevel 2018-02-28 20:11:46
Leviathan.Celebrindal said: »Oh I agree half the point of doing an iLvl Dynamis was to play on that sense of Nostalgia. My complaint is that there's no nuance to the event- they could have done more with pop methods for NMs ala Salvage (at least give us a brain puzzle now and then, I'm one who appreciates them. I know some just get annoyed) or unique moves like Omen bosses.
You're very right, Saevel, that a lot of the opinions on Dynamis-D boil down to personal preference, and you can't please everyone all the time. Just hey, if you're gonna recycle, at least make cool stuff with the rubbish you're re-using.
Oh I get that they should of done more mechanic wise, I hate how the personal pools don't reset every month, or that there isn't a reason to touch the NM's. The whole Blue Eye / Green Eye status kinda adds a bit of strategy to it depending on zone, still I wish there was less mass farming and more targeted mini-boss's. Still it's pretty true to it's origins, if you wanted rewards from OG Dyna you mass farmed everything.
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Asura.Saevel
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9910
By Asura.Saevel 2018-02-28 20:31:17
I wonder when they'll add cards/medals to Ambuscade.
Three months after the final zone is created, OR when the next batch of content gets made for Empyrian.
By Nyarlko 2018-02-28 20:38:54
Can you imagine if instead of upping Reward Potency they increased distance from the pet you could be? Make it more like the pre-nerf, but at least make the pieces relevant to BST again
Quite honestly, I was actually looking forward to more killer effect on the head, and got zilch instead. I'd have been happy and impressed if they had changed the relic Reward pieces to potency II with lower values, and/or significantly raise the MND on them for the same end effect. Keep in mind that even doing that would be only marginally useful for most BST players since we can already hit 4k+ heals which is awfully close to 100% on our pets. XD The thing is "something" > "nothing", and we get literally "nothing" out of this crap. -_-;;
Attaching a bug fix to an annoying to farm, endgame-geared required, group required, time gated content would just be rubbing ***into the wound after the repeated casual shanking we've faced since the range nerf. ._.
Yes. This is my trigger. Want me pissed? Give me an excuse to rant about BST. lol There is never any possible reasoning for intentionally introducing bugs into a program, and that is exactly what the nerf did, without actually addressing any of the complaints at the time.
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3184
By Asura.Geriond 2018-02-28 21:02:37
By definition, I don't think it's possible for the coders in charge of the code to intentionally introduce bugs. If they meant something to be there, it's not a bug.
Asura.Saevel
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9910
By Asura.Saevel 2018-02-28 21:03:12
To be honest Killer Traits should be vastly more powerful. Instead of passive "paralyze" like effects they should be direct +damage / -damage taken effects.
Siren.Kyte
サーバ: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3332
By Siren.Kyte 2018-02-28 21:12:30
Well, with BST's AF3 body that is what they do.
Asura.Saevel
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9910
By Asura.Saevel 2018-02-28 21:15:22
Well, with BST's AF3 body that is what they do.
It's only at half value and only when it's worn. This should be system wide and applied to all killer effects. +10 Dragon Killer would be +10% damage on dragons and -10% damage received, +10 Bird Killer would be the same and so forth. Would make things a bit more strategic. And a BST should be able to transfer their buffs to their pet with Reward similar to how a DRG can.
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2666
By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2018-02-28 21:32:34
I'm amused people are bitching so much about Dynamis compared to Omen. Dynamis is content where if you don't like it you clear it once and then you can spend gil and never do it again. It's the most optional content you're ever going to see in this game that allows you to collect rewards. Compare that to Omen where you had to grind it repeatedly on every single job you need any AF+3 on, and ESPECIALLY pre-Ou Omen when there wasn't even a specific card farming floor and you could only get 2-3 cards per run. That meant an AF+3 body required you go do Omen daily for 3 weeks on that job regardless of whether it was useful for that boss or not. Compared to that I'll gladly take the Dynamis system where I hope for a few drops in a 90min event and whenever I just want to get my item I spend gil and finish it out.
Bismarck.Dekusutaa
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 495
By Bismarck.Dekusutaa 2018-02-28 21:41:56
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »I'm amused people are bitching so much about Dynamis compared to Omen. Dynamis is content where if you don't like it you clear it once and then you can spend gil and never do it again. It's the most optional content you're ever going to see in this game that allows you to collect rewards. Compare that to Omen where you had to grind it repeatedly on every single job you need any AF+3 on, and ESPECIALLY pre-Ou Omen when there wasn't even a specific card farming floor and you could only get 2-3 cards per run. That meant an AF+3 body required you go do Omen daily for 3 weeks on that job regardless of whether it was useful for that boss or not. Compared to that I'll gladly take the Dynamis system where I hope for a few drops in a 90min event and whenever I just want to get my item I spend gil and finish it out.
There's nothing wrong with Dynamis, it's fun. But I generally agree they could do more with the NM leaders and maybe make more drop.
But the fact we get a zone to ourselves is quite an accomplishment technically on their end when most people expected a shared zone pre-release. QOL side of Dyna is pretty good. It's a good event generally that could be better.
IMHO, it's why im somewhat disappointed Jeuno is the last zone (that we know of). Even if they skip Xarc/Beaucidine, here's to hoping there's a dreamlands series or something.
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By Nyarlko 2018-02-28 21:55:00
By definition, I don't think it's possible for the coders in charge of the code to intentionally introduce bugs. If they meant something to be there, it's not a bug.
I have quite literally been standing >IN< my pet and had the out of range error when using Ready, so yes, there are actual bugs that were introduced when they reduced JA range below melee range. -_-;; It's also racist. Taru's have to be closer than galka. lol
To be honest Killer Traits should be vastly more powerful. Instead of passive "paralyze" like effects they should be direct +damage / -damage taken effects.
I'm not sure I'd want this since it would likely come with the downside of being intimidated by the killer effect strong to you. :/ Ygnas/KoH are known to have Cures interrupted because August intimidates them. lol
Well, with BST's AF3 body that is what they do.
It's only at half value and only when it's worn. This should be system wide and applied to all killer effects. +10 Dragon Killer would be +10% damage on dragons and -10% damage received, +10 Bird Killer would be the same and so forth. Would make things a bit more strategic. And a BST should be able to transfer their buffs to their pet with Reward similar to how a DRG can.
Founder's Breastplate works the same way, btw. ^^ BST can't wear the set tho. /cry
We already kinda/sorta get this via Circles, but if players got baseline effects equal to full killer traits, then BST would automatically out DPS everyone on all animal types, PLD would be DD of choice for undead, etc. I don't think transferring buffs to pets would actually be wise, since it could easily give us unkillable/overpowered pets. I would adore a new JA on a separate CD from Reward that allowed me to use roborants/poultices without wasting Reward recast though.
Asura.Saevel
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9910
By Asura.Saevel 2018-02-28 22:02:02
We already kinda/sorta get this via Circles, but if players got baseline effects equal to full killer traits, then BST would automatically out DPS everyone on all animal types, PLD would be DD of choice for undead, etc.
Well I don't think PLD is going to out-DD anything lol, but the whole point was to give individual jobs a strong boost towards specific target types. DRG's get a bonus on Dragons, DRK's on Arcana, SAMs on Demons and BST on the animal kingdoms.
I'm not sure I'd want this since it would likely come with the downside of being intimidated by the killer effect strong to you. :/ Ygnas/KoH are known to have Cures interrupted because August intimidates them. lol
I'm not talking about the intimidation effects, this is the same as the circle effects but just permanent for those with the Job Trait.
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3184
By Asura.Geriond 2018-02-28 22:08:27
I have quite literally been standing >IN< my pet and had the out of range error when using Ready, so yes, there are actual bugs that were introduced when they reduced JA range below melee range. -_-;; It's also racist. Taru's have to be closer than galka. lol That doesn't mean they introduced bugs on purpose, like your post claimed.
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3753
By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2018-02-28 23:19:29
Had an idea hit us during our run tonight- wouldn't it be nice if the zone boss had personal pool drops that dropped one voidpiece of the job you currently on?
Asura.Eiryl
By Asura.Eiryl 2018-02-28 23:54:10
Leviathan.Celebrindal said: »Had an idea hit us during our run tonight- wouldn't it be nice if the zone boss had personal pool drops that dropped one voidpiece of the job you currently on?
Too obviously good, aim lower. A medal.
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サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2666
By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2018-02-28 23:57:09
Leviathan.Celebrindal said: »Had an idea hit us during our run tonight- wouldn't it be nice if the zone boss had personal pool drops that dropped one voidpiece of the job you currently on?
Too obviously good, aim lower. A medal.
That's arguably higher because it can be used on any job, not simply the one you're using to clear the mega boss.
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Asura.Eiryl
By Asura.Eiryl 2018-03-01 00:19:23
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »Leviathan.Celebrindal said: »Had an idea hit us during our run tonight- wouldn't it be nice if the zone boss had personal pool drops that dropped one voidpiece of the job you currently on?
Too obviously good, aim lower. A medal.
That's arguably higher because it can be used on any job, not simply the one you're using to clear the mega boss.
2m < 6m nothing debatable about it...
Cards arent worth it, Shards are worth too much. Medals right in the middle.
By Marootsoobootsu 2018-03-01 00:25:45
Asura.Ladyofhonor said: »Leviathan.Celebrindal said: »Had an idea hit us during our run tonight- wouldn't it be nice if the zone boss had personal pool drops that dropped one voidpiece of the job you currently on?
Too obviously good, aim lower. A medal.
That's arguably higher because it can be used on any job, not simply the one you're using to clear the mega boss.
2m < 6m nothing debatable about it...
Cards arent worth it, Shards are worth too much. Medals right in the middle.
I've finished my THF feet; getting another THF footshard is 0 gil for me vs. a medal. Choice is often worth much more than its raw value.
So yeah, it's debatable.
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Asura.Eiryl
By Asura.Eiryl 2018-03-01 00:29:14
Your fault if you keep going after you're done. Not debatable.
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3753
By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2018-03-01 00:34:07
my thought was to force ppl to take multiple setups ala Omen. Value of course is 1/3 in terms of raw gil, but it would give incentive to bring your other toys. That does create a false sense of difficulty, but these days even that is something.
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Asura.Eiryl
By Asura.Eiryl 2018-03-01 00:36:05
If you give me a COR foot shard 100% I'm going twice, and never going again.
If you give me a medal 100% I'll keep going to sell the medal to the people stupid enough to keep wanting shitty gear.
Which version keeps the content active.
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2666
By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2018-03-01 00:36:12
Your fault if you keep going after you're done. Not debatable.
Yes because in the history of FFXI nobody has ever done an event after they're done farming it for their main job.
By Nyarlko 2018-03-01 03:27:55
I have quite literally been standing >IN< my pet and had the out of range error when using Ready, so yes, there are actual bugs that were introduced when they reduced JA range below melee range. -_-;; It's also racist. Taru's have to be closer than galka. lol That doesn't mean they introduced bugs on purpose, like your post claimed.
They went forward with a poorly planned adjustment and accepted any/all collateral damage that came along with it, which includes the buggy behavior on whether or not the system sees you as being in range even if you most definitely are on your own screen, and exacerbated racial distance variances. I don't believe that it was done with actual malicious intent behind it, but they had to have known that the JA failure behavior we see now was a likely byproduct and still pushed the nerf live. That counts as intentionally introducing bugs as far as I am concerned.
The racial distance variance admittedly did exist prior, most likely since day0, are universal based on player+monster model sizes and affect each and every player<>target interaction, and just became rather pronounced once we were given the shortest JA range of anything in the game. 0.2y may not matter that much when you are 20y+ away, but sure as hell make a difference when range is only 5-6y.
ACTUAL DEVTRACKER STUFF: Apparently, the hardcoded limit of items storable per slip is 192. Slip 11 is maxed out.
This thread is for discussion of recent news from the Dev Tracker - News thread. Keep it civil.
Original thread by Pantafernando archived here.
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