Resinjima T2/T3

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Resinjima T2/T3
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By Afania 2018-01-23 03:00:04  
Bump regarding Yakshi strat. We just did melee setup with the following job:

RUN, DRK(Zulfiqar and reisen/ambuscade gear only), SAM(AG Masa, some HQ and AF+3), GEO(mule, no idris), BRD(mule, 3 songs and Masyas), WHM.

No one hour used since all JA were taken away by previous T2 NM, Honor March/madrigal x2/Fury/frailty entrust haste.

I would say melee is still the easiest/fastest/most efficient strat for spamming this and mage/rng strat aren't close, nor SMN unless you only doing 1 and ACing. Despite no JA were available and GEO DRK wasn't exactly elite by todays PUG standard, Yakshi died 1-2 min and it used like 3-4 TP moves. Since WS light SC with each other aura was never an issue. Even if doom really hits pt the NM would die before count down reaches 0 anyways. We can change tank/healer to trusts the difficulty wouldn't change since it's 90% just zerg and passing the DPS check to kill it before it do ***moves.

Since the AG Masa was only 11% more DPS than Zulfiqar on parse after 1hr of DDing, A reisen geared none piercing DD using appropriate sets should be able hit enough DPS to kill this fast enough before it cause any trouble, if not there's always SV/bolster/MS/whatever zerg JA available to push the DPS up. Masyas shouldn't be necessary if you can coordinate buffs to hit the acc requirement, nor idris. We didn't have any zerg JA available and it still died really fast, a lesser geared pt with zerg JA available should be able to kill just as fast.

Honestly, Considering the pt wasn't best geared in the world, I am really really surprised to learn that melee strat is still consider being inferior to players that's at least somewhat experienced in mid-level content wearing reisen level of gears.

I've done at least 6 yakshi that way and pt was never in any risk of dying to doom(it never get a chance to use it in melee setup) just because the NM melt so fast every time.
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 Quetzalcoatl.Xilkk
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By Quetzalcoatl.Xilkk 2018-01-23 06:12:16  
zaxtiss said: »
hi everyone i was wondering how viable doing T3 tree with bsts using Bouncing Bertha (HQ) pet is i heard that it procs the tree is that correct? and also about how much acc would be needed ? i sit about 1150 acc on bst with no food

No it does not process the tree. The bst strat is usually an unleash zerg. Fight is over within 1 min. The groups that screw it up usually mess up the numbers, and hp scaling. You want 3 really good bst for 6 man party. 4 if they are mediocre. You need Cor and Geo, though the Cor can drop party after rolls.

Can do it with 2 really good bst if party is only 3x.

Bertha unleash just does enough damage to burn it down quickly and lowman.

Use shiromochi and you'll be fine for access. Ready moves get an account boost already and run wild does also
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By zaxtiss 2018-01-23 09:29:00  
hello,

i was wondering if PLD BLU GEO BRD with whm trust would work on Neak?
 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-01-23 09:31:00  
zaxtiss said: »
hello,

i was wondering if PLD BLU GEO BRD with whm trust would work on Neak?

Yes. But thats not the question you need to ask.

Will /your/ pld blu geo and brd be good enough to do it, is what you need to know.
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By zaxtiss 2018-01-23 09:35:48  
should be ok, was just wondering if that was the right set up to use was thinking of using cor instead of brd.
my blus acc is about 1350 with buffs and lots of food since full dispels i should hit 1700 + fine.
 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-01-23 09:39:17  
Having cor instead of brd = more savage blades = faster

But slower to put back up rolls vs songs @ dispel
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By zaxtiss 2018-01-23 09:57:58  
yeah might have the bard go /cor for sam roll
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By Afania 2018-01-23 10:08:48  
BRD is a better acc buffer than COR, so just use trust COR for chaos/dia4. And yeah you can use weaker Sam roll too.

At 1650 acc cap COR DPS will be pretty low without a BRD. It's a low acc job that heavily rely on WS dmg, and using heavy acc swap=less MA/STP gear=less WS=horrible DPS. I wouldn't rely on COR DPS to increase the kill speed in a no brd setup. It's more important to boost BLU DPS to the max IMO.
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By zaxtiss 2018-01-23 10:21:42  
well that was the plan i just havent tried 4boxing this NM yet so i wanted to ask some stuff on it first.
oh yeah anyone know the range for breakga? will the whm trust be out of range for it?
 Leviathan.Celebrindal
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By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2018-01-23 10:38:56  
did several 3 man Majus while farming a friend some merlinic bodies. We were able to put him on farm status, no 1hrs, with PLD,RDM,RNG using primarily white damage from AM3 Gandiva or Armageddon. Wasn't exceedingly fast (took 8-12 minutes depending on how stubborn blind was), but was extremely safe.
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By zaxtiss 2018-01-23 10:40:41  
would it be better to do neak via RNG style?
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By Afania 2018-01-23 11:51:10  
zaxtiss said: »
would it be better to do neak via RNG style?

I personally prefer melee for all T3 unless I want to parse against RNG on COR. Melee just hits harder and kills faster, but it's not necessary more difficult.

If you are afraid of dying, just use fade.
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By clearlyamule 2018-01-23 11:53:27  
Still likely to be in range of voidsong and bodyslam and definitely in range of meteor (unless using pet tank) so not sure you gain much from that. If you want to be super safe can throw automatons at it
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By Afania 2018-01-23 12:23:55  
clearlyamule said: »
Still likely to be in range of voidsong and bodyslam and definitely in range of meteor (unless using pet tank) so not sure you gain much from that. If you want to be super safe can throw automatons at it


I know everyone has their setup preference and I certainly don't have the intention to convince everyone "my way is the only way". But I am just curious....

I keep hearing "Melee T3 are dangerous and not safe" over and over and over on forums, even from very experienced/knowledgeable endgame players and I can't quite understand why.

My experience with all recent melee T3 were nothing but fast and safe. Most of the recent runs, none of them ever come close to wipe, and I didn't roll with career supports either, most of the time it's just trust healer or mule or random people on WHM.

Maju certainly requires more pt coordination because of blind and such. The other 2 seems straight forward enough.

Case to the point, before last Yakshi pt members were all like "We need mages/RNG for this" like we'll wipe to AoEs/Doom. Took me a while to convince them to melee. Then they started to ask for defensive bubbles, also took me a while to convince them do 3 offensive bubbles.

After yakshi died in 1 min with zero death they were all shocked at how fast and painless the fight was with melee.

Considering overwhelming amount of experienced endgame players were trying to argue that Yakshi shouldn't use melee or too risky to melee on the forum just last month, I can't help but feel people exaggerated the difficulty of melee setup because it's just too different from my experience with melee.

And the difference is certainly not because of gears either, considering I lowered the pt member gear standard to NQ GEO and none REMA DD, and still find it possible to hit the DPS check.

In the end, Do whatever strat that you prefer. I don't mind occasional RNG setup just for fun OR if I have absolutely horrible support. Otherwise the efficiency of melee is hard to beat and it only makes more sense to recommend a faster setup than slower ones. Unless the NM is really dangerous, which really isn't the case of all T3.
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By zaxtiss 2018-01-23 12:28:02  
hmmm id like to try melee style for tree but not sure what kind of job combo's would be good.
any tips?
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By Afania 2018-01-23 12:39:45  
zaxtiss said: »
hmmm id like to try melee style for tree but not sure what kind of job combo's would be good.
any tips?


AFAIK tree takes less damage from piercing, so I would avoid piercing DDs.

Light SC removes aura so I would also pick DD with strongest WS SC light with each other just in case.

So Chango WAR + savage COR, double BLU/SAM/DRK/Aeonic RUN seems great.

BRD is mandatory for any high lv content.

So something like Tank, above mentioned DD x2, BRD, GEO, WHM.

Based on bg-wiki it only uses doom move with aura up, which can be removed with light SC. so if you kill it fast enough you probably won't get doom because the tree can't just randomly use it. It's either you kill it in a min and don't deal with any of the ***moves, or you don't.
 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-01-23 12:40:30  
Afania, everyones experiences in this game are like night and day.

I've seen all 3 t3 be killed in a minute flat with melee.

I've also seen a thousand (literally) lolmelee fails.

I've seen scrubs win with melee, I've seen pros fail with melee.

It comes down to laziness. Not skill, not gear, not knowledge. But raw laziness that defeats you most of the time. (arrogance, hubris etc.)

"we don't need a healer, cureplease is good enough" "I don't need a dt set, thats what whm is for" "why would I use food it's just gonna dispel it" "wilt/fend? what are you a pussy?" "i dont have any holy waters"
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By clearlyamule 2018-01-23 12:44:28  
Afania said: »
clearlyamule said: »
Still likely to be in range of voidsong and bodyslam and definitely in range of meteor (unless using pet tank) so not sure you gain much from that. If you want to be super safe can throw automatons at it


I know everyone has their setup preference and I certainly don't have the intention to convince everyone "my way is the only way". But I am just curious....

I keep hearing "Melee T3 are dangerous and not safe" over and over and over on forums, even from very experienced/knowledgeable endgame players and I can't quite understand why.

My experience with all recent melee T3 were nothing but fast and safe. Most of the recent runs, none of them ever come close to wipe, and I didn't roll with career supports either, most of the time it's just trust healer or mule or random people on WHM.

Maju certainly requires more pt coordination because of blind and such. The other 2 seems straight forward enough.

Case to the point, before last Yakshi pt members were all like "We need mages/RNG for this" like we'll wipe to AoEs/Doom. Took me a while to convince them to melee. Then they started to ask for defensive bubbles, also took me a while to convince them do 3 offensive bubbles.

After yakshi died in 1 min with zero death they were all shocked at how fast and painless the fight was with melee.

Considering overwhelming amount of experienced endgame players were trying to argue that Yakshi shouldn't use melee or too risky to melee on the forum just last month, I can't help but feel people exaggerated the difficulty of melee setup because it's just too different from my experience with melee.

And the difference is certainly not because of gears either, considering I lowered the pt member gear standard to NQ GEO and none REMA DD, and still find it possible to hit the DPS check.

In the end, Do whatever strat that you prefer. I don't mind occasional RNG setup just for fun OR if I have absolutely horrible support. Otherwise the efficiency of melee is hard to beat and it only makes more sense to recommend a faster setup than slower ones. Unless the NM is really dangerous, which really isn't the case of all T3.
I wasn't really saying it was dangerous just that if you were going for safer rng isn't really doing as much in that regard than a lot.

That said I think you underestimate how terrible a lot of people can be. Not even really a gearing issue just how many people can't do things like have enough accuracy, keep buffs up, heal properly, actually watch the chat log to see what people are saying or that they are constantly healing Kei.... forget actual coordination for anything or reacting to the situations or ya know reading up on mobs <.< .

I think a bit of it is people multibox while having no idea how to do it effectively but some of that is just pure hoping others will carry them. SO without people I know are better my standard is if I couldn't do this with trusts if trusts could stand at proper ranges I have little hope lol
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By Afania 2018-01-23 12:52:30  
I don't deny things could* go wrong in this game regardless who you go with. It's how it goes. I fail runs with friends/ls all the time, sometimes I could wipe for an hour in VD with very good players before we finally nail down an efficient way to get win.

That being said, I feel melee setup shouldn't be discouraged because of that. Any setup could go wrong, melee, SMN, Ranged, you name it. That's how it goes.

But my point is, this game is all about trying, failing and tweaking strategy for better outcome. And it's more discouraging to see people refuse to try.
 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2018-01-23 12:57:46  
Afania said: »
Any setup could go wrong ... SMN
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 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-01-23 12:58:06  
I mean I'm all for everyone trying melee setups. I'm that guy that if you shout melee t3 I will sit and watch the shitshow. It's my only form of entertainment left in this game.

That being said, it's a numbers game. There is a much higher fail rate when you put bodies in range of damage. That's why ranged damage is always the go to. Be it nuke/bullets/pets.

Personally I believe the biggest problem is whm. Not necessarily just the people playing whm, but the lack of incentive to play whm, the power creep and the status creep whm has to contend with because mobs have to keep getting worse.

Think back 10 years, status removal didnt even exist for the most part. Stona was about the full extent of na usage for the majority of the game.
 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2018-01-23 12:58:56  
On a more serious note, I don't think anyone in this argument would have difficulty with a melee setup. However, picking up randoms without having a reliable WHM and powerful buffers available will make a world of difference. In my opinion, melee is going to be the hardest way to accomplish these fights using randoms.
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By clearlyamule 2018-01-23 12:59:14  
Hey man I used to make all kinds of crazy strats all the time so I'm with you in theory. And with people I can trust yeah I'd do crazy ***... it even worked sometimes lol.

And yes any strat can fail but with groups that you know are more prone to failing it doesn't make sense to choose a method that is also more prone to failing. You don't send little 15 year old just got his permit Johnny thru a blizzard on a mountain pass. And if this analogy seems excessive well you haven't yelled at a group for several minutes to stop doing literally everything wrong even threatening to warp out and only one person saw it after a few minutes
 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-01-23 13:01:28  
It's wow... but yeah...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMxW36WbW6M

I SHALL get out of the fire, that makes logical sense.
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By Afania 2018-01-23 13:27:27  
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
On a more serious note, I don't think anyone in this argument would have difficulty with a melee setup. However, picking up randoms without having a reliable WHM and powerful buffers available will make a world of difference. In my opinion, melee is going to be the hardest way to accomplish these fights using randoms.

In the case of T3, trust healer works, there are testimonials with trust WHM clearing all of them, and none idris GEO is good enough. BRD is just there to cap acc and if your BRD buffs aren't good enough to cap there's always SV available. Same can be said for GEO, they are just there to cap attack, and if you can't with NQ just bolster.

I have been doing PUG in variety of content with variety of players for years. I would say less than 20% of people are horrible enough to be the only person responsible to failing a run. Most of the time, I got people thats not perfect but at least capable of getting some of the job done. Which is good enough to clear most mid tier content. Super talented players from PUG are rare and they are not always necessary to have in pt to get a win.

Melee may be the hardest way to accomplish these fights with randoms, but even then the difficulty should be a bit lower than ambu vol 1 D/VD IMO.
 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-01-23 13:31:19  
If you're comparing it to VD ambuscade, there are VERY few VD shouts. And even less successful ones. So that should explain alot.

(to be clear, no /actual/ shout groups happen for VD. A solid group missing one member a shout group does not make.)
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By clearlyamule 2018-01-23 14:41:08  
Full only VD shouts I've seen are smn burns or a couple of times pup. Well and on frog because frog was too weak. Seen people shout for 1-2 more but that's it. This month most the shouts I see are for E/N... which is a little sad since definitely triboxed E might even be able to do N idk too busy.

I'd actually trust the average human whm less than the average trust. Hell had an entire ls of like 40+ people laugh at me for reminding mages that melees need haste. Not even joking got flat out laughed at and told off. schs still got haste for stun lock though occasionally pld did as well. And forget erase/nas lol
necroskull Necro Bump Detected! [170 days between previous and next post]
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By bboyhard 2018-07-12 12:05:38  
Sorry for the Necro... but does anyone have an idea what MACC to aim for with Maju. Ive been trying to blind him with my Geo which has pretty good gear but it wont land at all.

Ive tried Indi-Focus and BoG languor but still no luck.

TIA
 Shiva.Arislan
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By Shiva.Arislan 2018-07-12 12:17:37  
It's not as much a question of macc as it is a matter of Maju being naturally resistant to blind. You have to immunobreak until it lands -- even fully decked out RDMs have to cast repeatedly if ES/Stymie aren't available.
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