fonewear said: »
As a childless person this doesn't interest me ! But you teach little Johnny Math he needs it.
Obama Signs No Child Left Behind Rewrite Into Law
Obama signs No Child Left Behind rewrite into law
Education should be of interest to childless people too. Cause those kids will eventually be your fellow citizens...and no one wanna live in a nation full of idiots(or at least not too many).
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Jetackuu said: »
So he basically nullifies a bad law? Good.
I agree with the premise of education standards (especially since it's in our best interests as a nation) but the implementation of that was horrible. Common core is also fundamentally stupid.
I agree with the premise of education standards (especially since it's in our best interests as a nation) but the implementation of that was horrible. Common core is also fundamentally stupid.
I wasn't taught how to do this kind of math.
It's just how I came about doing it on my own...
I admit though it looks SUPER CONFUSING on paper at first.
But after studying it I realised it's the same method I sometimes use to do large math problems in my head.
But I'm a minority in this kind of math process apparently and what works for me obviously does not work any better for the majority than what the majority did working for me in school.
Forcing this system on ALL math problems is just terribly inefficient. Even for me.
The only bonus about this new system though is I would finally be able to "show my work" on paper and I never knew how to do that until this system came out on paper... Ironically this is about 30 years too late for me to actually show my thought process on paper.
Asura.Floppyseconds said: »
Ackeron said: »
Gotta admit though school showed you exactly where it was like to be an adult now.
Go to school - Go to work
Listen to teacher - Listen to boss
Work with other kids - Work with coworkers
Do homework - Do bills
Get a report card - Get a pay check
Get expelled - Get fired
Being an adult is almost just like being a kid now days! Only difference is not being told you are a super special snowflake.
Go to school - Go to work
Listen to teacher - Listen to boss
Work with other kids - Work with coworkers
Do homework - Do bills
Get a report card - Get a pay check
Get expelled - Get fired
Being an adult is almost just like being a kid now days! Only difference is not being told you are a super special snowflake.
What about when you had sex with the other kids, did drugs, drank, were late to class, slept in class, didn't participate yet received an A, didn't care about gym class, etc?
Have sex with other kids - Have sex with (hopefully) other adults.
Do drugs - Do drugs.
Sleep in class - Sleep in office.
Don't do anything for that A - Don't do anything for that bonus.
Don't care about gym - Still don't care about the gym.
Ramyrez said: »
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Wow massive cultural shock. Never seen common core math before, what the hell is this ***.
It's simplifying math so far that you've gone full circle into making it far, far harder than need be.
It also makes you wonder how it will be cumulatively built upon as kids prep and progress into more advanced maths.
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Valefor.Sehachan said: »
no one wanna live in a nation full of idiots
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I'm not sure I have a firm grasp of what the common core is, but it looks like how I do math in my head.
And it's not as complicated as it looks. I bet a lot of us use it without even thinking of it.
When you have to calculate the time difference between 9:45 and 10:15, you don't go (15 - 45 + 60), you think '15 minutes to :00, then another 15 minutes; 15 +15 = 30 minutes.
I've seen some examples that take things bizarrely too far, but I'm not sure if they're legitimate examples or just someone trying to exaggerate its complexity.
And it's not as complicated as it looks. I bet a lot of us use it without even thinking of it.
When you have to calculate the time difference between 9:45 and 10:15, you don't go (15 - 45 + 60), you think '15 minutes to :00, then another 15 minutes; 15 +15 = 30 minutes.
I've seen some examples that take things bizarrely too far, but I'm not sure if they're legitimate examples or just someone trying to exaggerate its complexity.
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Valefor.Sehachan said: »
fonewear said: »
As a childless person this doesn't interest me ! But you teach little Johnny Math he needs it.
Bismarck.Josiahfk said: »
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Wow massive cultural shock. Never seen common core math before, what the hell is this ***.
quickly mentally go 833- 477
"well 3 hundreds between so it's 300"
"And 100-77 is 23... + 33"
"So the answer is 353."
356, failure.
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Let's go back to additions guys, they're easier.
Bismarck.Josiahfk said: »
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Wow massive cultural shock. Never seen common core math before, what the hell is this ***.
quickly mentally go 833- 477
"well 3 hundreds between so it's 300"
"And 100-77 is 23... + 33"
"So the answer is 353."
The answer is (Google search 833-477)
Valefor.Endoq said: »
Jetackuu said: »
So he basically nullifies a bad law? Good.
I agree with the premise of education standards (especially since it's in our best interests as a nation) but the implementation of that was horrible. Common core is also fundamentally stupid.
I agree with the premise of education standards (especially since it's in our best interests as a nation) but the implementation of that was horrible. Common core is also fundamentally stupid.
I wasn't taught how to do this kind of math.
It's just how I came about doing it on my own...
I admit though it looks SUPER CONFUSING on paper at first.
But after studying it I realised it's the same method I sometimes use to do large math problems in my head.
But I'm a minority in this kind of math process apparently and what works for me obviously does not work any better for the majority than what the majority did working for me in school.
Forcing this system on ALL math problems is just terribly inefficient. Even for me.
The only bonus about this new system though is I would finally be able to "show my work" on paper and I never knew how to do that until this system came out on paper... Ironically this is about 30 years too late for me to actually show my thought process on paper.
i agree that i do some math problems with that kind of approach in my head. But to use that as the learning basis instead of the basic fundamentals is absolutely insane.
Quote:
What was the federal government's role in creating the Common Core?
This is probably the biggest single source of controversy surrounding the Common Core. The truth is, the federal government played no role in creating the standards, nor did it require that states adopt them. But the U.S. Department of Education under President Obama and Secretary of Education Arne Duncan did incentivize adoption.
In July 2009, the Education Department created Race to the Top, a $3.4 billion grant competition. States that agreed to adopt the Common Core standards won points on their applications, increasing their eligibility for a share of the money. This carrot, with a deadline attached, helped spur a majority of states to adopt the standards within a few months after they were released in July 2010. The federal government also funded the state-led consortia creating the Common Core-aligned tests.
This is probably the biggest single source of controversy surrounding the Common Core. The truth is, the federal government played no role in creating the standards, nor did it require that states adopt them. But the U.S. Department of Education under President Obama and Secretary of Education Arne Duncan did incentivize adoption.
In July 2009, the Education Department created Race to the Top, a $3.4 billion grant competition. States that agreed to adopt the Common Core standards won points on their applications, increasing their eligibility for a share of the money. This carrot, with a deadline attached, helped spur a majority of states to adopt the standards within a few months after they were released in July 2010. The federal government also funded the state-led consortia creating the Common Core-aligned tests.
Odin.Godofgods said: »
The new law expressly prohibits the Education Department from imposing the Common Core model, which wasn't required by No Child Left Behind but often encouraged through a series of federal waivers to the law's other requirements.
Odin.Godofgods said: »
Calling the bipartisan Every Student Succeeds Act "a Christmas miracle," Obama said the law would give states more flexibility in raising student achievement while maintaining a federal role for ensuring that all students have the opportunity to get a quality education.
the only problem with the common core math is the teachers teaching it within the last 2 years i have to deal with 4 different math teachers for my kids 2 in elementry 2 in highschool and ALL4 was giving kids failing grade because the didnt do the math the common core way but the way i taught them which i learned over 20 years ago, keep in mind they showed all work when i confronted the teachers about this there response was "thats not how i taught it" sad to say came out they didnt understand the way it was taught when i was a child so they would just fail the kids, also i dont know if you know this or not but they stop teaching cursive as well like 5-6 years ago the school system in a whole is terrible,sad times just sad times.
My 10-year old stepdaughter doesn't seem to have any trouble with common core methods, despite having learned from us the "old way" prior. Personally, when I was in school, I almost never solved math problems using the method the teachers taught in class, rather, I would make up my own and still (usually) come up with the correct answer. I've looked at it. From what I can tell, it looks like they're trying to teach kids that there is more than math than just finding a quick answer to a simple problem.
I read the word "controversy" here and roll my eyes so hard they nearly fall out of my head. The fact that some are using terms like "indoctrination" over something so petty is even more laughable.
I read the word "controversy" here and roll my eyes so hard they nearly fall out of my head. The fact that some are using terms like "indoctrination" over something so petty is even more laughable.
Schools shouldn't be involved in teaching kids the right or wrong way to solve a problem. Leave that up to the kids, some will favor one method and some with favor another, and SOME will make up their own way to do it.
Here's a problem, here's 3 different ways to solve it, go nuts.
Here's a problem, here's 3 different ways to solve it, go nuts.
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Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Schools shouldn't be involved in teaching kids the right or wrong way to solve a problem. Leave that up to the kids, some will favor one method and some with favor another, and SOME will make up their own way to do it.
Here's a problem, here's 3 different ways to solve it, go nuts.
Here's a problem, here's 3 different ways to solve it, go nuts.
That's really oversimplified. Part of what math such a powerful tool is because it is a standard international methodology. The symbols, order of operations, and formulas transcend language or aptitude.
You're viewing all math as arithmetic, the purpose of standardizing the method for even simple problems is that it's a foundation for higher levels of math and programs the brain with how to approach those subjects.
You might not agree with the way common core math is taught, I'm not really a fan, either, but just because something doesn't make sense to you doesn't mean it's bad or oppression.
Jassik said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Schools shouldn't be involved in teaching kids the right or wrong way to solve a problem. Leave that up to the kids, some will favor one method and some with favor another, and SOME will make up their own way to do it.
Here's a problem, here's 3 different ways to solve it, go nuts.
Here's a problem, here's 3 different ways to solve it, go nuts.
That's really oversimplified. Part of what math such a powerful tool is because it is a standard international methodology. The symbols, order of operations, and formulas transcend language or aptitude.
You're viewing all math as arithmetic, the purpose of standardizing the method for even simple problems is that it's a foundation for higher levels of math and programs the brain with how to approach those subjects.
You might not agree with the way common core math is taught, I'm not really a fan, either, but just because something doesn't make sense to you doesn't mean it's bad or oppression.
Basically, this is a Louisiana students life. You wont learn proper ways to solve a formula cause reasons and youre perpetually 5 years behind the rest of the country cause Jesus doesnt like calculus unless youre in some private school paying your weight in tuition (But you wont learn evolution [or like, anything beyond basic biology] either, cause all the private schools are hardcore conservative catholic diocese).
Enuyasha said: »
Jassik said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Schools shouldn't be involved in teaching kids the right or wrong way to solve a problem. Leave that up to the kids, some will favor one method and some with favor another, and SOME will make up their own way to do it.
Here's a problem, here's 3 different ways to solve it, go nuts.
Here's a problem, here's 3 different ways to solve it, go nuts.
That's really oversimplified. Part of what math such a powerful tool is because it is a standard international methodology. The symbols, order of operations, and formulas transcend language or aptitude.
You're viewing all math as arithmetic, the purpose of standardizing the method for even simple problems is that it's a foundation for higher levels of math and programs the brain with how to approach those subjects.
You might not agree with the way common core math is taught, I'm not really a fan, either, but just because something doesn't make sense to you doesn't mean it's bad or oppression.
Basically, this is a Louisiana students life. You wont learn proper ways to solve a formula cause reasons and youre perpetually 5 years behind the rest of the country cause Jesus doesnt like calculus unless youre in some private school paying your weight in tuition (But you wont learn evolution [or like, anything beyond basic biology] either, cause all the private schools are hardcore conservative catholic diocese).
GENERALLY, even if there are different ways to solve a problem, they're just permutations of the same way.
Trig, for example, you need to find the length of a side of a triangle. You can you Pythagorean's Theorem if you have 2 sides, you can use a trig function if you have an angle, you can even use inverse trig functions to find an angle you don't have then figure out the opposite angle, then use a trig function of that angle. Knowing all 3 ways is useful, because it allows you to figure out the simplest way in any given situation.
I'm all for teaching kids many ways to get things done, because it fosters deeper understanding of the material. But, kids just don't all learn the same or have the same aptitude. I've also noticed that a lot of kids simply don't have the discipline to sit down and figure stuff out. They get frustrated instantly and just give up. "I can't" is probably the most common thing I hear kids say these days.
When I was still in high school, the kids that didn't pass everything were basically given free grades to make the school look better. How is that helping them learn at all? I think they should have been left behind.
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Jassik said: »
"I can't" is probably the most common thing I hear kids say these days.
Not that the traditional method is a lot better. The way most of us were taught (assuming most folks around here are at least in their mid-20s) has a lot of inherent problems. Think about how grading in school works: you start off your term with 100% and any little error immediately and irrevocably mars your score. If you cannot do it perfectly correct on the very first try, you get a black mark that follows you, sometimes literally for years. I'm not a fan of all this participation award "You're the best, just like everyone else!" ***, but the old system of "If you're not already perfect, you're worthless" is nearly as bad.
NCLB ostensibly tried to encourage growth and achievement, but it was implemented by politicians and other idiots. They built an entire rating and funding system around the old-fashioned method of starting out at 100% and deducting along the way. Maybe this new legislation will fix that, but I'm not holding my breath because there's still too much reliance on cheap, easy, and pointless metrics.
And common core math actually makes a lot of sense, it's just not the way most of us were taught and relies heavily on visualizing numerical relationships instead of learning operations by rote. It's legislation out of government that encourages teachers to be jerks when someone multiplies 5 by 3 by showing three groups of 5 instead of five groups of 3. That and some teachers are self-important shitbags who like mocking 8-year-olds.
Shiva.Onorgul said: »
What I find is that someone has taught kids that they don't have to try very hard and, moreover, will still get too much praise when they can't be bothered.
I don't blame the kids for their lack of ambition or discipline, far from it. Actually, I noticed something the other day that I just couldn't wrap my head around. A mini-van leaves a house in my neighborhood, backing out into the street in front of me then sitting there for a good 30 seconds while the mother tried to get the stupid backseat TV working for the kids. I then was forced to follow them part way to where I was going. Where they pulled off had me dumbfounded, as it was the elementary school, where the TV turned off and 2 kids got out. Not only could they not walk 3 blocks to school, they couldn't even ride 3 blocks without the TV on.
Shiva.Onorgul said: »
That and some teachers are self-important shitbags who like mocking 8-year-olds.
I had one of those in school. Needless to say, we butted heads, and it caused me a lot more grief than was remotely reasonable. I saw him years later at a restaurant. Walked into the restroom as he was walking out, nearly knocked him on his butt with the door by accident. I knew he was a small person, but how small shocked me. He's about 5'4". A small man who picks on little kids. Something tells me if we paid teachers well, we'd have the ability to drum out pieces of ***like him.
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Schools shouldn't be involved in teaching kids the right or wrong way to solve a problem. Leave that up to the kids, some will favor one method and some with favor another, and SOME will make up their own way to do it.
Here's a problem, here's 3 different ways to solve it, go nuts.
Here's a problem, here's 3 different ways to solve it, go nuts.
Jassik said: »
That's really oversimplified. Part of what math such a powerful tool is because it is a standard international methodology. The symbols, order of operations, and formulas transcend language or aptitude.
You're viewing all math as arithmetic, the purpose of standardizing the method for even simple problems is that it's a foundation for higher levels of math and programs the brain with how to approach those subjects.
You're viewing all math as arithmetic, the purpose of standardizing the method for even simple problems is that it's a foundation for higher levels of math and programs the brain with how to approach those subjects.
My son is in 2nd grade and I am being introduced to common core math. The approach being taken by the teacher is exactly what Nausi explained. The teacher has been teaching every possible way to solve the problem and as long as the answer is correct the child is correct.
You have to learn to walk before you run. While I think common core math is horrible I can see that it might be able to help with more advanced math later. Whether that is true or not and whether the teacher is wasting time is yet to be seen.
Quetzalcoatl.Cementfoot said: »
the only problem with the common core math is the teachers teaching it within the last 2 years i have to deal with 4 different math teachers for my kids 2 in elementry 2 in highschool and ALL4 was giving kids failing grade because the didnt do the math the common core way but the way i taught them which i learned over 20 years ago, keep in mind they showed all work when i confronted the teachers about this there response was "thats not how i taught it" sad to say came out they didnt understand the way it was taught when i was a child so they would just fail the kids, also i dont know if you know this or not but they stop teaching cursive as well like 5-6 years ago the school system in a whole is terrible,sad times just sad times.
Seriously dude, proofread.
Also, cursive is functionally useless in today's world, I wish schools would do more to improve curriculum like that.
Jetackuu said: »
Also, cursive is functionally useless in today's world, I wish schools would do more to improve curriculum like that.
Even then, by loosely its EXTREMELY loose. I pretty much just make sure the first letters of the first and last name are legible then attempt cursive scripts (Although, cursive writing is more appreciated in my visual communications courses because you make lettering look fancy and pretty).
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