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First official GOP President announcement
By Enuyasha 2015-04-17 12:54:52
If you are poor, dont procreate Sorry I didn't realize common sense went out the window on this one.
By all means if you're too poor to raise a child, too poor to buy a pack of condoms, then you might as well *** all the time cause the government will end up screwing you anyway. Then CPS can come and take your children away since you can't feed them.
Whatever you do, don't try to better your situation. Just let people who work for a living take care of you and whatever mess you create. Cause we're all one big happy family, right?
When do we start signing Kumbaya? Even if you are in poverty you can still raise a child. Of course, you should not, as this will lead to a very depressing existence and will most definitely end in the death of your child or the loss of your child. However, noone can tell you by law NOT to procreate or do the basic motions of life because of your class,race,creed, or gender.
But in the end, if buying a car would allow you to get a better job, should you not be able to? If having a phone would allow you to get said better job, you should not be afforded this opportunity? If anything would lead to the betterment of your situation, should you then not be afforded these things by the state to uplift you from poverty into sustainability? Even if your fellow man must help you inadvertently?
Logic, its a thing.
 Ragnarok.Nausi
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-04-17 12:55:50
If you are poor, dont procreate Sorry I didn't realize common sense went out the window on this one.
By all means if you're too poor to raise a child, too poor to buy a pack of condoms, then you might as well *** all the time cause the government will end up screwing you anyway. Then CPS can come and take your children away since you can't feed them.
Whatever you do, don't try to better your situation. Just let people who work for a living take care of you and whatever mess you create. Cause we're all one big happy family, right?
When do we start signing Kumbaya? Even if you are in poverty you can still raise a child. Of course, you should not, as this will lead to a very depressing existence and will most definitely end in the death of your child or the loss of your child. However, noone can tell you by law NOT to procreate or do the basic motions of life because of your class,race,creed, or gender.
But in the end, if buying a car would allow you to get a better job, should you not be able to? If having a phone would allow you to get said better job, you should not be afforded this opportunity? If anything would lead to the betterment of your situation, should you then not be afforded these things by the state to uplift you from poverty into sustainability? Even if your fellow man must help you inadvertently?
Strawman, its a thing.
Ftfy
 Leviathan.Chaosx
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-04-17 12:56:10
sex for pleasure is not a recreational activity. Quote: noun
1.
the state or feeling of being pleased.
2.
enjoyment or satisfaction derived from what is to one's liking; gratification; delight.
3.
worldly or frivolous enjoyment:
the pursuit of pleasure.
4.
recreation or amusement; diversion; enjoyment:
Are you traveling on business or for pleasure?
5.
sensual gratification.
6.
a cause or source of enjoyment or delight:
It was a pleasure to see you.
7.
pleasurable quality:
the pleasure of his company.
It came down to giving out the dictionary definition.
Pleasure is not an inalienable right. The pursuit of pleasure is.
The argument here is that that pursuit has become not a pursuit, but some sort of odd handout necessary to live. Might as well give teenage boys free girlfriends without any effort that do what they say.
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Leviathan.Chaosx
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-04-17 12:57:18
However, noone can tell you by law NOT to procreate or do the basic motions of life because of your class,race,creed, or gender. No one is arguing that.
We're saying be responsible. Don't ask the government for handouts on things that are not necessary to live.
[+]
Ragnarok.Nausi
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-04-17 12:57:36
sex for pleasure is not a recreational activity. Quote: noun
1.
the state or feeling of being pleased.
2.
enjoyment or satisfaction derived from what is to one's liking; gratification; delight.
3.
worldly or frivolous enjoyment:
the pursuit of pleasure.
4.
recreation or amusement; diversion; enjoyment:
Are you traveling on business or for pleasure?
5.
sensual gratification.
6.
a cause or source of enjoyment or delight:
It was a pleasure to see you.
7.
pleasurable quality:
the pleasure of his company.
It came down to giving out the dictionary definition.
Pleasure is not an inalienable right. The pursuit of pleasure is.
The argument here is that that pursuit has become not a pursuit, but some sort of odd handout necessary to live. Might as well give teenage boys free girlfriends without any effort that do what they say. Careful bro, lest you'll be accused of "moving some goalposts"...
[+]
Leviathan.Chaosx
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-04-17 12:58:20
You should apply at some point here.
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By Enuyasha 2015-04-17 12:58:52
Your point is that I backpedal and revise my own points and change the goalposts?
If so then you are incorrect, I offer clarification when what I say is misinterpreted and not properly responded to as is frequently the case. No, my point was clearly stated in the first place. Your point has been spiraled away from your original point.
If you are poor, dont buy a car
If you are poor, Dont buy a house
If you are poor dont go to the bar
We can thusly extend this logic to
If you are poor, dont procreate
If you are poor, dont go to the movies
If you are poor, dont buy food
if you are poor, dont prepare said food
if you are poor, dont start a business
And then we can just summarize this into two points instead of a multitude of largely willingfully stupid points
if you are poor, dont pursue happiness
if you are poor, dont pursue the american dream.
Ergo, you missed the point entirely because you mentally stopped short. Then rebounded, then backpedaled, then moved the goal posts, then used semantics against your own point.
It was clear, you intend to ignore the origin of the logic instead of combating said logic with an actual response.
Ok, I said what I said, and what I didn't say is something I didn't say. When you "assume" what I said means something else, or when you "summarize" what you assume I said into your two condensed statements, you're putting words in my mouth. You're creating the straw man. Presumably because you'd rather argue against that instead of what I said.
I then provided clarification that what I said was to mean that one shouldn't spend money they don't have. You presumably don't like that answer and AGAIN create the straw man by saying I am not in fact offering clarification and instead "moving the goal posts".
I meant what I meant. You certainly can pretend I didn't and pretend that you knew what I meant or you can accept that I knew what I meant. No, you meant what you meant and now youre trying to say you didnt mean what you meant. You are in fact moving the goal posts because now you didnt mean what you meant to say because now this is what you meant you meant.
Circular logic, leads to unending repeating of the same point, you dont want poor people to be able to pursue happiness because they are poor even though their pursuit of happiness is different than yours. When, if a certain event in that pursuit would uplift them socioeconomically, you would rather they didnt because it doesnt fit into your specific box of how that process should go.
There is no strawman. Stop using that word if you dont know what it means.
By Enuyasha 2015-04-17 13:00:45
sex for pleasure is not a recreational activity. Quote: noun
1.
the state or feeling of being pleased.
2.
enjoyment or satisfaction derived from what is to one's liking; gratification; delight.
3.
worldly or frivolous enjoyment:
the pursuit of pleasure.
4.
recreation or amusement; diversion; enjoyment:
Are you traveling on business or for pleasure?
5.
sensual gratification.
6.
a cause or source of enjoyment or delight:
It was a pleasure to see you.
7.
pleasurable quality:
the pleasure of his company.
It came down to giving out the dictionary definition.
Pleasure is not an inalienable right. The pursuit of pleasure is.
The argument here is that that pursuit has become not a pursuit, but some sort of odd handout necessary to live. Might as well give teenage boys free girlfriends without any effort that do what they say. Careful bro, lest you'll be accused of "moving some goalposts"... This is actually cherrypicking.
It is necessary for the sustainability of ones genetic line to procreate. It is a natural god given pursuit, thusly it is inalienable.
The fact that you have to go so far into a slippery slope to avoid that is laughable at best.
Ragnarok.Nausi
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-04-17 13:02:46
Your point is that I backpedal and revise my own points and change the goalposts?
If so then you are incorrect, I offer clarification when what I say is misinterpreted and not properly responded to as is frequently the case. No, my point was clearly stated in the first place. Your point has been spiraled away from your original point.
If you are poor, dont buy a car
If you are poor, Dont buy a house
If you are poor dont go to the bar
We can thusly extend this logic to
If you are poor, dont procreate
If you are poor, dont go to the movies
If you are poor, dont buy food
if you are poor, dont prepare said food
if you are poor, dont start a business
And then we can just summarize this into two points instead of a multitude of largely willingfully stupid points
if you are poor, dont pursue happiness
if you are poor, dont pursue the american dream.
Ergo, you missed the point entirely because you mentally stopped short. Then rebounded, then backpedaled, then moved the goal posts, then used semantics against your own point.
It was clear, you intend to ignore the origin of the logic instead of combating said logic with an actual response.
Ok, I said what I said, and what I didn't say is something I didn't say. When you "assume" what I said means something else, or when you "summarize" what you assume I said into your two condensed statements, you're putting words in my mouth. You're creating the straw man. Presumably because you'd rather argue against that instead of what I said.
I then provided clarification that what I said was to mean that one shouldn't spend money they don't have. You presumably don't like that answer and AGAIN create the straw man by saying I am not in fact offering clarification and instead "moving the goal posts".
I meant what I meant. You certainly can pretend I didn't and pretend that you knew what I meant or you can accept that I knew what I meant. No, you meant what you meant and now youre trying to say you didnt mean what you meant. You are in fact moving the goal posts because now you didnt mean what you meant to say because now this is what you meant you meant.
Circular logic, leads to unending repeating of the same point, you dont want poor people to be able to pursue happiness because they are poor even though their pursuit of happiness is different than yours. When, if a certain event in that pursuit would uplift them socioeconomically, you would rather they didnt because it doesnt fit into your specific box of how that process should go.
There is no strawman. Stop using that word if you dont know what it means. Ok, I never said anything like that, and when offered subsequent clarification, you've rejected it in favor of the forum equivalent of kicking and screaming.
[+]
Leviathan.Chaosx
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-04-17 13:03:22
Sexual intercourse is not a necessary thing to live.
Ragnarok.Nausi
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-04-17 13:04:15
Sexual intercourse is not a necessary thing to live.
Do you even monk bro?
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By Enuyasha 2015-04-17 13:04:54
Your point is that I backpedal and revise my own points and change the goalposts?
If so then you are incorrect, I offer clarification when what I say is misinterpreted and not properly responded to as is frequently the case. No, my point was clearly stated in the first place. Your point has been spiraled away from your original point.
If you are poor, dont buy a car
If you are poor, Dont buy a house
If you are poor dont go to the bar
We can thusly extend this logic to
If you are poor, dont procreate
If you are poor, dont go to the movies
If you are poor, dont buy food
if you are poor, dont prepare said food
if you are poor, dont start a business
And then we can just summarize this into two points instead of a multitude of largely willingfully stupid points
if you are poor, dont pursue happiness
if you are poor, dont pursue the american dream.
Ergo, you missed the point entirely because you mentally stopped short. Then rebounded, then backpedaled, then moved the goal posts, then used semantics against your own point.
It was clear, you intend to ignore the origin of the logic instead of combating said logic with an actual response.
Ok, I said what I said, and what I didn't say is something I didn't say. When you "assume" what I said means something else, or when you "summarize" what you assume I said into your two condensed statements, you're putting words in my mouth. You're creating the straw man. Presumably because you'd rather argue against that instead of what I said.
I then provided clarification that what I said was to mean that one shouldn't spend money they don't have. You presumably don't like that answer and AGAIN create the straw man by saying I am not in fact offering clarification and instead "moving the goal posts".
I meant what I meant. You certainly can pretend I didn't and pretend that you knew what I meant or you can accept that I knew what I meant. No, you meant what you meant and now youre trying to say you didnt mean what you meant. You are in fact moving the goal posts because now you didnt mean what you meant to say because now this is what you meant you meant.
Circular logic, leads to unending repeating of the same point, you dont want poor people to be able to pursue happiness because they are poor even though their pursuit of happiness is different than yours. When, if a certain event in that pursuit would uplift them socioeconomically, you would rather they didnt because it doesnt fit into your specific box of how that process should go.
There is no strawman. Stop using that word if you dont know what it means. Ok, I never said anything like that, and when offered subsequent clarification, you've rejected it in favor of kicking and screaming. Youre the one kicking and screaming because i pointed out where your logic leads, and now you want to take that back. You are not clarifying, you are reneging your intentionally vague and intentionally misrepresented point.
Leviathan.Chaosx
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-04-17 13:07:01
What's next, mandatory crack for crackheads who wind up living underneath a bridge?
By Enuyasha 2015-04-17 13:07:59
Sexual intercourse is not a necessary thing to live. It is necessary for the survival of your bloodline, Not life.
Inalienable rights, constitution, blah, whatever youre just going to repeat your own *** and ignore.
Ragnarok.Nausi
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-04-17 13:08:38
See this is really what I mean when I jest in reference to liberalism being a mental disorder. I say something and it is immediately construed down someone's "infallible" train of prejudice into whatever they particularly prefer to argue against. Is knee jerk projection a psychological phenomenon?
This is why we can't have nice things I guess.
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By Enuyasha 2015-04-17 13:11:24
See this is really what I mean when I jest in reference to liberalism being a mental disorder. I say something and it is immediately construed down someone's "infallible" train of prejudice into whatever they particularly prefer to argue against. Is knee jerk projection a psychological phenomenon?
This is why we can't have nice things I guess. Ironic really. Seeing as how your logic is apparently fallible when presented back at you.
And then we return to LIBERALS LIBERALS LIBERALS.
YouTube Video Placeholder
This is literally this argument
and im nowhere near projecting onto anything. Are you sure you understand these words you are stringing together?
Leviathan.Chaosx
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-04-17 13:15:31
Sexual intercourse is not a necessary thing to live. It is necessary for the survival of your bloodline, Not life. This discussion was about sex for pleasure since birth control is not a necessity to live and thus should not be paid for by the government.
How are you going to continue your bloodline using birth control?
[+]
Ragnarok.Nausi
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-04-17 13:15:44
What's next, mandatory crack for crackheads who wind up living underneath a bridge?
How dare you not recognize their right to pursue happiness.
Leviathan.Chaosx
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-04-17 13:17:16
liberalism being a mental disorder I used to laugh when people said that years and years ago. But, holy cow, I think there might be some truth to it.
By Enuyasha 2015-04-17 13:19:00
Sexual intercourse is not a necessary thing to live. It is necessary for the survival of your bloodline, Not life. This discussion was about sex for pleasure since birth control is not a necessity to live and thus should not be paid for by the government.
How are you going to continue your bloodline using birth control? How is that argument relevant if the point is not?
However, if someone wants birth control and not to procreate, and the problem is rampant uncontrolled sex without any form of contraception because they cant afford it then....they should keep on repressing sexual urges because they cant afford not to buy things that would allow them not to produce children?
Hokay.
Ragnarok.Nausi
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-04-17 13:20:09
liberalism being a mental disorder I used to laugh when people said that years and years ago. But, holy cow, I think there might be some truth to it. 
Leviathan.Chaosx
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-04-17 13:21:18
However, if someone wants birth control and not to procreate, and the problem is rampant uncontrolled sex without any form of contraception because they cant afford it then....they should keep on repressing sexual urges because they cant afford not to buy things that would allow them not to produce children? Masturbation. Otherwise the whole argument over not being able to control your urges goes against rape being a crime.
Ragnarok.Nausi
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-04-17 13:28:08
However, if someone wants birth control and not to procreate, and the problem is rampant uncontrolled sex without any form of contraception because they cant afford it then....they should keep on repressing sexual urges because they cant afford not to buy things that would allow them not to produce children? Masturbation. Otherwise the whole argument over not being able to control your urges goes against rape being a crime.
There are plenty of ways to engage in sexual release without great risk to pregnancy.
By Enuyasha 2015-04-17 13:32:15
However, if someone wants birth control and not to procreate, and the problem is rampant uncontrolled sex without any form of contraception because they cant afford it then....they should keep on repressing sexual urges because they cant afford not to buy things that would allow them not to produce children? Masturbation. Otherwise the whole argument over not being able to control your urges goes against rape being a crime.
There are plenty of ways to engage in sexual release without great risk to pregnancy. So again, you want someone to solely participate in what you would consider best. Okay, thats fine if everyone, you know, wants to do that. You know, since everyone is exactly the same as you.
The argument is not about controlling your own urges, but someone telling you you have to repress your urges because you are poor and or cant afford contraceptives. Please dont be willingly ignorant.
Bahamut.Ravael
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13640
By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-04-17 13:32:39
Even if you are in poverty you can still raise a child. Of course, you should not, as this will lead to a very depressing existence and will most definitely end in the death of your child or the loss of your child.
You hear that, guys? If you are one of the 1.2 billion people living in poverty, you should not have children. Your child will automatically have a depressing existence, because poor people cannot be happy. Also, your children will definitely die or be taken away from you. Citation not needed.
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By Enuyasha 2015-04-17 13:34:32
Even if you are in poverty you can still raise a child. Of course, you should not, as this will lead to a very depressing existence and will most definitely end in the death of your child or the loss of your child.
You hear that, guys? If you are one of the 1.2 billion people living in poverty, you should not have children. Your child will automatically have a depressing existence, because poor people cannot be happy. Also, your children will definitely die or be taken away from you. Citation not needed. Twisting my words, when given clear clarification. You are being childish now.
The possibility is there, dont act like it isnt because it fits your point.
Bahamut.Ravael
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13640
By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-04-17 13:38:50
Uh, those were your exact words and I'm the first one to challenge that statement that I saw. Please, backped... er, clarify for me.
[+]
By Enuyasha 2015-04-17 13:39:33
Uh, those were your exact words and I'm the first one to challenge that statement that I saw. Please, backped... er, clarify for me. There is a difference between should not because of risks, and do not because youre poor. Please catch up.
Dont try to play that ***.
he did not once ever clarify unto his point. He backpedaled and tried to tell me waht he meant he meant because he entirely knew what he actually meant and got caught meaning what he meant.
Bahamut.Ravael
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13640
By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-04-17 13:43:13
Uh, those were your exact words and I'm the first one to challenge that statement that I saw. Please, backped... er, clarify for me. There is a difference between should not because of risks, and do not because youre poor. Please catch up. Dont try to play that ***.
Point out where I said "do not" in reference to your post. I said "should not". Doesn't really matter, though, because in either context it's stupid.
[+]
By Enuyasha 2015-04-17 13:44:25
Uh, those were your exact words and I'm the first one to challenge that statement that I saw. Please, backped... er, clarify for me. There is a difference between should not because of risks, and do not because youre poor. Please catch up. Dont try to play that ***.
Point out where I said "do not" in reference to your post. I said "should not". Doesn't really matter, though, because in either context it's stupid. It is, but you chose to try and challenge me into a match of hipocrisy, which it was not. Thank you for trying to strawman and failing.
which is the point of this entire conversation, arguing with an obvious point that was made, getting that point called out, then rebutting with stupid and continuing to rebuttal with stupid.
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