9yo Ran To Death?

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2010-06-21
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9yo ran to death?
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 Odin.Godofgods
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By Odin.Godofgods 2015-03-10 19:17:33  
Quote:
Prosecutors play 911 call of girl they say was run to death



GADSDEN, Ala. (AP) — Jurors have heard the chilling 911 call that was made when an Alabama girl collapsed after running around her yard in what prosecutors say was punishment inflicted by her grandmother.

Grandmother Joyce Garrard is heard repeatedly calling the name of 9-year-old Savannah Hardin in the background of the more than nine-minute recording played in court Tuesday.

The child's stepmother, Jessica Mae Hardin, made the call telling a 911 operator the girl had a seizure. She never says the girl had been running or had any previous medical problems.

The operator says Garrard at one point is heard asking for a smoke while the child was unconscious on the ground. The defense suggests the woman was actually asking for a throw, like a blanket.

THIS IS A BREAKING NEWS UPDATE. Check back soon for further information. AP's earlier story is below.

A neighbor of a woman accused of making her granddaughter run until she died testified Tuesday that the girl was crying and begging to stop before she collapsed.

Grandmother Joyce Hardin Garrard, 49, "was hollering at her, telling her she better move it," Jolie Jacobs told jurors.

Prosecutors say Garrard ran 9-year-old Savannah Hardin to death as punishment for a lie three years ago.

Jacobs lived across the street from the girl's home at the time. She said she saw Savannah running and carrying wood as Garrard yelled at her.

"She was crying and begging to stop," Jacobs said, Savannah fell in apparent exhaustion, still crying. "Joyce kept telling her to move it."

Jacobs said she had decided to intervene, but an ambulance arrived. The girl died in a hospital three days later, and Jacobs said she regrets not doing something to help.

The defense denies that Garrard meant to do anything to harm the child.

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 Cerberus.Anjisnu
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By Cerberus.Anjisnu 2015-03-10 19:29:11  
see what happens when you outlaw spankings ? parents/grandparents are forced to get creative and kids die
 Cerberus.Halticus
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By Cerberus.Halticus 2015-03-10 19:33:48  
They should make her run around the prison yard all day, everyday when she gets convicted. Besides, looks like she could use it.
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 Ragnarok.Legendarycloud
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By Ragnarok.Legendarycloud 2015-03-10 19:35:29  
I doubt her intention was to kill her grandchild by making her run laps. If anything, it was probably so she'd lose a bit of weight while facing a punishment.
 Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-03-10 19:35:31  
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-10 19:36:38  
Ragnarok.Legendarycloud said: »
I doubt her intention was to kill her grandchild by making her run laps. If anything, it was probably so she'd lose a bit of weight while facing a punishment.
Intent means ***all when someone is having a hard time breathing, or complaining of severe aches and pains, while the tormentor is watching over such a cruel and unusual punishment.
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 Cerberus.Halticus
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By Cerberus.Halticus 2015-03-10 19:37:05  
Ragnarok.Legendarycloud said: »
I doubt her intention was to kill her grandchild by making her run laps. If anything, it was probably so she'd lose a bit of weight while facing a punishment.
Her intentions are irrelevant at this point. The little girl lost her life due to this heartless *** and she needs to pay.
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By fonewear 2015-03-10 19:38:25  
I'm guessing the kid was just trying to run away from Alabama !
 Bismarck.Magnuss
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By Bismarck.Magnuss 2015-03-10 19:40:58  
fonewear said: »
I'm guessing the kid was just trying to run away from Alabama !
I would too, to get away from Sarah Palin.
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By fonewear 2015-03-10 19:41:50  
That is Alaska but I get the same sentiment.
 Odin.Godofgods
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By Odin.Godofgods 2015-03-10 19:43:01  
Ragnarok.Legendarycloud said: »
I doubt her intention was to kill her grandchild by making her run laps. If anything, it was probably so she'd lose a bit of weight while facing a punishment.

Quote:
"She was crying and begging to stop," Jacobs said, Savannah fell in apparent exhaustion, still crying. "Joyce kept telling her to move it."

if it wasnt intentional then it was pure ignorance. Either way'
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-10 19:43:04  
***, there are a lot of better, and more creative ways to have a 9 year old child learn a lesson that doesn't include running them to death FFS.

And without being inherently abusive to them, such as taking away privileges.

Make them write out "I will not lie. Lying is bad" 10-20 times.

But punishing a child for something that happened 3 years prior to the punishment? HOLY *** HELL! That is simply vindictive behavior.
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-10 19:43:37  
Odin.Godofgods said: »
Ragnarok.Legendarycloud said: »
I doubt her intention was to kill her grandchild by making her run laps. If anything, it was probably so she'd lose a bit of weight while facing a punishment.

Quote:
"She was crying and begging to stop," Jacobs said, Savannah fell in apparent exhaustion, still crying. "Joyce kept telling her to move it."

if it wasnt intentional then it was pure ignorance. Either way'
Best part is, ignorance is not a viable defense.
 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2015-03-10 19:45:47  
my sister would cry and beg for my mom to stop if she got spanked too

you don't really expect a 9 year old with no known health problems to die from running too much, i can see how it'd go either way
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-10 19:46:38  
What you don't expect, and what the reality is, are very different things.
 Cerberus.Anjisnu
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By Cerberus.Anjisnu 2015-03-10 19:47:37  
oh well i suppose 6,999,999,999 to go for a world with no neighbors
 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2015-03-10 19:47:57  
i don't see the punishment as excessive and the piece should never have been published without a medical report
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-10 19:50:30  
No, it's definitely excessive.

Even running a child to exhaustion as a form of punishment is extremely abusive.
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By fonewear 2015-03-10 19:51:04  
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
my sister would cry and beg for my mom to stop if she got spanked too

you don't really expect a 9 year old with no known health problems to die from running too much, i can see how it'd go either way

I pay good money to get spanked !
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 Cerberus.Anjisnu
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By Cerberus.Anjisnu 2015-03-10 19:53:39  
i pay good money to watch you get spanked
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 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2015-03-10 19:56:06  
Bloodrose said: »
Even running a child to exhaustion as a form of punishment is extremely abusive.
you don't know how long she ran for or her cause of death, but if running to exhaustion was abusive then there's a lot to be said against my high school gym teacher(or any military training..)
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-10 20:01:09  
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
Bloodrose said: »
Even running a child to exhaustion as a form of punishment is extremely abusive.
you don't know how long she ran for or her cause of death, but if running to exhaustion was abusive then there's a lot to be said against my high school gym teacher(or any military training..)
Military Training pushes you to become better, run for longer, not as a means of punishment or exhaustion, and even in the military, you are not run past the point of exhaustion to a state of collapse.

Regardless of how long she ran, a child is not held to the same standards as military personel by any stretch of the imagination.

Hell, if the Military isn't allowed to use it as a form of punishment on grown, physically fit, adult men and women, why is it suddenly permissible, or gain any defense when it applies to a child who does not meet those specific standards?

And yes, by all means according to US law, forcing a child to run to exhaustion, and beyond, into a state of collapse, is abusive and falls under the category of child abuse and endangerment - which is what happened.
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 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2015-03-10 20:03:54  
forcing a child to exercise is fine in my book

you're saying all of this without

-any information as to how long the girl ran

-any reference to her reporting any symptoms while running

-anything at all from her medical report

the grandmother probably is a horrible person and very well might have put the kid to death, but you don't have the information to prove that.. without a medical report you have no clue if it was a preexisting condition that would've came out eventually regardless..
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-10 20:10:37  
Forcing a child to exercise is one thing, but again, running a child to the point of exhaustive collapse, regardless of symptoms or health conditions, is, as pointed out, once again by law, illegal. It's child abuse, plain and simple, and child endangerment.

The fact you are actively defending this position is quite telling of who you are as a person.

Exacerbating an already prominent condition, in this case would be ruled as the cause of death - Exhaustion does that to the human body, so an intelligent person would seriously not cling to such a flimsy excuse as "you don't know her personal medical condition", or even defend such cruel and illegal punishments to begin with.

Still, you have yet to counter the fact that if it's illegal to punish adult men and women like this under the Cruel and Unusual punishment clauses scattered all over US law, why is it then ok, according to your stance, to punish a child in this fashion?

There is absolutely no defensible position for this kind of punishment.

2-3 laps around the backyard? Fine, as long as it doesn't cause any kind of harm, or aggravate existing conditions. The purpose of a punishment is to teach a lesson, something you've clearly forgotten.
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 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2015-03-10 20:12:03  
i'm not defending anyone, i'm saying that there is not nearly enough information available and the public shitstorm guarantees the result they want in court

it's trial by public opinion, and it's most likely not necessary in the least in this case
 Fenrir.Camiie
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By Fenrir.Camiie 2015-03-10 20:13:10  
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
forcing a child to exercise is fine in my book

I'd read 50 Shades before I'd read that book. Forcing a kid to exercise will more than likely have the opposite effect than what's intended. If they see exercise as a negative experience or a punishment do you really think they're going to be inclined to exercise by choice in the future? They'll become averse to it.

Quote:
you're saying all of this without

-any information as to how long the girl ran

-any reference to her reporting any symptoms while running

-anything at all from her medical report

As are you.
 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2015-03-10 20:16:49  
Fenrir.Camiie said: »
I'd read 50 Shades before I'd read that book. Forcing a kid to exercise will more than likely have the opposite effect than what's intended. If they see exercise as a negative experience or a punishment do you really think they're going to be inclined to exercise by choice in the future? They'll become averse to it.
decent point, didn't consider the potential aversion to exercise(counterpoint would be that people who aren't made to exercise as children and don't do it on their own may end up in such shape that it's painful/impractical to do in the future)

Quote:
Quote:
you're saying all of this without

-any information as to how long the girl ran

-any reference to her reporting any symptoms while running

-anything at all from her medical report

As are you.
That would be why I said it could go either way and pointed out a lack of information, instead of aligning myself with either end of the argument.
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-10 20:17:20  
The public shitstorm doesn't guarantee anything.


Publication bans come into effect in high profile cases, information allowed out of a courtroom is limited until after the trial, and as it can jeopardize a trial in process, leaking information is an offence filed under obstruction of justice in criminal cases.

There are literally over 100 ways to protect the integrity of a trial so that the defendant gets a fair trial - either from a sitting judge, or a sitting judge and a jury of her peers - which in some cases will be brought in from out of state.
 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2015-03-10 20:20:39  
Every post is along the lines of 'she ran the kid to death'. Exercise isn't a routine cause for seizure, and without a medical report you're assuming the woman killed her based on your perception of what kind of person would force a kid to run.

If you think potential jurors wouldn't be swayed by seeing that on the news, I don't know what to tell you.

As soon as a medical report shows that the running caused her problems, I'd be more than glad to help crucify the grandmother.
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By Bloodrose 2015-03-10 20:28:23  
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
Every post is along the lines of 'she ran the kid to death'. Exercise isn't a routine cause for seizure, and without a medical report you're assuming the woman killed her based on your perception of what kind of person would force a kid to run.

If you think potential jurors wouldn't be swayed by seeing that on the news, I don't know what to tell you.
You are a god damn *** idiot, aren't you?

Every post is made in relation to going well beyond what is acceptable, even for well trained, well vetted and exercised adults.

The fact that you defended this kind of behavior, by saying you didn't see her punishment as excessive, is blindingly HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE to say the least, let alone your lack of knowledge on legal practices and information. Which is why, to observe a fair and impartial jury, they would be brought in from other states where the story hasn't been ingrained.

See, you're the moron making the assumption that "what kind of person would make a child run", where as I focus on the specifics of running a child to and beyond exhaustion, which does *NOTHING* to teach a child a lesson, let alone a lesson about lying. Existing medical conditions, if any are even present, are then further aggravated by that level of exhaustion.

Still waiting for your to even counter anything I've said about it not being legal to do so to an adult, but for you, it's apparently ok to run a child to severe exhaustive collapse.

Exercise by itself? it's actually gone 50-50 for causing seizures, 80/100 for those experiencing severe dehydration or exhaustion. However, those who become dehydrated suffer from exhaustion at a much more alarming rate.

You also ignore the 100+ ways the courts, lawyers, and public defenders have to protect the integrity of the courts, to insure a fair trial is before the courts.

I knew you were dense, but holy ***.
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