A New War You Can't Blame On Bush! Or Can You?

Obama will be held responsible (in my book) if we invade Syria and bog ourselves down in another pointless war that has nothing to do with our immediate national security. The pols can shout up and down that this will set a dangerous precedent if we don't attack and I'll continue to say this boils down to ego and *** waving.

For the record, you two just made the same point coming from opposite ends. Yet you still both choose to argue to agreeing points rather than looking for a solution.

This is the true American spirit. Finger pointing.

No wonder why Russia is intervening.

Not going to rehash the reasons why Romney lost or talk about the billion dollar negative campaign run against him. He had very little to work with like he said, 47% of voters will like Obama no matter what he does.

Today's Job Approval Rating Amidst his failures

"The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Tuesday shows that 47% of Likely U.S. Voters approve of President Obama's job performance. Fifty percent (50%) disapprove"

The only point we agreed on was that McCain had no chance of winning the election, we completely disagreed on why. Common ground is the basis for any kind of reasonable discourse.

I meant the point about how the average voter does not research who they are voting for properly in terms of policies past and present. They go with the crowd that they associate themselves with.

and 2% just magically disappeared because they dont exist (But they are probably still liberal commie scum hellbent on making paper dolls out of the constitution).

also


I also wouldnt put it far past that site to only allow paying subscribers to vote in said polls (it seems you also need an account to even view current polls, which skews numbers to a limited pool of actual logged in members and not a whole base of poll-able viewers.)

Also, Its not just that he said 47% of Americans will vote Obama anyway, its that he alleged those 47% are leeches,dependent on government, and always play the victim card (whih is outrageously untrue).Also, if Romney clarified his plans instead of going "***' CHINA,OBAMA,AND THOSE DARNED GOVERNMENT PEOPLES! I HAVE A WELL ORGANIZED PLAN TO FIX EVERYTHING IN THIS AMERICA BUSINESS!" he MAY HAVE been elected. Instead, he chose to ride the Benghazi wagon and vaguely go on about starting a war with China over Apple counterfeits and "currency manipulation". Also, standing firm on more than just "imma beat Obama" would've helped immensely. But nope, mittens was beaten cause 47% of Americans just love the ***out of Obama anyway (And those same 47% of all Americans are welfare moochers,dependent on government, and are victims all the time).

Theoretically it's not the partisan bases that are in contention, it's the independents. But, mostly you are right, they do not thoroughly research the candidates. But they generally (in terms of voting data) vote for the opposite party most recently holding the office. That doesn't apply to congressional seats, but it hasn't been since 1988 and before that 1929 that the same party held the presidency back to back (excluding re-elections which follow a different voting trend).

I was just referencing that he blamed the media for not properly scrutinizing Obama's record, when there are more powerful forces at work.

That's the thing about polls that post % s and never reveal the amount of people polled. It could 5 of 10 people. Conservatives relying on Rasmussen polls to prove a conservative point is like a liberal using a poll taken by MSNBC to prove a liberal point. Every one knows they aren't polling across the aisle.

Also Romneys public image was destroyed in the Republican primaries by competing candidates. To say he was defeated because Obama ran a mudsling campaign with a billion dollar budget is like saying every Republican candidate other than Romney was bought and paid for by the Obama.

That being said...can we get back to the topic?

Yea, sorry. Syria is going to play out like desert shield/storm on roids i fear. Its kinda like history repeating itself with a little muslim-president conspiracy theorums thrown in there for a M.Night Shyamalanian twist. I just hope we dont do anything really stupid...again.

Mitt lost for reasons like this. While his statements are true, you don't advertise you don't give a ***about 47% of Americans.

Back on topic, I don't like the way things are going right now..... There is a growing support here for us to act on this. with John Boehner starting to back Obama.....

Well, if most people understood what he was saying, they would understand that it wasn't that he didn't care for them, he said that he wouldn't waste any energy trying to get their votes because they are dead set on voting for Obama because their way of life was threatened from taking government handouts.

But the MSM (aka liberal press) had to blow this out of proportion just to allow Obama to win (and their coffers to increase because they know they can sell more bad news with Obama at the helm than with Romney).

This is not like Iraq and Afghanistan in that we will probably not be fighting a guerrilla type action.
1. Syria has modern warfare capability, weapons and troops.
2. Syria has allies who also have these capabilities and who are backing Syria at the moment

If the US and other nations attack without definitive proof from an outside agency that chemical weapons were used I expect mission creep (moving from "targeted strikes" to boots on the gound) to occur. And really mission creep is already being discussed by Obama and Kerry (now it is about getting rid of Assad and "stabilizing" the country, protecting "national interests" with the possible use of troops, etc).

This does not seem to be about the chemical weapons being used anymore but about remaking a country into something the US would like to see.

As someone mentioned before it also concerns me when people who are unwilling to work together on so many issues come to the same conclusion with little debate on a topic. This is how we got the patriot act and the Iraq intervention.

I think you just like to say ego and *** waving at this point...

who doesn't!?!

Why would I change how I feel on the topic? Feel free to shoot down what I say but alot of the politicians responses that are on the record do sound like ego and *** waving.

"We can't have the president say something then back down."
"Think about what the world will say if we don't attack."
"What if Assad is emboldened by our lack of action."
"Russia will gain a symbolic victory over us if we don't show them who's boss."
"Iran will think X,Y,Z if we don't show Assad we mean business."

Classic ego defense. America needing to feel like it's *** is larger than anyone elses. You know... as if we don't have the largest military ever amassed.

Which links were to conspiracy websites? News outlets not owned by the liberal media or the conservative media? Anything not told to me by MSNBC or fox is now a conspiracy. Interesting thought process, for a sheep.

20-1 odds you are a government employee of some sort.
"I deserve at least 50k a year pension for the rest of my life off your children's backs! Oh, I collected garbage? Who cares! I am entitled to it! Why would I save for my own retirement, I got a cozy government job so my neighbors can pay for my retirement. Umad? Winning!"

All your sources link to the USA regime censored sites and cannot be substantiated.

Crazy circle we can go in, or we can look at claims that have evidence to back them up. :)

Lol. Always a way to justify hypocrisy in the mind of a liberal. You can be in control of your body when it comes to abortion, but you can't be in control when it comes to food. trollolol.

You can read Mitt Romney's mind through his past and what he said before, but I can't read the POTUS because of some magical democratic forcefield? LOL.
You are one of the wingers who will blame the other side no matter the evidence presented just to cheer for 'your team', it's too bad so many Americans think that way. One of the people who still bring up Bush as if he is relevant.

Guess what? Obama voted for Bushes war. Guess what else? Obama bombed Libya already, and they didn't even use WMD's, but because of some magical reason 1+1 doesn't make 2 in your liberal world.

Guess what, Kerry stuck his foot in his mouth, Russia took the bluff, and now they look like bullies even more to the world. Such great leadership! But keep watching that tv6 news that has nonstop been talking about how evil Assad is and how he needs to be removed by our police skills. If you can't see the war propaganda for what it is I pity you.

Seen that irrefutable evidence your holy one has spoke about yet? Seen any evidence? Didn't think so.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me.

-Martin Niemöller

Change the words for today, Conservatives, Independents, and Democrats. If you don't see the onslaught vs conservatism you are naive. Over half of my college textbooks have had a liberal slant. Gee, I wonder why so many college kids lean left? derp. Another case where 1 +1 doesn't equal 2 if you ask a liberal.

who are you even rambling to? Nobody cares.

"Leaning left" as in... supporting gay rights, choice, racial equality, maybe aware of evolution and climate change? I've done a fair amount of research on the subject (demographics) and I see no credible evidence that younger people "lean left", they are generally more progressive, but you're confusing partisan politics with living in reality. Even the most basic level of your statement is "educated people are more liberal".

Your whole post sounds like the ramblings of Glen Beck and you're killing your cause.

My field ecology book voted straight-ticket Democrat last election.

Ok I have figured it out, we are just supposed to leave this thread and come back a week later when BakingJones is allowed internet access again. Ok guys?

Excuse me? Human rights issues are only for liberals?

Sorry to break it down for you, but I support all human rights issues.
They shouldn't even be issues. ;)

My idea of a liberal, short version.
-Business restrictions. Taxes r good, employment is bad.
-Rights being stomped on. NSA is good, privacy is bad. Guns kill people!
-Government is good corporations are bad. How many private employees does it take to pay for 1 government employee?
-The successful should pay even more than they already do! They already carry most of the tax burden. Provide a source to dismiss this. We punish innovation today in America.
-Unions, where the lazy/under-performer can keep their job because he is part of the union.
-Living in debt is OK! - See nat. debt.
Amnesty for illegals. - Obvious is obvious.
Telling other people how to live while being hypocritical.

Now I am not saying conservatives don't share some of these issues, but conservatives aren't in this thread denying what is factual.

I did not say educated people are more liberal. That's a joke and like always, change words for your own interpretation. I said college kids, before they get real world experience. When their minds are susceptible to outside information and opinions.

There is a difference between putting the facts forward and putting your slant on the facts. Like most USA media/literature does.

http://www.ropercenter.uconn.edu/elections/how_groups_voted/voted_12.html

AGE
18-29
60% Obama
37% Romney
That is not most to you? What are your math qualifications?

Lol Vic. Sorry you guys can't have a discussion without me to refute your fantasies. I have more to do than try to enlighten some die hard left fans who see no fault in anything this administration does, yet persecuted dubya for the same things.

Any party that can't agree on bills to pass when they have a super majority is obviously deceitful. Tell me, If liberals are only for human rights why did it take so long to force through healthcare, by buying off votes, without reading it?

Yikes! Too much. I'm out.

So the fact that in an election between a cardboard cutout and a charismatic minority, most of the young people chose the charismatic guy... that means young people lean left... no, it means that they believed Obama would make a better president than a guy who denies evolution and talks out his neck.

Lol. Check out that data a little further. You will see a majority in that age group going left 4 out of the last 5 elections. (thats 20 years) 1 election out of 5. Yea, it isn't a majority, my mistake. /rolls eyes.

Again, voting for a politician based on social issues has nothing to do with party lines. The neocons have just scooped up all the crazy to appeal to the windowlickers who cling to their guns and think gays are responsible for the holocaust.