Alternator

so like 1.3k+ attack after level correction (current testing indicates that there is positive level correction up to +5, but I haven't properly quantified it yet)

If you are only hitting for slightly less against the level 82 Colibris, this would indicate it's from pDIF. That's a fairly large difference (2%), so I'd expect that you would see more than just those two values though. There might be something else going on, too.

The ranged damage upper limit only reaches 3 when ranged cRatio reaches 3, at which point the max and the min have converged. It should not be possible to get capped-damage sometimes and uncapped-damage others.

1106 = 885 damage without the Colibri's Piercing+25% = Base damage of 295

If you think you are fSTR capped, why not go shoot a L0 rabbit with Alternator on and make sure?



Also, you can just /check monsters with Battlemod on and see their levels, so it shouldn't be hard to control for the level of the monster you are fighting.

Keep in mind that NPC vs NPC requires x4 to cap, not x3. Autos count as NPCs

Mushroom is very clearly not capped on the Wivres nearby who stop checking low defense between 445 and 453 attack (so they have at least 356 defense I guess)

Unless there is some testing out there that I do not know about, there is nothing on monster ranged pdif, which has always been less similar to their melee pdif than our ranged pdif.

It's my own testing. I've been doing a lot of work with monster pDIF lately. Fun fact: all monsters have at least an A in their main skill, with colibris having an A+ in beak-to-beak combat

In addition to 1082 on Greaters I also saw 1098

tldr Automatons don't use ranged pdif!

My understanding with ranged pdif was that you could not hit the maximum value without being capped - but Mushroom hits Greaters and Bumblebees for the same amount!

I swear SE just messes with Automaton base damage whenever they get bored. Check out this post from 3 months ago:
http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/114636-Monster-Avatar-Pet-damage?p=5613135&viewfull=1#post5613135

That post was itself different from testing I had done about a year before, where we confirmed it was comparing STR and VIT (even for Wild Rabbits) using Choke. Now it looks like base damage may have changed again? Could you shoot a rabbit with a normal animator? I'd like to see if the base damage equations are at least the same, because 92+13 probably caps your fSTR term against Wild Rabbits for STR (262 base) but the 30% DEX should only get you another 20 base damage (282 base) even though Alternator apparently pushes you up to 295 base damage.


Re: Sylow. I only see capped damage in your screenshots. Did you shoot for less than capped damage against L0 mobs at some point? It could be that SE just botched the whole "we removed distance correction from Automatons" thing.

I'll port to sandy in a sec but here's Animator stuff on Saruta mobs



Removing AF3+2 hands from Auto (STR-13 DEX-13)

I so far have not hit for uncapped damage except for 937s which correspond to the Automaton using a Ranged Attack while I was using a Maneuver

You were wearing AF3+2 hands, so your puppet's stats were 105 STR and 109 DEX? That used to be 268 base damage with 417 skill, but one more fSTR would fix that.

105 and 109 should be correct - I'll verify in a moment when I get to Ronfaure!

Edit - Yes!

Still lots of testing to be done on the Eva/DEF side which I am doing bit by bit (on a business trip in Tokyo this week), but I was getting the same results as Sylow on Ronfaure mobs, which is making me wonder if all these insane, consistent damage WSs (down to the very last digit) I am seeing in Delve could mean that it could be capped.

I only have 3 merits in Optimization however, not 5. Good work on all the testing, guys! Great read.

Top is 417 skill
Bottom is 427 skill
(Animator)

For reference 885 and 894 vs Wild Rabbits with 417 and 427 skill respectively with Alternator

801 = 267, which is 1 less than I got in exactly the same situation. Looks like they might have changed the base damage calculations again.

Going back to overload for a moment, I was spamming Fire Maneuvers with "bad burden":

Very approximately, about a 1% chance of overload for each degree over the cap

I also get that the degrees from Activate is 5?:

53:23 - Sjugy Activates
53:35 - Fire Maneuver 1
53:47 - Fire Maneuver 2 (Overload)
54:24 - Overload wears off

37 second Overload + 8 ticks decay (24 seconds/3) = 45 without decay
45 - 40 from maneuvers where the Puppet has more STR than me = 5 unaccounted for.

I've confirmed that having much more of a stat than your target certainly does decrease degrees/maneuver to 15. It looks like you don't need to go that far, though. I started trying to systematically figure it out by controlling my DEX and it looks like as long as dSTAT=0, you're fine.

9 Maneuver overload with dSTAT=0, 73 seconds cooldown
(73 seconds overload) + (30 threshold) + (96 seconds*1 degree/3 seconds) = 135 degrees
135 degrees/9 maneuvers = 15 degrees per maneuver

4 maneuver overload with dSTAT=-5 or dSTAT=-1, 38 second cooldown
(38 second overload) + (30 threshold) + (36 seconds*1 degree/three seconds) = 80 degrees
80 degrees/4 maneuvers = 20 degrees per maneuver

1) The case where Automaton range pdif caps at 4 is really unlikely
The expected change from af3+e gloves is multiplied by 3 exactly so it's alu it's probably also the case that theykre not receiving positive level correction

2) So Automatons may function as players as far as pdif is concerned

3) This leaves around 70 ranged attack uaccounted for on Alternator

It would honestly not surprise me if Alternator had +70 acc/attack/evasion on it

Anecdotal but the WoE 13 harpeia had extreme trouble hitting the Auto with their AoE regular attacks even though thbe same attacks were hitting a PUP and MNK just fine

Also I had uncapped range skill for the longest time because Mushroom had floored RACC on everything I wanted to skill on.

I skilled to ~100 in Attohwa Chasm and then decided to try Abyssea Latheine worms but acc was floored.

After getting Alternator I took Mushroom to Uleguerand with the same skill and fought Ectozoons and his racc was fine even with Drum Magazinand as awkward as it sounds, with the increased evasion from alternator it's much easier for me to do Salvage 2 while the RNG puppet tanks because it just doesn't get hit. It just seems unlikely that +35 evasion from AGI could make such a stark difference.

I have to concur the alternator really does effect eva watched rng barely take any dmg from a frenzied mantis that would have kicked my *** is kind of fun. Testing using a wind wind light and the sucker just comes out of fights super clean optic fiber + repair 2 is sick.

I did Salv 2 Cerb with the PLD auto, had a similar experience. That is the one aspect of it I see being nerfed. It makes it very trivial to solo a lot of content.

Most of the stuff I have done with it now has been done purely with either Auto-repair Kits or the occasional repair.

Are you saying you solo the cerberus boss ? doubt it...

Only the NQ, wasn't expecting to do it, so I didn't spawn the NQ on the floor below.

Didn 't finish it, but got it to about 10% before timing out, and was using Cannibal instead of Shredder a lot. Had low hp because I changed some attachments around and got smacked on.

Almost debating trying with the Rng frame. Might be a bit more difficult due to the hp and lower PDT on the rng frame, but would put out more dmg.

During NQ SSR Salvage with Sharpshot and a THF friend who got charmed, could barely land any hits on the Automaton and his parry rate was through the roof. THF was incredibly well geared, using the Delve dagger. I wonder if this super evasion is linked purely to Sharpshot or on all frames?

Oh, this was also while tanking the Chariot (I know, lol75content), but still.

What attachments did you use? It would be interesting setting as much mdb and defense but still getting the rng firepower. Did you use oil +3 Auto-repair 2 with at least 1 light on be interesting.

I been playing with rng frame with valor head and using the volt gun and galvanizer for counter. Little sucker is a beast wind light thunder or wind light wind keeps him pretty much full hp while doing revives and delve crap...

It was just normal stuff, I was really unprepared for trying. I mistook Cannibal blade for a magic ws, and that was how I was planning on countering the PDT it gets. It's slashing.

Armor Plates, Steam Jacket and Analyzer (Not sure if this had an impact, was using for Gates of Hades, but that only did 200. Auto Repair Kit and +3 Oil.

I didn't have Eraser on, which cost me a lot of time. Equip Eraser to remove Paralyze, put on Volt Gun to try and negate the PDT it gains and don't spam Cannibal Blade.

The Eva is not just RNG frame, I've been able to hold gears with the whm frame because of the insane evasion it gets, and doing SCNM nms (Nimues tights) I saw a similarly high eva on the pld and mage frame.

Interesting! The sheer damage from Sharpshot might be worth trying over Valoredge if evasion is the primary mode of tanking. A "kill before you're killed" tactic, aha.