IiPunch - Monk Guide

Retaliation is what always gets me when its only drawback is -mov speed, probably one of the more nothing tier debuff wise

How can counter be broken when you can pop retal and cap your pdt and arguably gain more dps while taking less dmg with the only drawback being you walk slow

Like i said, its not a good reason, but it is the reason. Also, auto attacks from moves can be quite deadly. Usually takes a second for the whm to swap off tank to you, or get to you if youre not high prio and healer is handling multiple parties/dealing with important debuffs. A few autos followed by a TP move that would have just hurt you can put you on the floor. Counter does give the whm some breathing room.

Even Run will die in a few auto rounds or so if they dont parry. (But thats because run is a squishy tank by design)

Ultimately i do agree you should get tp on counter, but as a currently forced whm main, to say that counterring autos isnt a major help is just false.

Also, mnk really needs massive HP boosts again. Monk is supposed to have the highest base HP and have it mean something. Now they just have sub tank HP, since tanks will stack some form of +hp.

Monk should really have 4k base HP.

Ok thanks for proving you were trolling this entire time so I can stop entertaining your comments.

That could be a fix to counterstance too. Just have 4k hp+. Tp moves wouldnt one shot you, but you would need whm or dnc healer. Sounds good.

Its not trolling if its true. Run has high mdef/meva/mdt etc, but the same phys defense as a mage/light DD. Dont engage a mob on RUN and see how long you last without cures. Most of runs physical staying power comes from parry/hp restored on parry. DT can only do so much, even a war will take physical hits better disregarding parry.

That statement is correct if we are assuming non-Epeo RUN in a super tank scenario or a Hundred-Fists like situation. RUN really relies on those parries. Fortunately Battuta is a thing.

It's not true at all, lol. Good RUN in the right build takes single-double damage attacks from melee hits. You've never seen a good rune fencer before is the reason.

That's almost as stupid as saying "Paladin will die if it doesn't engage and turns around if there isn't a whm to keep it alive"

Even without epeo just an aettir with a pdt/phalanx kit can take more than "a few" auto rounds

How does a MNK counter with a shield, or even parry, with only H2H anyway?

I mean, I thought this was a fisting thread, not a thread about how PLD>RUN or RUN>PLD.

I feel like WAR, DRG, SAM get as much, if not more HP than MNK.

:/ Feels so wrong

I mean, these certainly don't help Monk in any way. Strange THF, BRD and DNC is on there though...

Not sure if responding to me or if you just ignored the entire premise of my statement.

Taking higher end double digit damage when supertanking or against a mob with a high attack and hundred fists can definitely be lethal if the RUN doesn't parry. There is a reason that Battuta is saved for hundred fists scenarios.

My statement listing out specific times means that I disagree with the generalized premise but in the situations I listed, a RUN that gets no parries may certainly be in some form of trouble.

But yea, remain ignorant and aggressive. Turn towards insults first rather than actually reading.


Yeah I definitely disagree with their original statement. There are situations a RUN will be in trouble but those are few and far between.

Even with, run is a glorified mage in DT gear. Youre still gunna be hurting. And no, the run in my group is virtually bis. You get a good chunk of no parries, and youre going to be yellow-red.

The entire point is that damage negation abilities are good. Run is a tank based entirely around counter. Nin is a dd made into a tank based entirely around shadows. Counters mitigation is still powerful and noticable when it procs.

Remove parry from run, and youll end up with the whm spending all their time cure bombing the squishy tank.

Not aggressive or ignorant, just the entire context of your scenario is stupid to begin with.

When would a RUN supertank and NOT parry? When would a RUN supertank, not parry, and NOT have a healer? Again, that's as silly as asking how long can a PLD survive normal hits if he doesn't block or have a healer to help him out. It completely removes the primary damage negation tool the job showcases and points at it's inability to stay alive when you rely solely on Defense. It's a dumb scenario all around.

RUN can take plenty of damage EVEN IF it doesn't parry, I have seen it personally: RUNs taking single digit damage from several charmed players (not parrys, single digit damage lol) and didn't skip a beat. But again, its a dumb analogy to begin with.

The topic has derailed beyond the original counter discussion, so i'll take some responsibility for that (I wasn't about to let that dumb RUN comment slide).

Going back to the this original comment


Literally nobody said this. And like I said, nobody dies from simple melee attacks. Countering an attack and avoiding only physical damage isn't quite the advantage some of you are pretending it is, especially when you have to use (gulp) Counterstance to reach a reasonable counter rate.

Yeah minimum 55 pdt with round 35~40 phalanx at the low end, is glorified mage in dt.

Runs squishy when it pops last resort or hops into pure dd gear, if your runs are dropping like flies cause no parry, idk what to tell ya other than you got bad runs.

But did all this to some extent in the update thread already.

No one dies from autos because whms heal you. Autos still force whms to heal you instead of erasing/-naing debuffs and doing other vital roles. And autos CAN kill you if the whm is doing something else (arise, erase) and you take an auto round or two and get TPd on.

The idea that mob autos arent dangerous is just wrong. The only job that can disregard them is pld.

Or I have BiS RUNs who rely on their main physical defensive cooldown, Battuta, to survive said situations. But yea remove Inquartata, Turms gloves and Battuta and RUNs would still be able to survive any situation with just a good DT set and Phalanx set :^).

Buuki makes a good point though. There are few situations where a RUN tanks unengaged and even in that situation you have a healer cure bombing them (Erinys) if you don't tank it with a PLD.

Edit: I also love the implication of "If you don't agree with me you just play with bad people". Because there isn't a world where you are wrong, people just exist in wrong worlds.

55 DT in light armor is basically just a whm. Run is literally just a whm/mnk/thf etc. Being autod.

EXACTLY. It's the TP move that is the biggest threat to a Monk. Thanks for agreeing with my original point:

Yeah this conversation is a bit of trap because each party is talking at two different extremes and will never see Eye to Eye. Probably best to go back to talking about how counter should return TP at least during counterstance or something.

Except, again, the autos put you into kill threshold. Which is the entire damn point.

If you have 2.5k hp, and a TP move does 1.8k, and you die, guess why? Because he smacked you a few times first.

There's so much derailed garbage in these posts it's not even worth debunking anymore.

"Derailed garbage" except my point has always been counter, parry, guard etc allows your whm to do literally everything else they need to do safer with more time than simply eating free autos to the face, forcing the whm to spam cures instead of casting their important spells to keep status ailments handled on everyone, or even arise the dead.

Wait what? Take parry from RUN and it will die? What?

Explain to me what I see on this video then XD

I didn't wanna go there Simon, it was too ridiculous of a claim to debunk i stopped. Once claims of having WHM-like mage defense, i rested my case (BTW that's the "RUN" i mentioned that took single damage from multiple charmed players for a long time). The only people who believed RUN defense was weak are people who've never seen a really good one. (mind yo u half of that video is in Epeo, the other half is in Aettir...)

Epeo is a beautiful weapon

Half of the video is using Aettir... it's not the weapon, RUN IS just that strong defensively.

It's no secret that phalanx is strong. There's a gigantic difference between someone that has all DM/skirmish augs for phalanx and someone that casts it with +5~

Average and even above average runs will and do get wrecked.

Monk thread.