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For the Shinies! A Guide for Thief
By lhova 2015-01-01 17:35:43
Quetzalcoatl.Valli said: »Rudra cant do light. Only ws to do light with dagger is mandalic stab. Not sure it'd be worth it now unless you didn't have Man Stab and NEEDED a ligh SC for some reason
Stab is kinda just as broken as Rudra, but skillchain damage is straight up absurd. Check these out, highest t2 skillchains I've ever seen @_@ If you can close a skillchain, close it, it doesn't matter what it makes.
I was never comparing THF to any other jobs as a DD...well except for SAM
A statement like "Rudra is OP because of X" is a direct comparison to all DD's, really. It can't be OP in and of itself. It can only be OP relative to other DD's. Not entirely true, it's broken compared to what it used to be, without comparing it to anything else, it's OP. No doubt.
Like 95% of my huge rudras are with zero buffs. No other (non dagger)job can even pretend to do 20k 30k 40k ws's without any buffs at all. (SA/TA aren't buffs, they're extra ws modifiers~).
Thief certainly isn't a th *** anymore lol.
By Pantafernando 2015-01-01 17:57:48
FFXI is a game that changes bandwagon from time to time. Since NIN/BST in abyssea, WAR/DRK in NNI and early delve, MNK till the advent of ark angels, SAM and now THF/DNC we just can enjoy the few month till next flavor of the month arrives.
Bets who will be the next cool kid?
 Quetzalcoatl.Valli
サーバ: Quetzalcoatl
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1420
By Quetzalcoatl.Valli 2015-01-01 18:06:38
It's time for PUP. If pet jobs EVER get all buffs transferred to pets, it's on. The sheer amount of revived BST and renewed PUP enthusiasts will be staggering. The amount of bandwagoned BST will be the biggest bandwagon ever seen.
Fenrir.Magi
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 203
By Fenrir.Magi 2015-01-01 18:39:18
I haven't seen a bigger bandwagon than Ragnarok tbh... pre resolution it was probably the least made relic(apart from ***like staff because BLM isn't a melee DD). Okay, maybe the RNG bandwagon during sky era back in 2003-2004. Still waiting on Return of the DRK, volume 2. I only wish they didn't *** up Rune Fencer because I was looking forward to a GSD using job :/.
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3213
By Asura.Failaras 2015-01-01 18:47:04
I haven't seen a bigger bandwagon than Ragnarok tbh... pre resolution it was probably the least made relic(apart from ***like staff because BLM isn't a melee DD). Okay, maybe the RNG bandwagon during sky era back in 2003-2004. Still waiting on Return of the DRK, volume 2. I only wish they didn't *** up Rune Fencer because I was looking forward to a GSD using job :/. It was the least made for a reason, it was absolute ***before Resolution. It makes sense that when an item goes from worthless to top tier people make it.
By NeboJones 2015-01-01 20:38:58
Quetzalcoatl.Valli said: »
Stab is kinda just as broken as Rudra, but skillchain damage is straight up absurd.
Yeah I've been using man stab to close light recently even without Vajra. That particular reference about probably not being worth it was talking about closing light with shark bite (Although I don't have much experience with it post update.)
Quetzalcoatl.Valli said: »Not entirely true, it's broken compared to what it used to be, without comparing it to anything else, it's OP. No doubt.
Like 95% of my huge rudras are with zero buffs. No other (non dagger)job can even pretend to do 20k 30k 40k ws's without any buffs at all. (SA/TA aren't buffs, they're extra ws modifiers~).
I agree that it's much more powerful than it was, but not that it's Over Powered. I think there are SC aspects that need adjustment system wide but as far as WS damage, it's really not like THF can just crap those out non stop. The best they can hope for under ideal circumstances, assuming 100% succes rate with position (not very realistic) is once every ~30 seconds or so. That's a lot of (less than stellar) WS time and holding TP in between JA's where other DD's can spam at 1000 without concern for position.
By Twyl 2015-01-02 01:44:09
FFXI is a game that changes bandwagon from time to time. Since NIN/BST in abyssea, WAR/DRK in NNI and early delve, MNK till the advent of ark angels, SAM and now THF/DNC we just can enjoy the few month till next flavor of the month arrives.
Bets who will be the next cool kid?
I've never understood the gripe with "bandwagon."
Effective is effective.
Quetzalcoatl.Valli
サーバ: Quetzalcoatl
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1420
By Quetzalcoatl.Valli 2015-01-02 02:10:21
FFXI is a game that changes bandwagon from time to time. Since NIN/BST in abyssea, WAR/DRK in NNI and early delve, MNK till the advent of ark angels, SAM and now THF/DNC we just can enjoy the few month till next flavor of the month arrives.
Bets who will be the next cool kid?
I've never understood the gripe with "bandwagon."
Effective is effective.
Cause it's *** lame. How exciting all the sheep are on the same job, joy. Winning something 15 seconds faster doesn't equate to jack ***. People just can't think for themselves. It's embarrassing.
Leviathan.Kaparu
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 949
By Leviathan.Kaparu 2015-01-02 02:12:45
Because people who enjoy the role more than the job are awful, awful people.
You must enjoy what I enjoy the way I enjoy it- understood?
[+]
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2623
By Sylph.Jeanpaul 2015-01-03 02:59:58
It really only affects pick-up groups, and people who are insecure about their performance in a video game.
[+]
 Ragnarok.Luloo
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 121
By Ragnarok.Luloo 2015-01-03 07:31:55
Question, on SA/TA rudra a Canny cape with crit hit dmg+3 and dex+4 would beat kayapa? or the dDex of 4 is superior?
Thanks!
 Cerberus.Tidis
サーバ: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3927
By Cerberus.Tidis 2015-01-03 08:23:58
Question, on SA/TA rudra a Canny cape with crit hit dmg+3 and dex+4 would beat kayapa? or the dDex of 4 is superior?
Thanks! Canny would win for both SA and TA.
 Lakshmi.Amymy
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 881
By Lakshmi.Amymy 2015-01-03 09:27:39
Quetzalcoatl.Valli said: »Rudra cant do light. Only ws to do light with dagger is mandalic stab. Not sure it'd be worth it now unless you didn't have Man Stab and NEEDED a ligh SC for some reason
Stab is kinda just as broken as Rudra, but skillchain damage is straight up absurd. Check these out, highest t2 skillchains I've ever seen @_@ If you can close a skillchain, close it, it doesn't matter what it makes.
I was never comparing THF to any other jobs as a DD...well except for SAM
A statement like "Rudra is OP because of X" is a direct comparison to all DD's, really. It can't be OP in and of itself. It can only be OP relative to other DD's. Not entirely true, it's broken compared to what it used to be, without comparing it to anything else, it's OP. No doubt.
Like 95% of my huge rudras are with zero buffs. No other (non dagger)job can even pretend to do 20k 30k 40k ws's without any buffs at all. (SA/TA aren't buffs, they're extra ws modifiers~).
Thief certainly isn't a th *** anymore lol.
I did a 88k skillchain on dancer on largantua. Climatic flourish rudra at 1750 tp.
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 224
By Asura.Celoria 2015-01-03 15:55:39
largantua takes extra sc dmg if dark based. i hit the 99999 dmg cap on sc the other day.
Edit: I think the sc dmg bonus is based off the sc type and the day, I just hit a 50k distortion on lightsday but only a 658 darkness sc on lightsday
Lakshmi.Eyrhika
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 764
By Lakshmi.Eyrhika 2015-01-04 14:10:52
I always thought it might have something to do with the element used when he does crystal rain
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2623
By Sylph.Jeanpaul 2015-01-04 15:02:26
For Largantua, it's actually just a straight-up double damage bonus during his weaponskills, from any damage type. All skillchains will do exceptionally well because they are calculated by what is already a doubly strong weaponskill, and then the skillchain damage itself is doubled. The same thing happens with Qutrubs, which is why they too get absolutely ruined by skillchains. Largantua tends to weaponskill multiple times in a row (more so as he's losing more health), so the trick is to have whoever may be starting a skillchain go as soon as they see him ready a move.
Quetzalcoatl.Wakmidget
サーバ: Quetzalcoatl
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1388
By Quetzalcoatl.Wakmidget 2015-01-04 15:07:09
I heard an LS member say there is a rumor he just takes extra damage if executed during a TP move.
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Game: FFXI
Posts: 224
By Asura.Celoria 2015-01-04 15:34:26
That may be right i wasn't paying attention i will try again later today.
By NeboJones 2015-01-04 16:49:24
For Largantua, it's actually just a straight-up double damage bonus during his weaponskills, from any damage type. All skillchains will do exceptionally well because they are calculated by what is already a doubly strong weaponskill, and then the skillchain damage itself is doubled. The same thing happens with Qutrubs, which is why they too get absolutely ruined by skillchains. Largantua tends to weaponskill multiple times in a row (more so as he's losing more health), so the trick is to have whoever may be starting a skillchain go as soon as they see him ready a move.
^
Lakshmi.Eyrhika
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 764
By Lakshmi.Eyrhika 2015-01-04 16:59:18
That doesn't explain the low skillchain damage though. I have seen the sc resisted heavily as well so there is something more than more damage during tp
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 224
By Asura.Celoria 2015-01-04 17:47:29
and double dmg is incorrect. unless i am mistaken on new math of darkness ws lately. but when i hit 99999 cap the closing ws was only about 30k that is more than triple dmg for a dark sc to close
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2623
By Sylph.Jeanpaul 2015-01-05 02:03:41
Low skillchain damage was more than likely executed when he wasn't in the middle of a weaponskill, though I wouldn't be surprised if he alters his elemental resistances throughout the fight or something, as many of these NMs share similar qualities as the gear they drop (in this case, his elemental resistance neckpiece).
I've personally made a 30k Light from an 8k Savage Blade once on him, so there very well may be more to it. More often than not, you'll probably just notice a simple doubling of everything you dish out on him.
By NeboJones 2015-01-05 10:44:35
It seems likely that there is an elemental or SC damage taken modifier that changes throughout the fight (possibly based on Crystal Rain Element) in addition to the damage taken increase while performing TP moves.
All this is just to say though, that using screen shots from Largantua as an example of Rudra's "OP-ness", is ever so slightly disingenuous.
By Heimdel 2015-01-05 21:17:32
So what exactly is considered the best build for shark dagger rudra?
Quetzalcoatl.Valli
サーバ: Quetzalcoatl
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1420
By Quetzalcoatl.Valli 2015-01-05 21:27:48
LOL mug killshot~
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3213
By Asura.Failaras 2015-01-05 23:45:56
So what exactly is considered the best build for shark dagger rudra? I'm not 100% on these sets but these are what I aimed for using spreadsheets that I updated the fTP of Rudras.
Stacked
ItemSet 331732
Unstacked
ItemSet 331731
Using targets where I'm attack capped or close.
Quetzalcoatl.Wakmidget
サーバ: Quetzalcoatl
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1388
By Quetzalcoatl.Wakmidget 2015-01-05 23:59:31
So what exactly is considered the best build for shark dagger rudra?
Here is what I currently use, works well for me, head/hands are both DEX augmented. Legs have the Attack/Accuracy path.
Unstacked:
ItemSet 331466
Stacked:
ItemSet 327498
Doesn't matter what dagger you use, for the most part, the sets will generally be the same.
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Game: FFXI
Posts: 224
By Asura.Celoria 2015-01-06 00:57:28
Last I heard was shifting neck +1 beats gorget
Siren.Kyte
サーバ: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3332
By Siren.Kyte 2015-01-06 01:08:00
It does, and Wanion does win unstacked.
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3213
By Asura.Failaras 2015-01-06 01:15:24
If you can't get a Shifting+1 (They don't exist on my server) you can also get a Moepapa Medal, very cheap and better than gorget. Using auged Buremte for Rudras unstacked is cool, I never thought of it, sadly my augs on that are tied up for now.
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