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For the Shinies! A Guide for Thief
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 169
By Sylph.Malizia 2013-07-12 15:14:45
Is it worth using the thfs new cape to replace the atheling mantle, in tp or exenterator set?
If you're accuracy capped and not attack capped, I really don't expect canny cape to stand a chance against atheling mantle. The 2% TA vs. 3% DA is minimal, but 20 attack is way better than 6 AGI, 10 acc, and 15 evasion (which all means nothing for DPS). That's true for both TP and Exenterator. Sure, Exenterator can benefit from the 6 AGI, but Aife's mantle never beat out Atheling, so Canny Cape won't either.
So what about situations where we're not acc capped, when we would normally use the letalis mantle? Letalis has more accuracy and more attack, so it's the better DD mantle. No luck there, then.
Really, like Karbuncle said in his comment on the canny cape page, it's a hybrid DD/Eva back. It's actually quite a nice upgrade over boxer's mantle on both the DPS and Evasion sides. It'll be a nice piece for SoA soloing at the very least.
By Pantafernando 2013-07-12 15:31:31
So in the end, SE dont know what to do with thfs...
No changes in treasure hunter so our relevance remain the same as in abyssea.
No changes in our dd stats so we are even more weaker than heavys dds so more reason for then to reject us even more in end game events.
Improvement in eva as if in reive or delve thfs were suppose to tank those mobs.
Seems like the same team that take care of rdm upgrades also check thfs upgrade...
They could at least lock 100% drops from nms. If every mob in the new expansion have 100% drops, better thfs pack their luggage and go play other stuff...
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 169
By Sylph.Malizia 2013-07-12 15:42:52
I stumbled across a guide on BG that I think explains it rather well:
Quote: The opening of the Forums has led to more direct conversation between the players and the Developers... [it's] been useful in understanding what the Developer's ideas for different jobs are. Their goal is not to balance the damage these jobs do, it is to balance their utility.
For instance, the Devs seem content to give Thief relatively little utility besides Treasure Hunter. This appears to be entirely intentional because they feel TH is so useful. Sorry, Thieves. They seem to generally aim to make 2H DDs have relatively weak passive defenses (like Evasion) with high damage potential while 1H DDs have high passive defenses but lower damage potential. They are not aiming to make it so everyone does the same damage in all situations. They are aiming to make it so certain jobs will be preferred in some events (like heavy DDs in Voidwatch) and some in others (like light DDs in Dynamis).
I'm pretty sure SE knows what they want with THF, and it's not to make it a primary DD. This guide (and hopefully this thread) isn't about discussing what THF could be if SE matched your own personal ideal, but making the best out of what we have. And in this case, canny cape is a best-in-slot evasion piece with some DD utility.
サーバ: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 5
By Shiva.Zileonti 2013-07-12 15:49:28
Okay, what about a 31THF/15WAR that can only take on beasts that are Easy?
 Ramuh.Austar
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10481
By Ramuh.Austar 2013-07-12 15:49:57
Okay, what about a 31THF/15WAR that can only take on beasts that are Easy? get bloody bolts
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 169
By Sylph.Malizia 2013-07-12 15:54:01
Okay, what about a 31THF/15WAR that can only take on beasts that are Easy? get bloody bolts Hmm, would /dnc work? You get Curing Waltz, which might be good for 60 HP, and Drain Samba. Or maybe /nin for Dual Wield and Utsusemi?
Edit: I'm pretty sure /war isn't going to give you better DPS until at least ~60 or so when you have both Double Attack and the Attack Bonus job traits. /nin should give you better survivability AND dps over /war.
Ramuh.Austar
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10481
By Ramuh.Austar 2013-07-12 15:55:26
still should use marksmanship for blinds and defense down. and sleep > SA WS
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 169
By Sylph.Malizia 2013-07-12 15:58:41
Oh, yeah, that's true. You can do both! Status bolts AND a better subjob.
... I haven't done Sleep Bolt > SA WS in forever. Good times :)
Ramuh.Austar
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10481
By Ramuh.Austar 2013-07-12 16:00:29
he likely doesn't have either of those subs.
By Pantafernando 2013-07-12 16:02:12
I agree with you when you say that thf cant do dmg, but my point is:
If dev team really believe th is so important as they think it is, why do fractures nms and mega bosses with 100% drop in their slots?
Why state clearly that thfs just cant do fractures (if a mega weapon drop depend on th, im pretty sure delve groups would start to take at least 1 thf as one weapon mean 200k plasm, so you could expect thfs to contribute maybe with 1m plasm just with th droping stuffs).
Sorry for disagreeing, but i dont believe se know what to do with thfs. Actually, i dont believe se know what to do with this game itself.
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2507
By Asura.Calatilla 2013-07-12 16:07:16
I stumbled across a guide on BG that I think explains it rather well:
Quote: The opening of the Forums has led to more direct conversation between the players and the Developers... [it's] been useful in understanding what the Developer's ideas for different jobs are. Their goal is not to balance the damage these jobs do, it is to balance their utility.
For instance, the Devs seem content to give Thief relatively little utility besides Treasure Hunter. This appears to be entirely intentional because they feel TH is so useful. Sorry, Thieves. They seem to generally aim to make 2H DDs have relatively weak passive defenses (like Evasion) with high damage potential while 1H DDs have high passive defenses but lower damage potential. They are not aiming to make it so everyone does the same damage in all situations. They are aiming to make it so certain jobs will be preferred in some events (like heavy DDs in Voidwatch) and some in others (like light DDs in Dynamis).
I'm pretty sure SE knows what they want with THF, and it's not to make it a primary DD. This guide (and hopefully this thread) isn't about discussing what THF could be if SE matched your own personal ideal, but making the best out of what we have. And in this case, canny cape is a best-in-slot evasion piece with some DD utility.
If the Devs really do only see THF as Treasure Hunter why did they give it away to other jobs? TH is our primary (and only, as some might state) function in any event. We should be the only job with it.
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サーバ: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 5
By Shiva.Zileonti 2013-07-12 16:11:09
I original was a Warrior starting out, and I planning on using Thief as my Sub-job once I got the ability. I wanted to keep both job levels up so when I did get the ability I would already have my sub-job at a decent level. But... Once I got my Warrior to lvl15 I switched to my Thief and well... kind of just stayed on that until now.
サーバ: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 5
By Shiva.Zileonti 2013-07-12 16:14:52
I orginally was going to use WAR as my main, and THF as my sub but... after playing with the THF as my main... I actually like it more as my main-job
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 169
By Sylph.Malizia 2013-07-12 16:16:27
Oh, Zil, if you haven't already I think we all agree you should pick up the DNC job. It's an incredible solo subjob. The quest isn't difficult at all, you just need sneak/invis and the WotG expansion.
サーバ: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 5
By Shiva.Zileonti 2013-07-12 16:19:44
Once I mke my way back to town, I'll check it out.
Actually... I think I might've just teleported back to San d'Oria.
Okay... I'll do it, lol. I just read the quest. Back to Jeuno I go, lol.
Ramuh.Austar
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10481
By Ramuh.Austar 2013-07-12 16:24:30
look into archer's knife and some of the noct gear, you can quest a +5 evasion hat and hands in windurst. having some evasion gear and landing your status bolts and bloody bolts will be a lot faster and safer. marksmanship will do more damage until you get a bit higher level
 Phoenix.Audacity
サーバ: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 59
By Phoenix.Audacity 2013-07-13 16:22:03
Are the delve dw earrings really better than Brutal + suppa? I thought sacrificing 2% dw for 5% DA is a better deal but I'm not the type to test and math things out ^^;
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 694
By Sylph.Decimus 2013-07-13 16:58:46
There are sets on the front page so you don't have to ask. It's the accuracy in most cases. ^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;^^;
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 Ragnarok.Flippant
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 660
By Ragnarok.Flippant 2013-07-13 17:28:04
Even if you don't need the attack and accuracy, they should be better unless you're delay capped (+13% DW in gear, Haste, and double 4+ March).
Phoenix.Audacity
サーバ: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 59
By Phoenix.Audacity 2013-07-13 19:00:24
I know there are sets on the front page, I was just looking for a explanation, Thanks :)
By Pantafernando 2013-07-14 10:58:53
Ive been trying to get the x's knife (got the other 2 weapons but no knife...), but just know i feel like asking, do you think that knife could be useful in abyssea?
I use twilight knife as offhand actually, but seeing how popular is kamome to nin, that made me search for the kamome dagger (oneiros knife seems a lot harder to get...), maybe the jump in evisceration could make up for the loss in dps.
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 169
By Sylph.Malizia 2013-07-14 23:47:20
do you think that X's knife could be useful in abyssea?
I use twilight knife as offhand actually... I don't think so, especially as a mainhand, because the base damage is just too low. There's two competing theories about the crit damage increase: one, that it increases PDIF by 0.3 for crits, and two that it increases critical hit damage by 10%. In Abyssea you'd be lucky to see more than a 10% damage increase; you can just get a dagger with higher base damage and see much better returns.
aluh jambiya has the crit damage bonus and isn't very expensive anymore. lux pugio also helps with crits and is not that rare of a drop. The Peacekeeper Coalition daggers coalition dirk and forefront dagger are also very obtainable choices, since they only require 20-30k bayld to purchase.
Valefor.Tiniky
サーバ: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 52
By Valefor.Tiniky 2013-07-19 11:10:38
Looks like armor / weapons are getting updated next patch. Pretty significant upgrades!
http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/112775-Dev-Tracker-Discussion/page300
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 26
By Odin.Rengeki 2013-07-25 17:50:41
What's the word on Buremte Gloves for the time being? ~40 accuracy on one piece and a significant dDex boost seems really hard to pass up, especially with those damn huge birds in Marjami being so evasive. I got mine fairly recently and since I don't have Mani feet or Skadi +1 gloves yet I haven't bothered to play with numbers. :\
Bismarck.Ihina
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3187
By Bismarck.Ihina 2013-07-25 18:05:19
Take a wild guess.
Just go ahead. See what you come up with.
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Lakshmi.Jofjax
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 25
By Lakshmi.Jofjax 2013-07-26 18:26:08
At the moment, the best TP set I could come up with until the next update looks something like this:
ItemSet 29531
You could probably sub out the neck for a crit+ piece. I personally don't like Rancor neck though. This set also assumes the legs and feet are fully upgraded STR path.
Shiva.Yetl
サーバ: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 7
By Shiva.Yetl 2013-07-26 19:16:09
At the moment, the best TP set I could come up with until the next update looks something like this:
ItemSet 29531
You could probably sub out the neck for a crit+ piece. I personally don't like Rancor neck though. This set also assumes the legs and feet are fully upgraded STR path.
Idk why you would drop out brutal and sup. for the dual wield combo. sure you pick up 8 acc/atk and 2% dual but is that worth losing 5% double atk?
Shiva.Yetl
サーバ: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 7
By Shiva.Yetl 2013-07-26 19:19:53
Additionally,
If you have Izhiikoh, I think it's finally time to part ways w/ the mandau. Your white dmg from apho. off hand is gonna beat out the spikes from Mercy Stroke.
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