PLD Vs NIN...Who Is The Best Tank?
PLD vs NIN...Who is the best tank?
After reading another forum, I realized alot of ppl was debating the big different between pld and nin for tank. So, I open this forum to get ppl opinion about who is the best tank for FFXI.
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PLD is the best tank, NIN is in need of a major overhaul.
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Tkai said:
After reading another forum, I realized alot of ppl was debating the big different between pld and nin for tank. So, I open this forum to get ppl opinion about who is the best tank for FFXI.
Define BEST tank! ^^;
I mean there is somethings that PLD cannot tank and Nin can.
I dont believe myself in there being an answer here as both are always going to be needed from here til the end of time. But stil paladin O.G!!! we haz shield!
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Pallys are great b/c i dont have to remind him/her to keep their f'n shadows up. ninja is fast, quick, but requires more mp from mages for cures, whatnot, whereas pld have their own pool, higher defense, and overall better damage. Less curing and bitching from me :)
PLD is the best "Standard PT Tank".
NIN is the best lowman NM tank.
But like everything, remember the 3 S's.. Situation situation situation!
NIN is the best lowman NM tank.
But like everything, remember the 3 S's.. Situation situation situation!
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Pld is much easier, so most people will pick that.
A Nin/Drk or Nin/Rdm or Rdm/Nin in the right hands with good support can be just as good though.
Pld obviously gets better tools to work with, CureIV, Sent, Shield Mastery, Auto-Refresh, so for the average player or LS its going to be the best option.
A Nin/Drk or Nin/Rdm or Rdm/Nin in the right hands with good support can be just as good though.
Pld obviously gets better tools to work with, CureIV, Sent, Shield Mastery, Auto-Refresh, so for the average player or LS its going to be the best option.
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If its a fight where you can lower the nin recast enough and make the mobs attack speed low enough that a nin can keep shadows up nin/drk wins hands down. plds main advantage is they can take melee hits if they have too can cure themselves when they do and can cast thru shield blocks sometimes. But nin much better at keeping shadows up and with /drk can take hate like nobodies bussiness... hell in a few situations blus make great tanks. They can certainly grab insane hate fast. Just try a a diffusion exuvation and see what happens lol. Not to mention really have def thanks to cocoon and flash/stunga!!! If only headbutt actually worked endgame...
As mentioned, its situational.
PLD has more hate holding tools, but NIN can avoid more damage.
I prefer to have PLD in exp party situations because the average PLD holds hate better than the average NIN. (Note that I said "average." I will admit there are exceptions.) However, fighting an NM that hits really hard would require a NIN because it won't get hit.
PLD has more hate holding tools, but NIN can avoid more damage.
I prefer to have PLD in exp party situations because the average PLD holds hate better than the average NIN. (Note that I said "average." I will admit there are exceptions.) However, fighting an NM that hits really hard would require a NIN because it won't get hit.
well if you ignore subjobs yeah pld holds hate much much better then nin... however for survivability and to minimize mob tp gain pld kinda needs to nin... while nin can sub anything... and given enough support /drk or /rdm hate tools are much much better then what a pld gets... and while /nin debuffs do get decent hate there casting is kinda bad for tanking and dont really compare to the real version of the debuffs... need to revamp the whole pdif chart so add large amounts def actually does something and rework the whole vit vs str equations so they do more at higher lvls instead of pretty much exactly the same amount of dmg reduction. Make blood tanking viable though not the preferred way of doing things
The best tank is PLD. As some ppl said already NIN is "situational", you pick a NIN in exp pts cause there was no PLD seeking or am I lying?, just an example.
Best PLD > Best NIN.
Best PLD > Best NIN.
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Actually, prob the very best tank in the game, with exceptional gear all around (like stain or a few others) Pld/Rdm is the boss tank.
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Depends on the lvl. Frankly I much prefer a nin with a thf like oldschool days. But tanking in merit burns is kinda lol with how fast melees burn mobs down. But outside of xp it completely depends on setup and what your fighting. For endgame events nin will generally beat the crap out of pld.
If you're talking end-game, they're both pretty situational. I'm gonna speak pretty generally here, but there are some NM's that you'd be stupid to try and tank on nin, and some that you'd be stupid to try and tank on pld. In general though I think pld works in a lot more situations than nin.
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Frobeus said:
Actually, prob the very best tank in the game, with exceptional gear all around (like stain or a few others) Pld/Rdm is the boss tank.
Pld/rdm is a great combo, but again, is situational (unless you're talking someone with something like shadow ring/mantle, defending ring, aegis and burtgang <_<).
Your average pld/rdm up agains JoL, absolutely, bring it on. Your average pld/rdm up against Byakko or Seiryu? Not so much...
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Haveing both lvl'd to 75
AGREE bigtime,
NIN WS's are week and 2 hour is worthless ( only one situation has nin 2 hour been worth anything and that was to keep animated dagger from warping )
Yup
Nybras said:
PLD is the best tank, NIN is in need of a major overhaul.
AGREE bigtime,
NIN WS's are week and 2 hour is worthless ( only one situation has nin 2 hour been worth anything and that was to keep animated dagger from warping )
Hitetsu said:
PLD is the best "Standard PT Tank".
NIN is the best lowman NM tank.
But like everything, remember the 3 S's.. Situation situation situation!
NIN is the best lowman NM tank.
But like everything, remember the 3 S's.. Situation situation situation!
Yup
This is something which should never be debated over, i love my paladin so much.
But this thread right here will go on for weeks due to the sheer vastness of the game.You cant argue which tank is better, because there is no better tank >.> Paladin CANT tank everything in the game regardless of subjob, nor can ninja. They're both needed so neither is superior, only depending on the situation yes, you will be able to argue that one is better than the other but as a whole.
No
But this thread right here will go on for weeks due to the sheer vastness of the game.You cant argue which tank is better, because there is no better tank >.> Paladin CANT tank everything in the game regardless of subjob, nor can ninja. They're both needed so neither is superior, only depending on the situation yes, you will be able to argue that one is better than the other but as a whole.
No
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Generally speaking it comes down to attack speed and frequency of shadow stripping AOEs. And nin that can't keep his shadows up and actually takes melee hits is completely fail as a tank. Otherwise it rocks... unfortunately yeah there are some quite a few fast attacking AOE spamming NMs out there some of which are pretty damn hard or impossible to slow down. And nin/drk or nin/rdm abosolutely needs refresh haste and either double march or ballad and march to really work effectively while pld can get by almost on its own at least for a time. And if you can actually afford to melee joytoy +atonement is sick since he tends to do same dmg no matter what your fighting... unless your fighting hydra type mobs then it fails hard.
So much love for pld tanks. Like someone said Nin was not design to be a main tank. Pld wins in having more def and being able to heal themselves (which in turn give them more hate control). However, when it comes to high lvl Nin with Eva Gear setup they are great again almost any NM. But in exp party unless you have a War/Nin to help you tank when shadows goes down then the whm or rdm will be dropping alot of mp.
Side Note: You know times are bad for finding a tank when a pt gets a DNC/WAR Tank. It was the first and hopefully the last time I saw something like that. Believe me I need exp but not that bad. I left the party after two long and crazy fights.
Side Note: You know times are bad for finding a tank when a pt gets a DNC/WAR Tank. It was the first and hopefully the last time I saw something like that. Believe me I need exp but not that bad. I left the party after two long and crazy fights.
Blazza said:
Frobeus said:
Actually, prob the very best tank in the game, with exceptional gear all around (like stain or a few others) Pld/Rdm is the boss tank.
Pld/rdm is a great combo, but again, is situational (unless you're talking someone with something like shadow ring/mantle, defending ring, aegis and burtgang <_<).
Your average pld/rdm up agains JoL, absolutely, bring it on. Your average pld/rdm up against Byakko or Seiryu? Not so much...
Yeah Blaz I was refering to aegis/burt/excal/Dring/shadowring etc pld. In that case Pld/Rdm with brains is by far the best.
Honorable mention to Apoc Drk also.
Tkai said:
So much love for pld tanks. Like someone said Nin was not design to be a main tank. Pld wins in having more def and being able to heal themselves (which in turn give them more hate control). However, when it comes to high lvl Nin with Eva Gear setup they are great again almost any NM. But in exp party unless you have a War/Nin to help you tank when shadows goes down then the whm or rdm will be dropping alot of mp.
Side Note: You know times are bad for finding a tank when a pt gets a DNC/WAR Tank. It was the first and hopefully the last time I saw something like that. Believe me I need exp but not that bad. I left the party after two long and crazy fights.
Side Note: You know times are bad for finding a tank when a pt gets a DNC/WAR Tank. It was the first and hopefully the last time I saw something like that. Believe me I need exp but not that bad. I left the party after two long and crazy fights.
whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa.
If you mean stuff like carby then yes. I would love to see an evasion Nin trying to tank cerb or khim, that would make for some good 10 seconds lulz.
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Lol havent done it in xp since like 40ish I think but i used to tank as a blu/war partly cause I had more hate moves and more def and sometimes Vit in my DD gear then most plds had in there tank gear... Hell if I still can tank some stuff pretty dang good endgame IF I bring tanking gear lol. But evasion tanking endgame... except for the old easier nms most HNMs have more or less capped acc no matter how much evasion you bring
Situational tank is situational. Monk is the best overall tank! :P
Truly though... An incredibly decked out Pld will surpass ANY Nin on ANY mob. But to do that for a physical damage mob...
Burtgang
Aegis
Defending Ring
Jelly Ring
Valhalla x2
etc. etc.
Truly though... An incredibly decked out Pld will surpass ANY Nin on ANY mob. But to do that for a physical damage mob...
Burtgang
Aegis
Defending Ring
Jelly Ring
Valhalla x2
etc. etc.
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I tend to say that PLD is a better all-around tank than NIN.
That being said, there are things that a NIN can do that a PLD would have a hard time doing.
I would love to see a PLD Straight tanking Charybdis. I believe it could be done with a well-geared PLD/RDM or PLD/BLU possibly, and enough DD that the fight didn't last long.
Anyway, NIN is good, Especially NIN/DRK. Both are dependent on their support crews to be successful.
As Frobeus said here and somewhere else also, an average PLD will be a better tank than an average NIN. An Excellent NIN will make you wonder why you never saw other NIN like that before. Same goes for an Excellent PLD, though.
That being said, there are things that a NIN can do that a PLD would have a hard time doing.
I would love to see a PLD Straight tanking Charybdis. I believe it could be done with a well-geared PLD/RDM or PLD/BLU possibly, and enough DD that the fight didn't last long.
Anyway, NIN is good, Especially NIN/DRK. Both are dependent on their support crews to be successful.
As Frobeus said here and somewhere else also, an average PLD will be a better tank than an average NIN. An Excellent NIN will make you wonder why you never saw other NIN like that before. Same goes for an Excellent PLD, though.
Good thing -dmg caps at 50%. Otherwise those rediculously decked out plds would be off soloing everything...
Yeah, it caps at -50%, but...
Burtgang -10%
Aegis -70% 40-60% of the time and -25% Magic all the time.
Defending Ring -10%
Jelly Ring -5%
Valhalla x2 -10%
etc. etc.
So, with those pieces I listed that's -35% 40-60% of the time and -70% the rest of the time. And then you can get like another -5% or so on other gear.
Then ya throw on Phalanx II to take 28 more dmg off. A normal hit for 100 dmg becomes ~35 40-60% of the time and ~2 dmg the rest of the time.
Burtgang -10%
Aegis -70% 40-60% of the time and -25% Magic all the time.
Defending Ring -10%
Jelly Ring -5%
Valhalla x2 -10%
etc. etc.
So, with those pieces I listed that's -35% 40-60% of the time and -70% the rest of the time. And then you can get like another -5% or so on other gear.
Then ya throw on Phalanx II to take 28 more dmg off. A normal hit for 100 dmg becomes ~35 40-60% of the time and ~2 dmg the rest of the time.
Wait wait theres rdms out there that merit phalanx2...? For that matter to get 28 youd have to fully merit it lol and have more then 300 enhancing magic.
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