Windower & Windows 8

Again with the 'better than thou' condescending attitude. Xueye was right, you are a ***.

It wasn't that, it has to do with the loading of the data, the PS2 would load mobs faster. At the time was also less glitchy for me, the spaghetti code has changed that somewhat over the time, but not sure as I haven't played on it in awhile.

Im not going to read through the bash fest to make sure this wasnt said so i'll just say it possibly again, but if you right click on the windower.exe and go to properties, you can have it always run through admin and jazz. so you would just launch it like any other application. Although it may have the same issue w/ the registry like windows 7 does. in that case, you'll have to alter the GUI settings via ffxi calculator then save and lauch windower. hope that helps

I understand the concept making new stuff better by not being held back by the old. Requiring compatibility and restraining yourself by older things is an issue. PS2 Limitations!

But I think compatibility is very important, critical even for the windows environments. Most companies will not switch over if they can't use most of their programs, if not all of them. Businesses, as well as the users, are also resistant to change. Most of them freak out when we change anything and retraining is expensive. People don't care if it's hard to make old things work on a new system, they just want it to work and it costs software and OS developers money when people avoid new installments.

Now many of the "issues" are not the fault of the devs, but they must be aware of these things anyway. IE9 and now IE10 have caused my company nothing but misery because web developers take the lazy way out and just coded specifically for the older versions of IE. Pages like this will display poorly in Chrome or Firefox and new IE's but they didn't care, was cheaper and easier upfront to code poorly. It isn't MS's fault that people do these things but when IE10 doesn't display your website correctly, while all the other browsers do, it's on MS to make it work, to stay competitive. They could just say "Oh well if your site is coded by regulations it'll work fine, fix your site" then they loose business and market share.

Does MS care about FFXI? Not in the slightest, but they do care about other older programs and it's important for them to keep them working as it increases Win8's program portfolio.

Just... no.

It is Microsoft's fault people do this because IE, since IE6, has intentionally been different to the web standards. Since, say, 2006? When I became a full time professional web developer I've had nothing but nightmares with IE. In every browser things behave the way they were designed and set out and in new generation browsers things work fine. IE? Nope. Never!

In every released version of IE there's been nothing but nightmares with compatibility. Their *** excuse is they want a 'uniform' internet but the bottom line is it's only IE that doesn't follow web standards. Things that Chrome and Firefox have supported for years have been left out of IE10. Why? What do Microsoft gain by intentionally going against web standards?

I could not tell you exactly how many hours I have spent trying to get things working in IE nor how many deadlines I have overrun because of it. But it's a lot. It is nothing to do with being cheaper or lazy. It's to do with not having the means to actually make things compatible with older and newer versions. For some reason IE10 (the new version coming out soon) is still missing the majority of fancy new things FireFox and Chrome have supported for years. Why? What do Microsoft gain from not supporting them?

Now I apologise if I misinterpreted your post but if you were defending IE, please stop. Internet Explorer is the biggest scourge of web development and has been since forever.

Not defending them at all... Hate IE. Sorry if I said anything oddly that would make you think that. I'm not a web developer ^^; and was trying to make an example of why MS should care about compatibility of things that may not be in their hands, even if in reality they are the ones causing such issues.

I guess because they had such a large market share they thought they could direct the policies where they wanted them...

Ah, yes. I partially misread your first paragraph, sorry. I won't pretend IE doesn't bring the worst out in me, though... :D

@Aeyela

I'm curious now, name a few (3-5?) web standards that IE9/10 does not support intentionally for whatever reason.

Also, please cite reputable sources.

On that note, I haven't touched IE for a long while so I'm not aware of the state that IE is in.

One thing we can all agree on: IE sucks.

edit: well a guy can hope...

Intentionally is implied... I wouldn't believe that on 4 occasions (IE6-IE9) they've 'forgotten' to include them. But 3 examples off the top of my head, they don't support Transitions, Animation or Target classes in CSS3. They don't support local HTML storage either. IE10 will support transitions and animations, so at least they're adding those.

If you want sources I don't know what to do about that... Can't really be fussed to go and find some. But there's a lot of info about it on the W3 site.

But without sources how can what you said be any different than someone spewing the contrary to your claim? Just like the people here who backup their claims for gear sets with math.

You're putting words in my mouth there buddy.

Aeyela for the most part is right, but we could do without the rhetoric please. IE6 almost killed my career as a web developer, but get over it, I did.

IE9 and 10 are fine - certainly not perfect, but they are functional modern browsers. It is true IE is one of the lesser browsers for HTML5 support however.

http://html5test.com/compare/browser/ie10/ff16/chrome23.html

Get over what? IE is still woefully behind the times which makes getting over it being rubbish to work with impossible, no? :)

The browsers themselves are improved... Much improved. Usability is a lot better than it used to be and I actually find IE's handling of multimedia it does support better than Firefox. The problem is the support is not there when it should be in a lot of now mainstream mediums.

IE's greatest strength and weakness is its yearly release cycle.

Organisations love it because they have a dependable browser that won't change for a year that they can deploy to 10,000 people easily.

On the other hand, if some new HTML5 feature is released, Firefox and Chrome can implement it in just a few weeks. IE though? Wait until IE11 or 12 in 2014.

EDIT: Might be time to lock this thread, considering it's about Windower support in Windows 8 and we're talking about HTML5 in IE10.

W3 recommendations proceed through: Working Drafts (work in progress, not a recommendation); Candidate Recommendation (first version where everything seems ok, but may still need work and interoperability testing); Proposed Recommendation (fairly certain all issues are dealt with); and W3C Recommendation (finalized document).

As far as I know, MS avoids implementing anything in IE prior to a CR-level document, to avoid having broken code littering the web when the working group decides to change something about the specification. (That is, they're a bit gun-shy of the reputation that built up around IE6.)

IE9 was released in March 2011.

Transition specification: First working draft released in late 2009; Working draft 3 released in April 2012.
Animations -- Working drafts released in 2009 and 2012.
:target -- Proposed recommendation in 2009, Recommendation in Sept 2011. This is a case where it should have been implemented in IE9.

Given the above, there's no reason to expect IE9 to have implemented 2 of the 3 items you mentioned. The lack of :target is a legitimate complaint.

HTML Storage is (supposedly) supported in IE8+ (I've never personally used it). HTML Storage was developed in the WHATWG, separate from the W3 recommendation process, and apparently was sufficiently stable in 2008 to be included in IE8, though it didn't hit W3 CR-level til late 2011.

Apart from this post derailing to a major IE fight (it was amusing to see someone who hasn't gone through the struggles of fixing CSS for IE try to defend IE and getting shutdown), I really still want a solution for what the original topic title says "Windower & Windows 8".

Every other topic is full of people complaining about Windows 8 and / or Microsoft products, as well as telling the OPs to just use Windows 7.

Well... some people LIKE Windows 8. It's a matter of taste, and specially in the case of Windows 8, you will love it or hate it.
That has nothing to do with anything else but pure personal preference. I'm a programmer and web developer, and I have spent countless of hours hating on IE. However I LOVE Windows 8, and I want to use it for everything I do at home.
That means I don't want to be bothered having a separate Win 7 installation JUST for ffxi. It's stupid and inconvenient.

With all that said... Most solutions I have read tell you to run the program using the "Run as Administrator" option of the contextual menu (you can't have it saved on the shortcut properties, you have to do that every time you run the game).

I haven't gotten it to work myself .. still get a crash right when FFXI launches.

Reinstalled FFXI today on Windows 8, after a couple of hours updating and another couple of hours messing arround with settings and whatnot i finaly got it working, this what i did.

1. Installed the windows vista/7 pol client : http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/download/media/vista01.html?pageID=media
2. start pol and let it update to the latest version (1 hour update)
3. installed final fantasy and the expansion pack, (10 hour update >< )
4. Disabled windows UAC : http://blogs.msdn.com/b/hyperyash/archive/2012/07/18/disabling-user-account-control-in-windows-8.aspx
5. start ffxi with right-click, start as administrator

Working fine here on windows 8 now.