You lost most of your creditability when say you "we speak american".
What ever happened to no child left behind, seriously people are becoming more and more stupid every year. Too bad our medical knowledge is so great, otherwise they would have been removed by natural selection a long time ago.
They're becoming stupider because of things like NCLB. It forces schools to meet the bare minimum standards with no incentive or care given to advancing students past the minimum.
Why would people strive for anything great if they have the government to spoon feed them everything?
All I know is in the past 4 years, I've seen prices go up and my paychecks go down. I was promised change and well... I got change.
People bashing the president based on his likability make me laugh too. I'm never going to sit down to dinner with the boss of my country so who cares if he's not good dinner conversation. I just want someone who fixes the things that are out of my control but stays out of my business and lets me live my life.
I make $10 an hour (some of the lowest money I've ever made in my life) and the last thing I want to be doing is feeding into some system where people can sponge off my hard work.
I think you will have a better time convincing people that you know what you're talking about - and stop convincing people you're a moron - if you don't imply that Obama is not trustworthy because he's black.
I did no such thing. I'm mocking those who are caught up in some kind of weird Obama hypnosis where they don't see his failings and insist that he's perfect (somewhat due to his being the first black president).
Better business doesn't equate better healthcare I'm sorry to inform you.
Wrong. Open healthcare market = more competition which is what produces better results. In a govt run system there is no competition, no need to produce better results.
Unless you have a pre-existing health condition, then you can't get any coverage. That concept within itself is a "death panel"- the ability to deny coverage to someone because they posses a pre-existing health condition.
I find it funny that people don't seem to recognize the reality of getting sink. We're all mortal, we're all going to die, no amount of healthy living is ever going to change that. Should you not be responsible for the costs associated with your illnesses? Or rather, why should someone else be on the hook when you didn't bother to plan ahead and buy insurance? You seem to be upset because breakthrough treatments indeed cost... a ton of money.
Again in an open healthcare market you can take your money elsewhere. In a govt run system you have no other option but to rely on a panel of people accountable to no one, to make that call.
I'm not acknowledging that any panels will exist. The only people who claim these panels will exist are those who lack basic knowledge of healthcare and medicine.
We'll shucks, we were almost making process. Denial is a strong mechanism, but keep working at it. I have full confidence you'll conquer it, maybe November 7th.
That's one of the problems as well Pesh, along with how every "have" parent feels that their child is special and intelligent, regardless of how little they want it to be proven. (of course this is a bit exaggerated, so take it with a grain of salt.)
Educational reform needs to happen, but i've yet to see it on any kind of political platform. These "No Child Left Behind" and "No Zero" policies are just as rediculous as the "Zero Tolerance for Bullying" in their implimentation and practicality. Sometimes children need to be left behind because they have not demonstrated the required level of critical thinking, or the required level of demonstratable knowledge to progress to the next level.
Unless you have a pre-existing health condition, then you can't get any coverage. That concept within itself is a "death panel"- the ability to deny coverage to someone because they posses a pre-existing health condition.
I find it funny that people don't seem to recognize the reality of getting sink. We're all mortal, we're all going to die, no amount of healthy living is ever going to change that.
Wtf?! Either you are circumventing the whole issue. Or do you really think people with cancer and HIV should be left to fend for themselves and die... There is an IMMENSE difference between acknowledging mortality and refusing coverage for HIV and cancer patients....
when you didn't bother to plan ahead and buy insurance?
You realize people get laid-off and/or switch jobs? Guess what? You can't usually keep your SAME provider! You have to go through a DIFFERENT provider. Then there's the issue for people who become unemployed and become unable to afford insurance...
Denial is a strong mechanism, but keep working at it. I have full confidence you'll conquer it, maybe November 7th.
I have full confidence you'll conquer individualism when you develop a chronic ailment and you understand what its like to get denied health coverage, or you're too poor to afford healthcare coverage. But that'll never happen? Right?!
That's one of the problems as well Pesh, along with how every "have" parent feels that their child is special and intelligent, regardless of how little they want it to be proven. (of course this is a bit exaggerated, so take it with a grain of salt.)
Educational reform needs to happen, but i've yet to see it on any kind of political platform. These "No Child Left Behind" and "No Zero" policies are just as rediculous as the "Zero Tolerance for Bullying" in their implimentation and practicality. Sometimes children need to be left behind because they have not demonstrated the required level of critical thinking, or the required level of demonstratable knowledge to progress to the next level.
Exactly. I was fortunate enough to advance forward a year. My brother on the other hand was held back. Both of us got the educations we needed and it didn't take some government mandated program to tell the school what needed to happen for OUR (ie: the students) best interests.
I hate to point out the holes in your arguments Nausi, but one fatal error you've made, is that the government healthcare is indeed open to criticism, and are accountable. They are held accountable by the people, and the government from various branches. As such, they are inredibly and heavily scrutinized to bring forth the high minimum standards of care, which is already paid for by existing taxes.
In an open market of healthcare, there will be varying levels of care, often to the detriment of patients that need recovering treatment as well as the initial.
You point out that people should be held responsible for any kind of illnesses and accidents that befall them, which i will assume, may happen far beyond their control. Without the ability to work, how would these people be able to afford the care needed to get back to work? What about the roof over their heads, and those of their families?
What you are proposing, is essentially a death sentence to those unable to afford insurance premiums, or those that are denied coverage due to pre-existing conditions, set forth by this open market healthcare. With the Government making healthcare universally accessible, it drops unemployment rates by using preventative care methods, as well as accessible healthcare, to keep people at work, or provides enough medical assistance so they can return to work.
On the healthcare note, the only thing that worries me, is:
is there anything you can think of that the federal government does well?
outside of bombing brown people, & taking your $$$, naturally.
This is my number one concern. Sometimes, lately, I feel like people have forgotten that just about everything our government tries to do, it does poorly. And the response (that I've seen) when huge wastes are reported, or just some program being a total failure seems to be a lot less anger than in years past, and more like, "yeah that's how it is."
Even bombing brown people and taking money... just think about how good our income tax system is, and how great of a job we didn't do in Iraq and Afghanistan.
You always know you are winning an argument with a liberal when they pull out the racist card.
Thank you for the laughs.
Liberals are well known for mind control, whining and blowing things out of proportion.
I don't see all that many conservatives screaming all over my Facebook page about everything Obama does or says because they're too busy working or trying to make a living. The amount of Liberal screaming is probably 10x what I see from the Conservative side.
Sadly its no longer a matter of equality, its a matter of entitlement. People feel that they're entitled to assistance.
I honestly feel like people on welfare or government assistance programs should at least do a day of community service to earn their check. Anything that gives back to their community and gives them a sense of self worth. It might also possibly teach them some networking or job skills. The more they sit around and let the government "take care" of them, the lazier they get and the less likely they'll be to return to society as a "productive" member.
The problem is... this view is considered unpopular and non-caring, but Liberals haven't noticed that the middle class isn't shrinking because of the rich. It's shrinking because they're being squeezed to take care of the lazy.
I used to think I was middle class. Hell for awhile, I could have been Upper Middle class. Now I see that I'm poor and yet... I'm not pointing fingers and screaming at the Upper Class because they put me there.
A drowning person will latch on to someone who can only stay afloat for so long. Eventually that person is going to tire out and they're going drown too.
Call me uncaring, but there is work out there. Yes the pay is terrible, yes it is degrading and you will probably hate it, but there are opportunities out there.
I went from making $50,000 a year in 2009 to unemployment in 2010 to minimum wage in 2011. I'm pretty sure I could have extended my unemployment, but I'd rather have a sense of purpose then lay around and watch myself die.
You always know you are winning an argument with a liberal when they pull out the racist card.
Thank you for the laughs.
Liberals are well known for mind control, whining and blowing things out of proportion.
I don't see all that many conservatives screaming all over my Facebook page about everything Obama does or says because they're too busy working or trying to make a living. The amount of Liberal screaming is probably 10x what I see from the Conservative side.
Sadly its no longer a matter of equality, its a matter of entitlement. People feel that they're entitled to assistance.
I honestly feel like people on welfare or government assistance programs should at least do a day of community service to earn their check. Anything that gives back to their community and gives them a sense of self worth. It might also possibly teach them some networking or job skills. The more they sit around and let the government "take care" of them, the lazier they get and the less likely they'll be to return to society as a "productive" member.
The problem is... this view is considered unpopular and non-caring, but Liberals haven't noticed that the middle class isn't shrinking because of the rich. It's shrinking because they're being squeezed to take care of the lazy.
I used to think I was middle class. Hell for awhile, I could have been Upper Middle class. Now I see that I'm poor and yet... I'm not pointing fingers and screaming at the Upper Class because they put me there.
A drowning person will latch on to someone who can only stay afloat for so long. Eventually that person is going to tire out and they're going drown too.
Call me uncaring, but there is work out there. Yes the pay is terrible, yes it is degrading and you will probably hate it, but there are opportunities out there.
I went from making $50,000 a year in 2009 to unemployment in 2010 to minimum wage in 2011. I'm pretty sure I could have extended my unemployment, but I'd rather have a sense of purpose then lay around and watch myself die.
I just love how you chastise the poor for your problems while at the same time criticizing us placing blame on a widespread and substantiated wealth gap.
Your sense of entitlement righteousness is noted.
And Nausi (oh heeeeeeey gurrrrrl):
The ACA is not government-run healthcare.
The ACA is not government-run healthcare.
The ACA is not government-run healthcare.
The ACA is not government-run healthcare.
The ACA is not government-run healthcare.
is there anything you can think of that the federal government (united states of america) does well?
Have you ever been to america? We have the midas touch in reverse. Everything we touch explodes in a nuclear Holocaust. The atom bomb is our most fitting national symbol. There has never been a problem small enough we couldn't snowball it into a cataclysmic disaster.
example # 47,000,000
Yeah, let's leave the presidential election up to OHIO... We have rivers that catch on fire for christsakes. We shouldn't be allowed to vote on american idol.
That's the fundamental problem with adopting European socialist programs. France has stubbornly refused to run any of them for us, the lazy ***. Freedom fries!
I love you and I want you to have all the things. But americans can't even post a video on youtube without killing four or five people.
I did no such thing. I'm mocking those who are caught up in some kind of weird Obama hypnosis where they don't see his failings and insist that he's perfect (somewhat due to his being the first black president).
And yet you conveniently forget to mention the fact that Liberals are among the harshest critics of their own candidate last night. People raging on MSNBC weren't raging because they were hypnotized by Obamas performance - they were raging because he didn't do his best.
That somehow implies perfection? In this thread alone we've seen Obama supporters and those who have no political affiliation criticize his debate yet the Republican responses always tow the party line with no critical analysis of Mitt Romney who has shifted positions on everything. You're pointing at others but can't even follow your own false standards.
Quote:
Open healthcare market = more competition which is what produces better results. In a govt run system there is no competition, no need to produce better results.
Obamacare isn't a truly govt run system as it simply overrides some of the restrictions that the beloved free market had imposed on customers like repeatedly denying those with pre-existing conditions or arbitrary caps on service. This was agree by both Ds and Rs but because it's campaign season and people have ***for memory bolstered by political zeal it's suddenly a "Liberal" issue?
Again, you don't even acknowledge Romneycare which is essentially Obamacare on a smaller scale. Where is your analysis of your own candidate and his once again shifting position? Clearly his vision of a "free market" and "death to those who fall through the cracks" doesn't match up with your views.
Quote:
I find it funny that people don't seem to recognize the reality of getting sink. We're all mortal, we're all going to die, no amount of healthy living is ever going to change that. Should you not be responsible for the costs associated with your illnesses? Or rather, why should someone else be on the hook when you didn't bother to plan ahead and buy insurance? You seem to be upset because breakthrough treatments indeed cost... a ton of money.
This is America, not sub-Sarahan African and yes, we should be attempting to save every life through instruction, information, preventative care and communication with individuals through knowledge coupled with access to adequate healthcare. I know faith likes to play down life because there is some magical candyland on the other side of the void but those of us grounded in reality understand that the most powerful country in the world shouldn't be letting people die because our companies refuse to take patients born with ailments or ailments they pick up along the way.
Your lack of empathy is astounding and like those before you who have played this tune your song will change if anything were to happen to you or someone you care about.
Quote:
Again in an open healthcare market you can take your money elsewhere. In a govt run system you have no other option but to rely on a panel of people accountable to no one, to make that call.
Obamacare allows you to take your money elsewhere as did Romneycare. They aren't the socialist programs they are decried as but who cares about the details?
I just love how you chastise the poor for your problems while at the same time criticizing us placing blame on a widespread and substantiated wealth gap.
I wasn't criticizing the poor. I even grouped me in with that lot. I'm criticizing the lazy.
The last thing I want to do is work my *** off and end up giving my money to some jerkoff who doesn't appreciate anything.
Wtf?! Either you are circumventing the whole issue. Or do you really think people with cancer and HIV should be left to fend for themselves and die... There is an IMMENSE difference between acknowledging mortality and refusing coverage for HIV and cancer patients....
I'm sure you're a wonderful individual Bacon, but my first responsibility is to myself and my family. People are responsible for the choices they make inclusive of the choice to abandon health care insurance because they'd rather have the premium channel package on direct TV during your time unemployed. Our government's attempt to provide for their irresponsibility is creating astronomical health care costs for me and my family (in mass alone last year my premiums went up 20%).
If we're talking about people genuinely getting *** over by their insurance providers then I agree. There needs to be some kind of mechanism to mitigate shitty situations like that, but if you think that is the entire "benign essence" of the 2400 page Affordable Care Act then you aren't living on planet earth my friend.
People are responsible for the choices they make inclusive of the choice to abandon health care insurance because they'd rather have the premium channel package on direct TV during your time unemployed.
National park system Disaster relief Participation dependent eradication programs Interstate highway system Statistics
those were 2 fair points.
& then a really long tirade about how iraq could have been successful, had rumsfeld listened to the pentagon, but long story short, he decided for the armed forces that they could & were going to take Iraq with 150,000 troops. anyone who know anything told him balls, that it would take 500,000. they proceeded to fire 2 generals that refused to invade with that small of an amount, (which is where I dicked up my origanl post, looking for thier names) at which point the 3rd knew he'd be fired as well, & decided to just make the best of it.
I never did find those guys names. & now I don't have the heart to type everything I typed before.
