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A message from your Producer, Akihiko Matsui
Bismarck.Zagen
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 395
By Bismarck.Zagen 2012-08-19 23:51:29
Personally I would like to see the entry lvl for abyssea increased,and old party areas put back into use, tired of what used to be a live world turned abyssea, where most zones are dead compared to what they once were. As stands the level sync function isnt as much used and exp increase is not as much worth it since everyone is book burning. Don't mind keeping the books around as it would give a 2nd option VS 6 man partys, but point is would be nice to see FFXI be the lively world it once was instead of book burn to 30 and burn in abyssea to 99 and stay there for most of what you need. (Also tired of seeing people at 99 with relic/empy with no idea how to play the job decently) You'd also have to remove GoV, FoV, nerf Astral Burns, etc. Even Level Sync would need to get taken out or limited as I remember a level 59 THF who ran qufim sync parties and would keep going with a new sync every time they all leveled out.
It's funny I always see a few people complain about how abyssea ruined old exp stuff, yet those people don't jump servers to play together...
Leviathan.Zaknafien
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 81
By Leviathan.Zaknafien 2012-08-19 23:52:58
point is would be nice to see FFXI be the lively world it once was instead of book burn to 30 and burn in abyssea to 99 and stay there for most of what you need. (Also tired of seeing people at 99 with relic/empy with no idea how to play the job decently)
No offense but this is a fool's dream. Increase the cap for abyssea all you want, it won't stop anyone from just partying with a 99 and book burning to the proper level for abyssea and joining a FC for the remainder. The option for a 6 man party has always existed, but nobody wants to do that anymore. The only way it could change is if it would be faster than joining a FC and this is just too unlikely.
Asura.Ruzoko
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 151
By Asura.Ruzoko 2012-08-19 23:54:15
didn't say raising abyssea cap would fix anything just would be a start and nor did i say it ruined exp stuff main point i DID say was that abyssea killed most of the zones in ffxi and last comment made was not even worth posting so stay on topic
Asura.Ruzoko
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 151
By Asura.Ruzoko 2012-08-19 23:55:25
Leviathan.Zaknafien said: »point is would be nice to see FFXI be the lively world it once was instead of book burn to 30 and burn in abyssea to 99 and stay there for most of what you need. (Also tired of seeing people at 99 with relic/empy with no idea how to play the job decently)
No offense but this is a fool's dream. Increase the cap for abyssea all you want, it won't stop anyone from just partying with a 99 and book burning to the proper level for abyssea and joining a FC for the remainder. The option for a 6 man party has always existed, but nobody wants to do that anymore. The only way it could change is if it would be faster than joining a FC and this is just too unlikely. i agree it is merely a dream as to what all options have been tossed into the mix to fix what abyssea and the tomes have caused would take alot of work and SE most likely isnt going to do it
Asura.Ruzoko
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 151
By Asura.Ruzoko 2012-08-19 23:57:39
will say raising cap entry in aby to at least 70 would be a good start seeing it would force everyone to either do burns or pty i am hoping something is done because with 2 new jobs otw it will be crappy to see them both burned within a day or so
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10394
By Lakshmi.Sparthosx 2012-08-20 00:18:14
Said this before and I'll say it again:
If you want old school parties revive MMM chambers, create incentive for normal parties through things like conquest or make VT/IT mobs drop things worth chasing down.
Upping the Abyssea cap is lazy, uninspired and attempts to put a genie back into the bottle that aint goin back.
Ragnarok.Zellos
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 16
By Ragnarok.Zellos 2012-08-20 00:27:47
I agree with Ruzoko abyssea should of been for high lv only
SE have ruined the lving system in the game due to abyssea having the entry requirement only 30. The game just isn't fun anymore to lv up a job. Obviously the old grinding way was too slow but at least it was fun compared to just standing in abyssea and paying someone so that you can leech your way through your job. I seriously do not know why SE has allowed this to happen it completely destroyed the point in having any jobs with actually levels they might as well all start @99 and remove lvs and just have the merit system.
Leviathan.Zaknafien said: »point is would be nice to see FFXI be the lively world it once was instead of book burn to 30 and burn in abyssea to 99 and stay there for most of what you need. (Also tired of seeing people at 99 with relic/empy with no idea how to play the job decently)
No offense but this is a fool's dream. Increase the cap for abyssea all you want, it won't stop anyone from just partying with a 99 and book burning to the proper level for abyssea and joining a FC for the remainder. The option for a 6 man party has always existed, but nobody wants to do that anymore. The only way it could change is if it would be faster than joining a FC and this is just too unlikely.
The only reason people do not do 6 man party anymore is because there are faster and more efficient alternatives which is abyssea leeching where you do nothing this is NOT fun. Old exp parties may of been slower but at least players learnt their job and actually explored different zones of the game
If anything abyssea has made most of the players of the game poor i.e they do not know how to play their job correctly, they do not use macros, they do not use food, their combat/magic skills are too low.... etc
When you want to do stuff like legion these people ruin the game because they are clueless. This did not happen or rarely did pre-abyssea.
I'm not saying the old way should be the direction the game should go but it should be changed so that players actually experience the game at a more balanced pace so that they learn their jobs and know how/what their abilities/magic are for. And the most important reason is so that the game is more FUN!!! not AFK leeching in abyssea...
Carbuncle.Kunisama
サーバ: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 389
By Carbuncle.Kunisama 2012-08-20 00:31:33
will say raising cap entry in aby to at least 70 would be a good start seeing it would force everyone to either do burns or pty i am hoping something is done because with 2 new jobs otw it will be crappy to see them both burned within a day or so I think its a bit late to start changing the cap in abyssea now, and honestly I wouldn't want them to. The exp grind is my least favourite part of this game, and im sure many agree with that. I think how exp has changed over the last few years has been one thing SE has got spot on. It allows more players to open themselves up for more content, instead of being restricted to your 1 or maybe 2 other jobs that may not be so useful for certain events.
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Leviathan.Zaknafien
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 81
By Leviathan.Zaknafien 2012-08-20 00:36:03
If anything abyssea has made most of the players of the game poor i.e they do not know how to play their job correctly, they do not use macros, they do not use food, their combat/magic skills are too low.... etc
This was a problem before abyssea and astral burns tbh.
If you feel that the way to level is really a problem, try coming up with a solution to your problem rather than state that it's not fun.
Odin.Drgg
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 265
By Odin.Drgg 2012-08-20 00:45:09
I agree with Ruzoko abyssea should of been for high lv only
SE have ruined the lving system in the game due to abyssea having the entry requirement only 30. The game just isn't fun anymore to lv up a job. Obviously the old grinding way was too slow but at least it was fun compared to just standing in abyssea and paying someone so that you can leech your way through your job. I seriously do not know why SE has allowed this to happen it completely destroyed the point in having any jobs with actually levels they might as well all start @99 and remove lvs and just have the merit system.
Leviathan.Zaknafien said: »point is would be nice to see FFXI be the lively world it once was instead of book burn to 30 and burn in abyssea to 99 and stay there for most of what you need. (Also tired of seeing people at 99 with relic/empy with no idea how to play the job decently)
No offense but this is a fool's dream. Increase the cap for abyssea all you want, it won't stop anyone from just partying with a 99 and book burning to the proper level for abyssea and joining a FC for the remainder. The option for a 6 man party has always existed, but nobody wants to do that anymore. The only way it could change is if it would be faster than joining a FC and this is just too unlikely.
The only reason people do not do 6 man party anymore is because there are faster and more efficient alternatives which is abyssea leeching where you do nothing this is NOT fun. Old exp parties may of been slower but at least players learnt their job and actually explored different zones of the game
If anything abyssea has made most of the players of the game poor i.e they do not know how to play their job correctly, they do not use macros, they do not use food, their combat/magic skills are too low.... etc
When you want to do stuff like legion these people ruin the game because they are clueless. This did not happen or rarely did pre-abyssea.
I'm not saying the old way should be the direction the game should go but it should be changed so that players actually experience the game at a more balanced pace so that they learn their jobs and know how/what their abilities/magic are for. And the most important reason is so that the game is more FUN!!! not AFK leeching in abyssea...
There were always "gimp" people who never knew how to play their jobs. Abyssea just made them easier to spot.
Forcing someone to spend a month to level to 99 won't help the fact that you can't fix stupid.
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Ragnarok.Zellos
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 16
By Ragnarok.Zellos 2012-08-20 01:08:44
Leviathan.Zaknafien said: »If anything abyssea has made most of the players of the game poor i.e they do not know how to play their job correctly, they do not use macros, they do not use food, their combat/magic skills are too low.... etc
This was a problem before abyssea and astral burns tbh.
If you feel that the way to level is really a problem, try coming up with a solution to your problem rather than state that it's not fun.
I do not feel like it is a problem.
It is a FACT the level system is broken.
I do not know 1 other MMO which has a broken level system like FFXI.
I do not know what the solution is as I am not a developer all I know is that abyssea being lv30+ ruins the chances of new ways to gain exp that can be implemented into the game as everyone will choose the more easier option but until SE decide to change the current way there will not be anything that people will prefer. (unless they add a more faster way... I hope not)
There is a difference between to lving a job that took 3 months+ to 75 and now only takes 1-3days to get to 99 SE needs to find a good balance.
I agree with Ruzoko abyssea should of been for high lv only
SE have ruined the lving system in the game due to abyssea having the entry requirement only 30. The game just isn't fun anymore to lv up a job. Obviously the old grinding way was too slow but at least it was fun compared to just standing in abyssea and paying someone so that you can leech your way through your job. I seriously do not know why SE has allowed this to happen it completely destroyed the point in having any jobs with actually levels they might as well all start @99 and remove lvs and just have the merit system.
Leviathan.Zaknafien said: »point is would be nice to see FFXI be the lively world it once was instead of book burn to 30 and burn in abyssea to 99 and stay there for most of what you need. (Also tired of seeing people at 99 with relic/empy with no idea how to play the job decently)
No offense but this is a fool's dream. Increase the cap for abyssea all you want, it won't stop anyone from just partying with a 99 and book burning to the proper level for abyssea and joining a FC for the remainder. The option for a 6 man party has always existed, but nobody wants to do that anymore. The only way it could change is if it would be faster than joining a FC and this is just too unlikely.
The only reason people do not do 6 man party anymore is because there are faster and more efficient alternatives which is abyssea leeching where you do nothing this is NOT fun. Old exp parties may of been slower but at least players learnt their job and actually explored different zones of the game
If anything abyssea has made most of the players of the game poor i.e they do not know how to play their job correctly, they do not use macros, they do not use food, their combat/magic skills are too low.... etc
When you want to do stuff like legion these people ruin the game because they are clueless. This did not happen or rarely did pre-abyssea.
I'm not saying the old way should be the direction the game should go but it should be changed so that players actually experience the game at a more balanced pace so that they learn their jobs and know how/what their abilities/magic are for. And the most important reason is so that the game is more FUN!!! not AFK leeching in abyssea...
There were always "gimp" people who never knew how to play their jobs. Abyssea just made them easier to spot.
Forcing someone to spend a month to level to 99 won't help the fact that you can't fix stupid.
Not really before people only had so many jobs they played which were pretty much all geared correctly now too many people want every job to have anything and forget the simple rule of quality > quantity I can guarantee you that most people with less jobs are more skillful/better geared than people which all jobs as at least some if not most of those jobs are not updated as others as in terms of how much time they actually play the job, the macros they have made, the gear they have got.
I only started to realise how bad players are now once SE decided to add harder content in the game again where you actually need to know wtf you are doing or fail will occur i.e legion odin v2
Players are too used to abyssea having atma/buffs to worry about buying food/pots or even gear properly
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1009
By Sylph.Mirvana 2012-08-20 01:09:23
So should I just link the entire BYOU (Build Your Own Update) thread over there? (or at least the posts that aren't "OMGTURNMYJOBINTOAGODANDNERFEVERYTHINGELSE"?)
Asura.Ruzoko
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 151
By Asura.Ruzoko 2012-08-20 01:16:54
gotta agree the system is broke and personally i hate the fact the leveling for 30-99 now is basically same 9 zones same mobs same music, at least in the old days exp mobs changed every 4-5 lvls and the zone you lvld in changed was always exciting and new areas to go to and music to hear
サーバ: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 19647
By Valefor.Prothescar 2012-08-20 01:18:22
I've only glanced at a few posts in this thread, none at all on the OF, but you're criticizing two of the best I've seen thus far. At the very least we need to move beyond content that demands use of PD/Embrava and I'd really like to see 1hand jobs put closer to the same playing field as 2handers on high-level content. Times have changed, the circumstances that necessitated boosting 2handers are long gone.
The point I was trying to make about how I feel that is silly, is the reason they did it in the first place. The whole "you would generate more force if you swung an object with both hands" train of thought. I guess that means nothing to anybody. /shrug. Carry on then mates. Maybe they will change it back. Who knows? I just found that silly due to the above.
Can guarantee that someone who's proficient enough with a couple of daggers, swords, axes, or hammers would deal just as much fatal damage as someone with a bigger sword or axe.
Anyways, my full post was:
Quote: I'm not sure how in depth you want these suggestions to be, so I'll be as brief as I can be.
#1: Rebalancing of One Handed Weapons (As Compared to Two Handed Weapons)
Currently, two handed weapons enjoy a rather large benefit over one handed weapons. They gain a fairly significant attack and accuracy bonus from STR and DEX, just for being two handed weapons, and also sport a higher tolerance to monster defense and level. While this was somewhat of an adequate solution to "balancing" the weapon categories at level 75, player equipment and job progression has changed considerably since then. Currently, at level 99 with level 99 equipment, job abilities, and job traits, this advantage for two handed weapons is unnecessary. It serves only to limit the number of jobs that are able to effectively and efficiently engage in higher end, and in most cases middle tier, content due to artificially limiting their damage output.
I would put forth the motion to abolish these advantages, i.e., have two handed weapons and one handed weapons gain the same attack and accuracy that two handed weapons currently gain from STR and DEX, and also, increase one handed weapon attack caps (currently, two handed weapons cap at 2.25 times attack over defense, while one handers cap at only two times) and other caps (two handed weapon pDIF randomizer capping at 2.625 while one handed weapons cap at just 2.375). Removal of these natural benefits for two handed weapons would elevate one handed weapon user's positions in ability to deal damage, however it would not cause them to overpower two handed weapon users. It would not cause one handed weapon jobs to be more desirable, indeed probably not even as desirable as two handed jobs, but it would be a start. One handed jobs serving only niche purposes that have absolutely no place in the current FFXI landscape is unacceptable, allowing them to potentially deal elevated damage on higher end content with lots of buffs would be dandy.
Now for some smaller, more personal concerns.
#2: Weaponskill Merit Cap
Come on now, this is sorta unnecessary, don't you agree? Why can we only merit three weaponskills? I'm not going to ask for them all, (even though I see no reason why letting us merit every one of the weaponskills, if we so desire, and decide to put in the time is a horrible, unbalanced thing), but I do feel strongly that the cap for this merit category should be raised. Allowing us five to seven of these weaponskills would be adequate for most, I'd think, but limiting us to only three puts a severe damper on a majority of the playerbase.
Merits do not typically serve your original idea of "player diversity". No, instead, they bottleneck the players into choosing certain merits that actually have some effect on performance due to limited ability to spend merits, and in the case of weaponskills force us to choose between having a weaponskill that lets us stand with our peers or not having that weaponskill and dooming us to mediocrity. Several of the merited weaponskills are all but required in the current FFXI metagame for a job to function at an acceptable level, or at a level that anyone would ever want to see themselves functioning at compared to their peers. If I play Corsair, Samurai, Dragoon, and Dark Knight, why do I have to choose between Resolution, Tachi: Shoha, Last Stand, and Stardiver? Why can't I have them all? How is forcing me to be mediocre on the jobs that I choose not to merit advocating diversity even close to as much as it's imprisoning me to an artificially introduced choice?
Please look into increasing the cap on this merit category.
#3: Physical Blue Magic
This one will be a doozy, so bear with me.
Physical blue magic as absolutely, positively, worthless on any target that is close to or higher than a Blue Mage's level due to monster stats and level correction. This is caused by the fact that the ability to gain Blue Magic Attack, and thus overcome a monster's defenses and level, is significantly hampered compared to any other type of offensive action in the game. Currently, blue magic attack is thought and widely believed to be based on the formula [Blue Magic Skill + 8 + STR/2] and is not affected by any attack boosting sources outside of that formula.
Thus, Blue Mages can only increase the attack power of our spells by increasing our Blue Magic Skill or STR, both of which are in relatively limited supply when compared to any other type of attack or attack boosting stat for other types of physical damage.
For example, a Warrior can increase their attack power by eating food, using the job Ability "Berserk", and getting Minuets from a BRD. A Blue Mage can increase their attack power by... using limited amounts of Blue Magic Skill and STR gear and using spells with attack boosts that do not even come close to surmounting any type of mid-to-high level monster's defense and/or level.
See where the problem is?
I propose two possible solutions to this problem:
Solution A: Adjust the Blue Magic Attack formula
[Blue Magic Skill + 8 + STR] and ignore a portion of the level correction penalty
[(Blue Magic Skill + 8 + STR/2) * x] where x = 1.5, 1.75, or 2.
Either of these solutions would significantly enhance a Blue Mage's ability to properly utilize their spells on high level targets, while still maintaining balance through spell recast times, MP costs, and the fact that this will only partially increase the overall strength of physical blue magic.
Solution B: Allow Blue Magic Attack to benefit from attack buffs
For example, allow physical blue magic to benefit from food, Berserk, and Minuets.
Please consider looking into this. As it stands, Blue Mages are reduced to run-of-the-mill, under-the-bridge one handed melee DDs on any target that rates as Very Tough or higher due to our severely dwarfed attack score on physical blue magic, which just happens to be our signature.
#4: Blue Magic Procs in Voidwatch
Hi, so... can't help but notice that Blue Mage is the only job that didn't receive its required Voidwatch proc list adjustment. Why? We were arguably the most needy of any job in Voidwatch to have our proc list trimmed to size, the only job that I'd say was worse off would be SMN, and they got their update.
Why is it that I have to spend every single one of my Blue Magic points on proc spells while still being unable to fit them all and having to wait 60 seconds for my spells to be ready to cast after resetting them in order to proc? Why? Can't we just have one, maybe two spells per element? Please?
#5: Please fix our broken BLU spells
They're worthless otherwise. Barbed Crescent, Hecatomb Wave, Sandspin, Tourbillion, and a couple of others are all completely useless in their current state. Their additional effects are the only reasons to use them to begin with, and with those additional effects not functioning properly (i.e., not landing on anything), they are never, ever, ever worth using.
Personally, I feel particularly slighted that my 5 minute recast, unremarkably damaging Tourbillion spell doesn't work properly.
#6: Increase the Duration of Blue Magic buffs
Spells suck as Barrier Tusk, Triumphant Roar, and Feather Barrier are completely useless as they currently stand, as they have far too little durations and too long casting times. Please look into adjusting this.
Mostly BLU oriented but that shouldn't surprise anyone, I doubt we'll get any of it.
[+]
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10394
By Lakshmi.Sparthosx 2012-08-20 01:20:16
Quote: gotta agree the system is broke and personally i hate the fact the leveling for 30-99 now is basically same 9 zones same mobs same music, at least in the old days exp mobs changed every 4-5 lvls and the zone you lvld in changed was always exciting and new areas to go to and music to hear
You weren't playing the same FFXI pre-Abyssea then.
Pre-Abyssea EXP boiled down to:
-Qufim
-Jungles
-ERon(S)
-Wajaom
-Bhaflau 1
-Caedarva Mire
-Bhaflau 2
MMM, SMNburn or BLU/BLMburn were few and far between but mostly the game had devolved into bashing birds ad infinitum only to hit endgame and bash more birds ad infinitum.
[+]
Carbuncle.Aeonknight
サーバ: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 155
By Carbuncle.Aeonknight 2012-08-20 01:29:46
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »Quote: gotta agree the system is broke and personally i hate the fact the leveling for 30-99 now is basically same 9 zones same mobs same music, at least in the old days exp mobs changed every 4-5 lvls and the zone you lvld in changed was always exciting and new areas to go to and music to hear You weren't playing the same FFXI pre-Abyssea then. Pre-Abyssea EXP boiled down to: -Qufim -Jungles -ERon(S) -Wajaom -Bhaflau 1 -Caedarva Mire -Bhaflau 2 MMM, SMNburn or BLU/BLMburn were few and far between but mostly the game had devolved into bashing birds ad infinitum only to hit endgame and bash more birds ad infinitum. Depends how far back we're talking here. Pre-ToAU/WoTG it was:
Valkurm
Qufim
Kazham
Garlaige/Altepa
Quicksand
Crawler's Nest
Kuftal
Boyahda
Valley of Sorrows
Lab of Onzozo
Moon
Sky/Bibiki/Lufaise
That was just my experience, I wouldn't be surprised if I missed a zone or 2 or even got them out of order, it's been who knows how long since I xp'd the "real way". This is also not accounting for more inclusive spots, like bones parties in KRT.
But yea, after ToAU came about, xp did boil down to killing pink things for a very very long time. I don't mind getting the opportunity to have explored the zones I did while xp'ing, but I sure as hell don't miss the days when 5k an hour was kick *** xp. I've seen the zones already, don't need to see em again for the 1000th time.
[+]
Asura.Ruzoko
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 151
By Asura.Ruzoko 2012-08-20 01:55:32
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »Quote: gotta agree the system is broke and personally i hate the fact the leveling for 30-99 now is basically same 9 zones same mobs same music, at least in the old days exp mobs changed every 4-5 lvls and the zone you lvld in changed was always exciting and new areas to go to and music to hear
You weren't playing the same FFXI pre-Abyssea then.
Pre-Abyssea EXP boiled down to:
-Qufim
-Jungles
-ERon(S)
-Wajaom
-Bhaflau 1
-Caedarva Mire
-Bhaflau 2
MMM, SMNburn or BLU/BLMburn were few and far between but mostly the game had devolved into bashing birds ad infinitum only to hit endgame and bash more birds ad infinitum. and yes i was here far before aby even came out >.> started shortly after ToAU was released and those werent the only zones i partied in did in some zones aeon said as well as many other party areas, aydeewa subterrane is one as well
Cerberus.Kylos
サーバ: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4753
By Cerberus.Kylos 2012-08-20 01:56:04
I really don't understand why people are talking about the EXP now, and how it has to be changed.
First of all, a lot of players already have all jobs at 99 now, they have no need to go back to leveling jobs, so if EXP was changed, it would mostly effect casual players who didn't have the time to sit around in La Theine bashing worms for hours every day.
When Abyssea was released, the majority of the fanbase loved it. They could now level jobs they would not have normally leveled in a easier way. In the old content, it was very possible to level a job to 75 in a day or two, all you needed was a bunch of people helping you as PL's.
Before Abyssea, I had DRK THF and PLD levelled, since Abyssea I have burned(well I didn't sit around and leech, I actually made sure I was busy) COR WAR and BST to 99. The only job I had some problem coming to terms with is COR, because it is naturally a job that has a lot to do and remember. WAR and BST are very simple and just about anyone can play those jobs right.
Why will I not level the rest of the jobs to 99? Because I don't want to play any other jobs, I am not a mage(Respect to those who do, you keep me alive), and now I have that choice, I choose not to.
You seem to be forgetting that a lot of players are self efficient, they know where to get their information, they know how the game works, and in old parties they took the time to see how other jobs were played.
This is why I put forward my idea of "Job Tutorials", a system where players (Who may not be the smartest cookie in the jar) can go to a certain NPC, and they can show them physically what a job does, and the basics on how to play it. This will make it easier on those players who are newer to the game, and never got so lucky as to have to spend over a year(Yes it took me over a year) to get their first job to 75+.
SE wanted players to level from 30-99 in Abyssea, rather then get into Astral Burn parties, this helped a lot because the Astral Burning caused major lag on servers when level sync was introduced. They gave people the option to go do FOV or GOV if they didn't want to level in Abyssea. I never joined an Astral Burn party as it felt like pure leeching to me, and even though it did require some skill to pull off, it was not what I was used to, so I looked down on it.
EXP died when Level Sync was introduced, Abyssea was brought in to stop Astral Burns, so don't be blaming Abyssea. If anything SE wanted us to level any and all jobs to 99, so people can get into the endgame quicker, making it so you can choose any job that is needed, so you ain't left out in the cold and crying.. "Why won't you take my THF to Voidwatch??? I worked hard on this :("
Like I say to anyone who rejoins this game now, EXP is (Too Weak), so level any job you like to play, level jobs that will help you and the jobs you like playing, then get started in bashing up your endgame content.
Peace.
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Asura.Ruzoko
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 151
By Asura.Ruzoko 2012-08-20 02:03:38
the damage is done yes but again with 2 new jobs to be released it be crappy to see them hit 99 in 1 day and despite the fact u state exp was dead before aby it was not, lvl sync gave a new way to exp and parties were still around during that time, it entirely died out shortly after visions was introduced. and as for your comment on endgame, there isnt much you can really call endgame anymore seeing as 90% of it is /shout or can be solo or duo'd as for your "SE wanted players to burn to 99" there is nothing to really support this, other than entry cap is 30 introduce a new way to lvl possibly but to the extent its used now probably not
Cerberus.Kylos
サーバ: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4753
By Cerberus.Kylos 2012-08-20 02:11:42
Why would SE introduce a system where you can gain 600 EXP per mob, if they didn't want everyone to level up all jobs to 99???
Please think about what you are saying. Before Abyssea, people where paying people to get in Astral Burns, which was only possible because of Level Sync. People started burning jobs up in that way and causing major lag on the server, there were still people who leveled the old fashioned way, but there were also people who just stayed in Valkurm and Qufim and levelled to 75 that way.
Once again... LEVEL SYNC killed the Old school Party Star. (Not sure if you get that reference)
Abyssea killed the Astral Burn Star.
The only reason why everyone can level all jobs to 99 now, is because someone found the Astral Burn exploit. I don't care what anyone says, Astral Burning was pure exploitation of the Level Sync, I am pretty sure SE didn't intend players to level in that way, so they made Abyssea in order to stop that. Do you see people Astral Burn anymore? No I didn't think so.
SE wants players to level all jobs to 99 now, whether you solo it outside, inside, FC burn it, it don't really matter, they want as many players to do endgame content (Please don't make me bring out the full list in what level 99s can work on in endgame) as that is where the real fun lies.
Also Seekers of Adoulin is coming out soon, tons of people have 99 jobs, Empyreans, Relics and so on, so fingers crossed, they will make the whole expansion difficult for the average player, even with all jobs at 99.
Asura.Ruzoko
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 151
By Asura.Ruzoko 2012-08-20 02:15:48
Why would SE introduce a system where you can gain 600 EXP per mob, if they didn't want everyone to level up all jobs to 99???
Please think about what you are saying. Before Abyssea, people where paying people to get in Astral Burns, which was only possible because of Level Sync. People started burning jobs up in that way and causing major lag on the server, there were still people who leveled the old fashioned way, but there were also people who just stayed in Valkurm and Qufim and levelled to 75 that way.
Once again... LEVEL SYNC killed the Old school Party Star. (Not sure if you get that reference)
Abyssea killed the Astral Burn Star.
The only reason why everyone can level all jobs to 99 now, is because someone found the Astral Burn exploit. I don't care what anyone says, Astral Burning was pure exploitation of the Level Sync, I am pretty sure SE didn't intend players to level in that way, so they made Abyssea in order to stop that. Do you see people Astral Burn anymore? No I didn't think so.
SE wants players to level all jobs to 99 now, whether you solo it outside, inside, FC burn it, it don't really matter, they want as many players to do endgame content (Please don't make me bring out the full list in what level 99s can work on in endgame) as that is where the real fun lies.
Also Seekers of Adoulin is coming out soon, tons of people have 99 jobs, Empyreans, Relics and so on, so fingers crossed, they will make the whole expansion difficult for the average player, even with all jobs at 99. i have thought about what i have said and what u fail to account for is the mass amounts of RMT that sprung up even moreso since abyssea their fell cleaves are everywhere as well as the multiple afk groups you see, that is what i mean by "to that extent" and maybe on your server parties died but asura they were going for a good while still because i myself used level sync and made parties with it
and ill agree with seekers coming out IF there was indeed a reason for the mass burn to 99 and easier relic/empys in preparation for the expansion then yes it is how they wanted it to happen IF however seekers is merely just another simple area without challenge then SE will let many of us down and put ffxi into easy mode just to make things apparently "Simpler" for those who are merely casual gamers that want to burn through everything and move on
By Vylandra2 2012-08-20 02:16:33
I just want there to be a definitive tank again. I don't want WAR walking in and tanking things for no reason at all. With the introduction of a true tank stop the EVA tanking and WAR tanking. Please adjust enmity so that tanks are actually capable of tanking. I don't want to cap my enmity ten seconds into a fight and have the mob bounce around even though we have a tank in the party. The current system with thf doesn't balance enmity in ANY way given the current state of the game. Tanks need a way to have extra enmity not available to other jobs.
Cerberus.Kylos
サーバ: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4753
By Cerberus.Kylos 2012-08-20 02:19:50
I made parties with it too. I leveled my PLD up using Level Sync, I could have used Astral Burning but simply refused.
RMT have been around the game for a very long time. The only reason why RMT seemed to disappear for a while, was because SE made money a lot less available. Nowadays anyone can make money in a short amount of time, you can make 5 Million gil from 2 Million Cruor by talking to an NPC!
As long as gil is flowing in the game, RMT will find a way to exploit that and sell that gil to the idiots who decide to buy from them. The only reason RMT exist is because people buy from them, if no one bought gil from them, they would move onto another game where people will buy from them.
Don't blame SE or Abyssea for RMT, blame the playerbase for spending real money to advance in a game which is already easy to play.
サーバ: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2742
By Fairy.Ghaleon 2012-08-20 02:20:12
tbh all they would have to do is come out with "neo-merits" (kinda like they said they would when they first announced 99 cap -.-;) but make these new merits only upgradable via exp from outside abyssea.
but now that we are 99, where to meripo yo? lol.
i miss old school merit parties :(
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6473
By Odin.Blazza 2012-08-20 02:21:59
I leveled from 95 to 99 and capped merits in Bostaunieux Oubliette. Grounds of Valour isn't as fast as a good burn, whether it's abyssea or otherwise, but I think it's a little more interesting, and the options are more varied than just those 9 zones.
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9265
By Odin.Eikechi 2012-08-20 02:28:56
Valefor.Prothescar said: »I've only glanced at a few posts in this thread, none at all on the OF, but you're criticizing two of the best I've seen thus far. At the very least we need to move beyond content that demands use of PD/Embrava and I'd really like to see 1hand jobs put closer to the same playing field as 2handers on high-level content. Times have changed, the circumstances that necessitated boosting 2handers are long gone.
The point I was trying to make about how I feel that is silly, is the reason they did it in the first place. The whole "you would generate more force if you swung an object with both hands" train of thought. I guess that means nothing to anybody. /shrug. Carry on then mates. Maybe they will change it back. Who knows? I just found that silly due to the above.
Can guarantee that someone who's proficient enough with a couple of daggers, swords, axes, or hammers would deal just as much fatal damage as someone with a bigger sword or axe.
Anyways, my full post was:
Quote: I'm not sure how in depth you want these suggestions to be, so I'll be as brief as I can be.
#1: Rebalancing of One Handed Weapons (As Compared to Two Handed Weapons)
Currently, two handed weapons enjoy a rather large benefit over one handed weapons. They gain a fairly significant attack and accuracy bonus from STR and DEX, just for being two handed weapons, and also sport a higher tolerance to monster defense and level. While this was somewhat of an adequate solution to "balancing" the weapon categories at level 75, player equipment and job progression has changed considerably since then. Currently, at level 99 with level 99 equipment, job abilities, and job traits, this advantage for two handed weapons is unnecessary. It serves only to limit the number of jobs that are able to effectively and efficiently engage in higher end, and in most cases middle tier, content due to artificially limiting their damage output.
I would put forth the motion to abolish these advantages, i.e., have two handed weapons and one handed weapons gain the same attack and accuracy that two handed weapons currently gain from STR and DEX, and also, increase one handed weapon attack caps (currently, two handed weapons cap at 2.25 times attack over defense, while one handers cap at only two times) and other caps (two handed weapon pDIF randomizer capping at 2.625 while one handed weapons cap at just 2.375). Removal of these natural benefits for two handed weapons would elevate one handed weapon user's positions in ability to deal damage, however it would not cause them to overpower two handed weapon users. It would not cause one handed weapon jobs to be more desirable, indeed probably not even as desirable as two handed jobs, but it would be a start. One handed jobs serving only niche purposes that have absolutely no place in the current FFXI landscape is unacceptable, allowing them to potentially deal elevated damage on higher end content with lots of buffs would be dandy.
Now for some smaller, more personal concerns.
#2: Weaponskill Merit Cap
Come on now, this is sorta unnecessary, don't you agree? Why can we only merit three weaponskills? I'm not going to ask for them all, (even though I see no reason why letting us merit every one of the weaponskills, if we so desire, and decide to put in the time is a horrible, unbalanced thing), but I do feel strongly that the cap for this merit category should be raised. Allowing us five to seven of these weaponskills would be adequate for most, I'd think, but limiting us to only three puts a severe damper on a majority of the playerbase.
Merits do not typically serve your original idea of "player diversity". No, instead, they bottleneck the players into choosing certain merits that actually have some effect on performance due to limited ability to spend merits, and in the case of weaponskills force us to choose between having a weaponskill that lets us stand with our peers or not having that weaponskill and dooming us to mediocrity. Several of the merited weaponskills are all but required in the current FFXI metagame for a job to function at an acceptable level, or at a level that anyone would ever want to see themselves functioning at compared to their peers. If I play Corsair, Samurai, Dragoon, and Dark Knight, why do I have to choose between Resolution, Tachi: Shoha, Last Stand, and Stardiver? Why can't I have them all? How is forcing me to be mediocre on the jobs that I choose not to merit advocating diversity even close to as much as it's imprisoning me to an artificially introduced choice?
Please look into increasing the cap on this merit category.
#3: Physical Blue Magic
This one will be a doozy, so bear with me.
Physical blue magic as absolutely, positively, worthless on any target that is close to or higher than a Blue Mage's level due to monster stats and level correction. This is caused by the fact that the ability to gain Blue Magic Attack, and thus overcome a monster's defenses and level, is significantly hampered compared to any other type of offensive action in the game. Currently, blue magic attack is thought and widely believed to be based on the formula [Blue Magic Skill + 8 + STR/2] and is not affected by any attack boosting sources outside of that formula.
Thus, Blue Mages can only increase the attack power of our spells by increasing our Blue Magic Skill or STR, both of which are in relatively limited supply when compared to any other type of attack or attack boosting stat for other types of physical damage.
For example, a Warrior can increase their attack power by eating food, using the job Ability "Berserk", and getting Minuets from a BRD. A Blue Mage can increase their attack power by... using limited amounts of Blue Magic Skill and STR gear and using spells with attack boosts that do not even come close to surmounting any type of mid-to-high level monster's defense and/or level.
See where the problem is?
I propose two possible solutions to this problem:
Solution A: Adjust the Blue Magic Attack formula
[Blue Magic Skill + 8 + STR] and ignore a portion of the level correction penalty
[(Blue Magic Skill + 8 + STR/2) * x] where x = 1.5, 1.75, or 2.
Either of these solutions would significantly enhance a Blue Mage's ability to properly utilize their spells on high level targets, while still maintaining balance through spell recast times, MP costs, and the fact that this will only partially increase the overall strength of physical blue magic.
Solution B: Allow Blue Magic Attack to benefit from attack buffs
For example, allow physical blue magic to benefit from food, Berserk, and Minuets.
Please consider looking into this. As it stands, Blue Mages are reduced to run-of-the-mill, under-the-bridge one handed melee DDs on any target that rates as Very Tough or higher due to our severely dwarfed attack score on physical blue magic, which just happens to be our signature.
#4: Blue Magic Procs in Voidwatch
Hi, so... can't help but notice that Blue Mage is the only job that didn't receive its required Voidwatch proc list adjustment. Why? We were arguably the most needy of any job in Voidwatch to have our proc list trimmed to size, the only job that I'd say was worse off would be SMN, and they got their update.
Why is it that I have to spend every single one of my Blue Magic points on proc spells while still being unable to fit them all and having to wait 60 seconds for my spells to be ready to cast after resetting them in order to proc? Why? Can't we just have one, maybe two spells per element? Please?
#5: Please fix our broken BLU spells
They're worthless otherwise. Barbed Crescent, Hecatomb Wave, Sandspin, Tourbillion, and a couple of others are all completely useless in their current state. Their additional effects are the only reasons to use them to begin with, and with those additional effects not functioning properly (i.e., not landing on anything), they are never, ever, ever worth using.
Personally, I feel particularly slighted that my 5 minute recast, unremarkably damaging Tourbillion spell doesn't work properly.
#6: Increase the Duration of Blue Magic buffs
Spells suck as Barrier Tusk, Triumphant Roar, and Feather Barrier are completely useless as they currently stand, as they have far too little durations and too long casting times. Please look into adjusting this.
Mostly BLU oriented but that shouldn't surprise anyone, I doubt we'll get any of it.
In all fairness, I agree with every other point you made, especially the blu stuff. I hate having to set more points than blu gets at 99 (pending your 4 elements, you have to use like 52 points or something to set them all) for VW. It's why I avoid going as blu most of the time. I just got sick of being able to set sudden lunge at most, other than my proc spells.
Cerberus.Kylos
サーバ: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4753
By Cerberus.Kylos 2012-08-20 02:30:38
I don't miss old school merit parties in the slightest because I am a DRK, not a DRG or SAM lol.
I would still get accepted sometimes.. but Polearm was always the weapon of choice, and I really didn't want to jump on the DRG bandwagon :P I guess each to their own.
[+]
Cerberus.Kvazz
サーバ: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 5345
By Cerberus.Kvazz 2012-08-20 02:33:05
I don't miss old school merit parties in the slightest because I am a DRK, not a DRG or SAM lol.
I would still get accepted sometimes.. but Polearm was always the weapon of choice, and I really didn't want to jump on the DRG bandwagon :P I guess each to their own.
I merited on DRK fairly often!
But I did have RDM and COR aswell that were used for the most part.
The one thing I miss about old meritparties, parsing.
It was more like a fun competition than anything else for me, even when I were on COR.
[+]
Bismarck.Zagen
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 395
By Bismarck.Zagen 2012-08-20 02:40:46
i have thought about what i have said and what u fail to account for is the mass amounts of RMT that sprung up even moreso since abyssea their fell cleaves are everywhere as well as the multiple afk groups you see, that is what i mean by "to that extent" and maybe on your server parties died but asura they were going for a good while still because i myself used level sync and made parties with it Before RMT did cleaves, players did it first, not only first a few of them did it very well. Advertising a good whisker/FC burn that can pull in 300k/hr over a cleave pt that might get 150k/hr for the same price ratio is pointless because the idea of gil being hard to obtain is gone, if it was still there people would want the good pts and refuse to pay the same amount for the crappier parties.
RMT can stay, even when offering 1 mil for $9 it isn't appealing because there are so many options to make gil, be it generating it out of thin air via methods like blinkers or by shifting it around from player to player via methods like dynamis currency. RMT and their banks of gil might be an issue if SE ever creates a real intensive gil sinkhole. Until then arguing that RMT leveling up really easy because of Abyssea or any other burn method as a reason to hurt players who don't actually find grinding EXP fun after a short amount of time by raising caps is laughable at best and well more so spiteful than anything else.
Even if you've never leeched a job in Abyssea unless you only do events solo or with a group of people who've never leeched a job, you have benefited from people being able to leech jobs so why knock it?
Edit: As to arguing for the 2 new jobs getting from 1-99 in a day, who cares? The good players will still test the jobs, see how they work (I mean really work not how SE thinks they should work). You don't need a slow EXP grind fest to test a job's capabilities.
Cerberus.Kylos
サーバ: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4753
By Cerberus.Kylos 2012-08-20 02:42:18
Yes the only way I could get a merit party was to come on DRK lol. No way would they take my THF xD
My DRK could outdamage some SAM and DRG at the time, it was pretty noticeable, which always gave me a sense of accomplishment, but every now and then some super WAR with Armada Hauberk, or some SAM or DRG would make me look like ***lol. That's when I knew I was in a real merit party lol.
Merit Parties could be fun, but to be honest I prefer bashing up worms with my DRK in La Theine then getting a limited amount of EXP bashing up birds. People were always so picky those days too, like when a BRD didn't think the party was exping quick enough, they would just leave, same for the Red Mages, it would just break parties.
Now people can't say.. "OH MAI GAWD! This Party is too slow!" Thank you Abyssea for that lol.
| 08-15-2012 01:23 PM | | Akihiko Matsui | | Dev Team |  |
| | Hello everyone.
Thanks for all of the "likes" and messages in response to the post I made the other day!
As I wrote in the Message from the Producer, there is a ton to catch up on from the past two years and I've been doing my best each day to do just that. However, even if I do my best I don’t think this gap is something that I can completely fill by myself, so I would really appreciate everyone's help.
Now then, I'd like you all to tell me what you would like me to focus on. Anything is fine.
However, I would like you to keep in mind and agree to the following:
Do not attack or flame others, including myself.
Be specific and concrete. We won't be able to accomplish anything if posts are unclear or full of attacks.
Instead of saying what you "don’t want," tell me what you "want."
Tell me what it is that YOU prefer. Not what your friends or linkshell members say, I want to hear from you specifically.
Please make your posts as a reply to this thread (I will also be taking into consideration the amount of "likes" each post receives). As a general rule, feedback should be posted in the appropriate thread, so once we collected enough post in this thread and after an appropriate amount of time, we'll close the thread. Also please limit replies to your opinions only and if you would like to discuss specific points, please utilize appropriate threads for each topic.
I will be doing my best to look over each and every post made. (Though, I am sure it will take some time…) Your opinions will definitely play a part in helping me fill in the gap from these past two years as well as for thinking about the future of FINAL FANTASY XI.
In addition to the work for currently scheduled version updates, there is also a lot of work to be done for the new expansion, "Seeker of Adoulin," so I don’t think there will be very many things we can do immediately and I’d like to apologize for that.
Also, I don’t believe it will be possible to have every single thing come to fruition, due to the fact that there may be content that is contradictory or things that no matter how hard we try it is just not feasible.
I will first be making sure that I accurately understand what you would like and then will determine if it is possible or not, and assign a priority level to it. I will be sharing this with you all and making it so together we can see the picture of how FINAL FANTASY XI will change going forward. I feel this is something the community needs and though it might not be quite so easy, it is a method I would like to adopt.
Thank you very much! | |
As always with topics like these, feel free to discuss the topic here, but if you want your voice heard you will need to post in the topic on the official forums.
| 08-27-2012 01:13 PM | | Akihiko Matsui | | Dev Team |  |
| | Thank you so much for the large amount of comments! We will now be closing the thread.
There are a huge amount of suggestions from Japan, North America, and Europe, but I will be looking over each and every post that followed the instructions, and will be taking it all into consideration as I think about the future of FINAL FANTASY XI and the mutual feelings of the community.
I also have one more request for you all. I hope that you all could read over all of the posts in this thread (of course, reading over what you can is fine, too).
After playing with your friends for so long, you often start to think and play the same way as the them, including your linkshell members, and players that you spend a lot of time with and grow close to.
In this thread there are posts from these people as well as people who think in a completely different way. I’d like you to try and understand what adventurers other than yourself are thinking and looking for.
In order to continue to protect the FINAL FANTASY XI that we all love, we need everyone's cooperation or we'll be unable to accomplish anything.
I'd like to place more importance on the community and work side-by-side with you all.
From here on out I would appreciate it if you could consider the fact that there are people in the community who think in a variety of different ways and to sometimes write your feedback and opinions from an open-minded standpoint.
Thank you all very much! | |
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