TP Bonus Dagger + Rudra's

I'm hoping someone can clear up my confusion here. Wiki says that the TP Bonus effect from weapons that have it don't function off-hand. But I equipped my Daka+2 off-hand last night and saw that Rudra's didn't appear in the ws list.

If I have TP Bonus Fusetto and Daka+2, which weapon goes where? They're both supposed to work right? I'm hoping wiki is just wrong about the Fusetto not working off-hand.

Fusetto works offhand. (But only the tp+100 augment and store tp, I belive)
You will never get a weaponskill from a weapon if offhanded.

The TP bonus weapons on AH do not work on offhand. The magian trial weapons do. Daka has to be equipped in main hand to access the weaponskill.

On an unrelated note, my condolences on the Daka.

-.- yeah yeah.

Okay well I will continue to pour more hours into this Fusetto then. Interesting how the AH ones don't work offhand. Thanks for the info.

Its because of how SE labels them, TP bonus is not exactly +100tp as far as how it is calculated.

edit: I'm not sure how to explain it with out it sounding like tp bonus doesn't kick you up to the next level.

Well I do see now that the Martial weapons say "TP Bonus" and Fusetto says "TP Bonus +100". So maybe they're just two completely different, yet similar, things.

http://wiki.bluegartr.com/bg/TP_Bonus

Thank you, didn't know that page existed.

If that page on bg is correct and the tp bonus doesnt affect empy weapons aftermath there no point using it though i could be wrong. The main reason would have been for a better aftermath but since its a dqka that doesnt apply. Wouldnt using an offhand weapon with dex on it be better than the tp bonus?

fusetto adds a very nice amount of dmg to rudra, twash + fusetto is awesome

the ftp mods for rudras storm at 100% tp and 200% tp are 3.25 and 4.25 respectively, the offhand fusetto does apply to rudras giving it a 25%~ boost at 100%tp but you loose this advantage if you are weaponskilling with anything more than 200%tp (175% with moonshade tp bonus) however you miss out on the melee DoT that a STR thokcha or coruscanti offer

11 dex will definitely not push your rudra's damage that far, however if your weaponskilling frequently at 300%tp (voidwatch) your probably better off with a STR thokcha for attack and a bit of str. Acc usually isn't a problem assuming you have decent gear/the right temps.

You'd be better off with two STR daggers, spamming Exenterator. Gimpyrean isn't particularly useful.

Oh believe me, I have not fooled myself into thinking that I'll be full-timing that Daka. This is just a toy that I'll occasionally whip out when I feel like seeing a big number on my screen.

Which begs the question, why spend so much time on Fusetto just to complement a part-time toy? And the answer to that is because I'm crazy. And because it may be useful for Aeolian Edge someday.

STR dagger would still probably be a better offhand!

Less really given Moonshade Earring, overflow TP, offhand hit, and any DA/TA procs.

So barring voidwatch and dynamis, what would be the best offhand dagger for Rhudras

I hear ya, for overall damage. But for Rudra's damage alone, I would be quite surprised.

I haven't quiteeeeeee come to accept this as fact yet, its one of those things that makes sense but shouldn't

I will admit however that 2x STR kila = ex is some serious business

Went on an LS run the other night and we had someone brew 5 Azdaja's with TP Bonus atma on and killed faster than our other brewer (seperate run) with better gear but typical AE burn atmas. I would assume the dagger would produce similar results.

Agreed, I still use my daka in abyssea since double darkness does A LOT of damage in a small amount of time. Personal record for example for ulhidash is under 1:30 with just me and a whm.

That fight is heavily skewed to favor damage in large bursts.

It makes sense because it's true. Your dissonance is the result of your desire to see your hard work pay off. The unfortunate reality is that Rudra's Storm has limited applicability. Unless you're prepared to drop millions getting it to 99, I'd get accustomed to it being the lesser option in almost all situations.

On that note, 90 Twashtar doesn't really hold its own that well either.

STR Thokcha x2 = 380 delay, 47 base damage on each hand, +22 STR, +44 Attack (+55 Attack with STR)
Including fSTR (assuming none is wasted) = D52~53 base damage on each hand, +55 Attack
DPS = 105/380 = 16.6

STR Thokcha + Twashtar = 366 delay, D48/D47, +11 STR, +22 Attack (+27 attack with STR)
Including fSTR (assuming none is wasted) = D51/50, +27 Attack
DPS = 100.5/366 = 16.5

You gain 15 DEX but lose 27 Attack with the second setup. Is it worth it? Probably, if you factor in increased TP gain and potential crit rate. Is it unquestionably the best weapon to mainhand? Welllllllll.....

That's not quite it at all, I just find that the answer isn't always so cut and dry as it's made to believe it is. Aftermath is a very very potent tool and I believe it holds some serious grounds for consideration in the big picture.

Not to mention the higher the NM/mob's evasion is the more Rudra's comes out on top. A single hit ws (2~ hit with dual wield) with an additional effect of weight which gives eva -5%~ (not sure if its ever been clarified)

It comes down to

Rudra's Storm 1~2 hit 3.25 ftp (4.25 assuming DW hit lands) 60% DEX mod
vs
Exenterator 4~5 hit 4.0 ftp (5.0 assuming DW hit lands) 100% AGI mod (I also believe it has a slight attack bonus like 5%~8%?)

Keep in mind dancer's natural trait of Skillchain Bonus (+20%) and how that favor's Rudra's Storm in any fight where skillchaining is applicable. Also keep in mind that for Exenterator to perform at its best all of it's hits must land, making it have a similar problem to asuran fists and monk back at the 75 days.. You can pack on as much acc as you want but that 95% acc cap is going to limit Exenterator more than it would rudra's

edit: kind of forgot DA,TA,QA but seeing as they can both proc on rudras or exen... i dont know and i'd prefer not to delve any deeper than i have at 1am at night

Accuracy does not favor Rudra's Storm. If your accuracy is poor, you adjust it. Nobody parses themselves at 70% WSACC, says "oh well", and keeps derping around. And your argument, much like the argument made by monks of old, reeks of gambler's fallacy.

Our skillchain bonus is 23%.

The 95% accuracy thing has always been misleading. You're going to miss the first hit of Rudra's 5% of the time too (god it feels like more). On average, the two weaponskills are affected equally by it. In practice, I know which one causes me to curse when I miss the main hit of it while I almost can't tell the difference with the other.

Cosigned, a la Ukko's.

Whatever happened to parses don't prove anything?


This is another point I'd like to challenge you on. Which situations are these? Granted voidwatch, however the answer becomes less cut and dry with different events that you look at. Alot of old content is now "skewed to favor damage in large bursts" be it abyssea (crit heaven), znm, dynamis bosses, salvage.

Basically anything you can skillchain with would push rudra's in the lead. Assuming what your fighting doesn't have some insane magic resistance, or DD's spamming weaponskills back to back.

Different methods for different situations, I'm not saying that double thokcha Exen doesn't have a place. It most certainly does but however I am just merely pointing out that Rudra's isn't too bad of an option either depending on the situation

edit: grammer and sentences in the wrong places

Bit of a difference between parsing your own accuracy and using a parse against other people in a nonstatic environment to prove an unrelated point, chap.

Can control yourself to find where your own shortcomings are coming from, but you can't control the 17 other people in your alliance that are likely *** up because they're probably bad.

The true answer to this debate is drop the Twashtar and the STR dagger and level BLU.

The majority of rudra's storm comes from the initial hit, which is well known now that the first hit of any weaponskill receives a rather large accuracy boost. While Exen receives the same boost to the initial first hit, the ftp of exen's first hit is 1.0 while rudra's is 3.25

...are you arguing for or against Rudra's Storm? Because Rudra's would be hit severely more by missing the first hit than Exentrator would be.