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E-Piracy Act
Lakshmi.Flavin
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2011-12-22 13:51:17
You're looking for an answer that isn't there. They aren't 'entitled to it', but not being entitled to it doesn't keep me from getting it, I just don't give a ***really. It's true, the stuff I pirate I wouldn't buy anyways, I'm on a very strict budget, so they wouldn't be getting money from me to begin with.. That's not an excuse of why it's okay or justification, it's a simple fact. Strictly speaking in a legal sense it is stealing, but like I said, I don't give a ***. At least you're honest.
Cerberus.Irohuro
サーバ: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6583
By Cerberus.Irohuro 2011-12-22 13:53:44
Now I myself have been in situations where I haven't been able to afford some things I have wanted and you know I just passed on them until I was in a position where I could.
thats not always possible. i had friends in university that were required to have majorly expensive programs, and werent given discounts, and some of the programs they needed werent available on school computers
Lakshmi.Flavin
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2011-12-22 13:55:25
Now I myself have been in situations where I haven't been able to afford some things I have wanted and you know I just passed on them until I was in a position where I could. thats not always possible. i had friends in university that were required to have majorly expensive programs, and werent given discounts, and some of the programs they needed werent available on school computers How are they able to afford university then?
Cerberus.Irohuro
サーバ: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6583
By Cerberus.Irohuro 2011-12-22 13:59:41
Now I myself have been in situations where I haven't been able to afford some things I have wanted and you know I just passed on them until I was in a position where I could. thats not always possible. i had friends in university that were required to have majorly expensive programs, and werent given discounts, and some of the programs they needed werent available on school computers How are they able to afford university then?
just enough scholarships and work study to afford tuition
Lakshmi.Flavin
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2011-12-22 14:03:16
Now I myself have been in situations where I haven't been able to afford some things I have wanted and you know I just passed on them until I was in a position where I could. thats not always possible. i had friends in university that were required to have majorly expensive programs, and werent given discounts, and some of the programs they needed werent available on school computers How are they able to afford university then? just enough scholarships and work study to afford tuition Then the best advice I could give is to put off that class to another semester until you can find some way to afford it or take a small loan to pay for it.
As much as it may suck I just can't look at it and say there is no way because I've seen people make it happen.
Cerberus.Irohuro
サーバ: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6583
By Cerberus.Irohuro 2011-12-22 14:06:15
or pirate it until you can buy it because its *** ridiculous to have to pay $1000 for any program >.>
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サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 33979
By Bismarck.Dracondria 2011-12-22 14:09:08
Or pirate it and don't buy it because it's *** ridiculous to have to pay $1000 for any program
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Carbuncle.Ianpyst
サーバ: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 231
By Carbuncle.Ianpyst 2011-12-22 14:10:03
Now I myself have been in situations where I haven't been able to afford some things I have wanted and you know I just passed on them until I was in a position where I could. thats not always possible. i had friends in university that were required to have majorly expensive programs, and werent given discounts, and some of the programs they needed werent available on school computers How are they able to afford university then? just enough scholarships and work study to afford tuition Then the best advice I could give is to put off that class to another semester until you can find some way to afford it or take a small loan to pay for it.
As much as it may suck I just can't look at it and say there is no way because I've seen people make it happen.
Yeah, that's logical... /rolleyes
So said person should just tack on another year at their college/university if said class is consecutive then?
Your arguing in a debate you cannot win, using loaded questions, and at this point seems more like trolling than anything else.
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By slipispsycho 2011-12-22 14:14:16
They should change their field of study obviously..
Lakshmi.Flavin
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2011-12-22 14:23:28
Why get yourself into something you can't afford in the first place?
Carbuncle.Ianpyst
サーバ: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 231
By Carbuncle.Ianpyst 2011-12-22 14:26:22
Why get yourself into something you can't afford in the first place?
Lakshmi.Flavin
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2011-12-22 14:30:24
Carbuncle.Ianpyst said: » Now I myself have been in situations where I haven't been able to afford some things I have wanted and you know I just passed on them until I was in a position where I could. thats not always possible. i had friends in university that were required to have majorly expensive programs, and werent given discounts, and some of the programs they needed werent available on school computers How are they able to afford university then? just enough scholarships and work study to afford tuition Then the best advice I could give is to put off that class to another semester until you can find some way to afford it or take a small loan to pay for it. As much as it may suck I just can't look at it and say there is no way because I've seen people make it happen. Yeah, that's logical... /rolleyes So said person should just tack on another year at their college/university if said class is consecutive then? Your arguing in a debate you cannot win, using loaded questions, and at this point seems more like trolling than anything else. What's your argument? Hey if I feel this isn't worth what they're charging I'll just steal it instead. yeah... As for adding another semester of classes they should plan ahead. I'm sure the cirruiculum is posted and the materials needed to complete the class shouldn't be a mystery. I've been through school and seen many get by on almost nothing and they didn't have to steal to do it so it can be done.
I'm personally waiting for my generation to start all their businesses and then just give away their product for free to everyone who wants it but doesn't want to buy it and then counting on those willing to buy it to keep their business afloat.
For those of you that think $1,000 is too much for a product, well this is what the market allows that product to go for. I'm not sure what it is so I can't really compare it to anything or check to see if it has any competitors.
Carbuncle.Ianpyst
サーバ: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 231
By Carbuncle.Ianpyst 2011-12-22 14:31:01
Edit: Damn crappy connection.
Caitsith.Sai
サーバ: Caitsith
Game: FFXI
Posts: 702
By Caitsith.Sai 2011-12-22 14:31:14
So tell me what entitles you to be able to have these products without paying for them? Why do others have to pay while you think well this is why I don't have to, deal with it?
Others have to pay because they either arent smart enough, are too lazy or restrict themselves by there own ethics/morals.
Since I do have the knowledge, dont want to spend the money, and could give two craps about ethics/morals I get it for free while you pay.
The companies you are defending didnt become the giant multimillon dollar corps by acting like you do, they became what they are by acting like I do. You take advantage of the situation as much as possible or you fall in line. Either is cool IMO, Im just one way and you another.
Lakshmi.Flavin
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2011-12-22 14:31:44
Carbuncle.Ianpyst said: »Why get yourself into something you can't afford in the first place?  [/quote]
Says the guy that can't even properly post a pic and a quote a single time correctly... lol...
Carbuncle.Ianpyst
サーバ: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 231
By Carbuncle.Ianpyst 2011-12-22 14:33:18
Carbuncle.Ianpyst said: »Why get yourself into something you can't afford in the first place?  Says the guy that can't even properly post a pic and a quote a single time correctly... lol...
Yes, my mental capacity is dictated by my internet connection (or lack thereof).
Ragnarok.Nausi
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2011-12-22 14:36:01
Whether you're hurting anyone or not is another subject altogether and depends on who you talk to how that is answered. You're breaking the law and you're stealing something. It's not like you're even denying that you know its wrong but you do it anyways. Its like hey that guy robbed a bank and took 100k but the bank is federally protected for more than that so we should just let him go! I know its a stark comparison but a crime is a crime. It just doesn't make sense to me that people are ok stealing digital copies but not physical copies... or that its just easier to steal digital copies (lower chance of getting caught). It makes a lot of sense, actually. It's not even close to the same thing. If I walk into a store and steal a DVD, not only do I get the DVD for free, but that DVD is gone, they cannot sell that to another customer because it no longer exists in the store. If I download a song, it doesn't stop existing. It doesn't make a CD disappear off a shelf in a store so that it can no longer be sold to anyone else. Stealing something physical from a store and illegally downloading something are two totally different things. So you're saying stealing something in digital form, as long as the base of what you steal still remains, makes it ok? What if you went into a store and made a copy of the CD and left the CD that was originally there right on the shelf?
It always amazes me the lengths people will go through to justify their theft of others intellectual property. I mean we all know we all have done it before. Just don't kid yourself into thinking it isn't theft, and it isn't criminal.
Someone earlier said that they had owned (and lost in a fire) a few vintage NES/SNES cartridge game. They were (hypothetically) attempting to rationalize that because they had owned them before at one point in history, that fact entitled them to download them off the internet, and play them using emulator software. When Sony or Nintendo or SE sells you a game cartridge, they are only selling you a game cartridge. If you break it or otherwise destroy it, you're SOL, and would need to buy it again, unless otherwise notified. You are not entitled to a new copy of something simply due to the fact that you bought one previously. If you think this is unfair I have a simple solution for you. Don't buy the product.
If I want to sell you something, shouldn't I have every right to sell you whatever I want to? Weather that means you can use play this music song file only 100 times, or as many times as you want and I'll replace it for free if its damaged or destroyed. Why can't I sell you what ever I want to and you can choose to buy it or not buy it if you want to? What on earth is wrong with that system? [/spoiler]
You can't really feel bad for playing on an emulator for NES/SNES games when all Nintendo does is throw the original ROM up on the Wii store with no updates, online multiplayer or achievements.
This is what companies like Valve are talking about when they say that piracy is a service problem.
"In an interview for the University of Cambridge's school newspaper, Newell said that the way to end piracy is to provide a service that's more complete than cracked software, and that restrictive DRM only encourages more piracy.
"We think there is a fundamental misconception about piracy. Piracy is almost always a service problem and not a pricing problem," he said. "If a pirate offers a product anywhere in the world, 24 x 7, purchasable from the convenience of your personal computer, and the legal provider says the product is region-locked, will come to your country 3 months after the US release, and can only be purchased at a brick and mortar store, then the pirate's service is more valuable."
The proof is in the proverbial pudding. "Prior to entering the Russian market, we were told that Russia was a waste of time because everyone would pirate our products. Russia is now about to become [Steam's] largest market in Europe," Newell said."
If Nintendo released Super Mario Bros 1 with achievements, a new level or 2 and online multiplayer so I could play it with a friend over the internet, I would pay them 10 dollars for it in a heartbeat.
But just the ROM for 10 bucks? That is a slap in the face. Especially since they put in zero effort to make money on a game they have already made a buttload off of.
...denial.
You do realize that your entire post is just a rant about how you're entitled to steal their stuff because they've made too much money on it already. I mean I don't necessarily disagree with you that 10 bucks for a 30 year old game that I already bought once before is kinda a shitty deal. But how about if you don't want to pay 10 bucks for it, don't buy it (and don't steal it either)?
Do you recognize that Nintendo owns that franchise and has the right to sell you any bits or pieces of that franchise on their own terms?
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サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2027
By Odin.Daemun 2011-12-22 14:37:03
Carbuncle.Ianpyst said: »Why get yourself into something you can't afford in the first place?  [/ quote]
Says the guy that can't even properly post a pic and a quote a single time correctly... lol... Pot. Kettle. Black.
Taking no sides here, just wanted to point out the irony.
Lakshmi.Flavin
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2011-12-22 14:39:15
Carbuncle.Ianpyst said: »Why get yourself into something you can't afford in the first place?  [/b][/ quote] Says the guy that can't even properly post a pic and a quote a single time correctly... lol... Pot. Kettle. Black. Taking no sides here, just wanted to point out the irony. That was actually part of his. and the fact that you posted it the same way...
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2027
By Odin.Daemun 2011-12-22 14:40:12
Carbuncle.Ianpyst said: »Why get yourself into something you can't afford in the first place?  [/b][/ quote] Says the guy that can't even properly post a pic and a quote a single time correctly... lol... Pot. Kettle. Black. Taking no sides here, just wanted to point out the irony. That was actually part of his. Well, it was still funny. It also took me 3 edits to make it display properly. Someone had it all messed up.
Lakshmi.Flavin
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2011-12-22 14:41:45
Carbuncle.Ianpyst said: »Why get yourself into something you can't afford in the first place?  [/b][/ quote] Says the guy that can't even properly post a pic and a quote a single time correctly... lol... Pot. Kettle. Black. Taking no sides here, just wanted to point out the irony. That was actually part of his. Well, it was still funny. It also took me 3 edits to make it display properly. Someone had it all messed up. that was my point lol.
Carbuncle.Ianpyst
サーバ: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 231
By Carbuncle.Ianpyst 2011-12-22 14:43:06
Wait, so now were on to me somehow /quoting wrong? Woop-di-do. I quoted that one line twice in my original post, but that ending /quote wasn't me.
Anyway, congratulations on a successful derail of this thread Flavin.
Lakshmi.Flavin
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2011-12-22 14:54:30
Carbuncle.Ianpyst said: »Wait, so now were on to me somehow /quoting wrong? Woop-di-do. I quoted that one line twice in my original post, but that ending /quote wasn't me. Anyway, congratulations on a successful derail of this thread Flavin. Yeah, because posting a picture attempting to insult me is promoting fruitful debate and discussion on the topic. I have an opposing view of which you don't agree with and you then reply with an insult. I guess I am just as bad though for pointing out that you can't even do that correctly (or just blame it on your connection).
Caitsith.Sai
サーバ: Caitsith
Game: FFXI
Posts: 702
By Caitsith.Sai 2011-12-22 14:55:42
Why get yourself into something you can't afford in the first place?
I don't know if arguing the validity of the cost of higher education is a fight you really want to take up.
Why should I have any issues w/a stealing from those who steal from me?
Inb4 2 wrongs.
Our system of life is not setup on doing whats right or wrong, its setup on doing whats best for yourself period. Does that suck? Yes. Is it going to change? Not likely.
Lakshmi.Flavin
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2011-12-22 14:58:18
Why get yourself into something you can't afford in the first place? I don't know if arguing the validity of the cost of higher education is a fight you really want to take up. Why should I have any issues w/a stealing from those who steal from me? Inb4 2 wrongs. Our system of life is not setup on doing whats right or wrong, its setup on doing whats best for yourself period. Does that suck? Yes. Is it going to change? Not likely. So rather than taking an active role in leading the way for change or accountability we should simply sit back, accept how things are and continue on solely with selfish pursuits?
Edit: Also, by that logic, you really have no problem with the way corporations act because like everyone else, as you say, they're only doing what's best for themselves.
Caitsith.Sai
サーバ: Caitsith
Game: FFXI
Posts: 702
By Caitsith.Sai 2011-12-22 15:11:06
Why get yourself into something you can't afford in the first place? I don't know if arguing the validity of the cost of higher education is a fight you really want to take up. Why should I have any issues w/a stealing from those who steal from me? Inb4 2 wrongs. Our system of life is not setup on doing whats right or wrong, its setup on doing whats best for yourself period. Does that suck? Yes. Is it going to change? Not likely. So rather than taking an active role in leading the way for change or accountability we should simply sit back, accept how things are and continue on solely with selfish pursuits?
Short answer is yes.
Idealism is cool, but rarely if ever intersects with reality.
Human nature hasn't changed in the thousands of years since we showed up, and a few people making a stand on petty theft isnt going to be the catalyst of a new revolution in human behavior.
My life is short, Im going to get what I can, when I can in the easiest and cheapest way possible. Welcome to the human race.
The profitability of someone else's corp is none of my concern.
When my profitability is affected then I will care, and hopefully if its truly as big a problem as everyone makes it out to be, I 'll be smart enough to work around it.
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3
By Lakshmi.Schwertzauberer 2011-12-22 16:42:49
I appreciate your moral stand Flavin. Sitting here, I'm reminded that I still owe a few bucks to some people from the ol' Napster/Torrent/IRC days.
Edit:
69 cents on iTunes, right on!
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2027
By Odin.Daemun 2011-12-22 17:03:43
Lakshmi.Schwertzauberer said: »I appreciate your moral stand Flavin. Sitting here, I'm reminded that I still owe a few bucks to some people from the ol' Napster/Torrent/IRC days.
Edit:
69 cents on iTunes, right on! If they ever decide to pursue, you'd probably owe a few hundred million because of your Napster days. At least that was the case for a handful of 14 year olds...
I don't know if this has been posted anywhere on this website yet but I just found out about this today. If you live in America take this law seriously, because if it passes it will be the end of the internet. Please read this petition and sign it.
"This post is to simply provide a link to the petition for this new act that is proposed for Americans. I simply ask that all Americans please help by signing this.
This act and its kin, SOPA and PIPA, would effectively give content providers and copyright holders control over the policing of the Internet. It would also institute a "Great Firewall of America" similar to China's which would be capable of censoring content from US citizens. This is not the right way to end piracy, and we need to let the Obama Administration know that we want nothing to do with E-PARASITE."
"This bill, if passed and signed, will spell the end of tons of similar anime sites (perhaps even including this), deviantART, MAL, Facebook, YouTube, Google and the Internet as we know it. This bill will do more harm than good. "
Source: Your text to link here...
Petition: Your text to link here...
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