What Is The Answer To This Math Problem?

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2010-06-21
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What is the answer to this math problem?
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 Alexander.Xgalahadx
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By Alexander.Xgalahadx 2011-04-10 20:08:10  
Cerberus.Irohuro said:

_______________
048
+240
_______________
Right answer but what's the point of this step?
 Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2011-04-10 20:09:44  
I've tried Turbo Pascal, Turbo C++, Qbaisc and True basic and all of them say 288.
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 Alexander.Odaka
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By Alexander.Odaka 2011-04-10 20:11:05  
four pages on a thread like this...jesus christ this is stupid lol
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 Cerberus.Irohuro
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By Cerberus.Irohuro 2011-04-10 20:11:32  
Alexander.Xgalahadx said:
Cerberus.Irohuro said:

_______________
048
+240
_______________
Right answer but what's the point of this step?

im rusty on my maths
 Bahamut.Jetackuu
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By Bahamut.Jetackuu 2011-04-11 00:18:09  
I redid the problem when I got home and as written (with improper notation, therefore being an improper problem, but whatever) the answer would come out to be 288.

I was doing it in my head at work from my phone, forgive.

P.S. for shame for Casio and TI for not programming their calculators right (or at least consistent)
 Unicorn.Tarowyn
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By Unicorn.Tarowyn 2011-04-11 00:39:42  
After looking around some, found this interesting reference

http://mathforum.org/library/drmath/view/57021.html

Unfortunately most of the linked references don't seem to work anymore since the post is like 11 years old, lol. It certainly shows that at SOME point, the 2 interpretation would be correct.

The real answer is the guy who originally wrote this was just trying to troll people by writing it in a purpopsefully ambigiuous manner.
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 Bahamut.Jetackuu
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By Bahamut.Jetackuu 2011-04-11 01:20:40  
I like that article Tarowyn, I wonder if there's been any luck in getting a set rule established.

I would say it's easier though to just throw up more parenthesis to be 100% but hey that's me.
 Caitsith.Madmaxximist
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By Caitsith.Madmaxximist 2011-04-11 01:29:18  
P arenthesis
E xponent
M ultiplication
D ivision
A ddition
S ubtraction

48/2(9+3) --> 48/2(12) --> 48/24 = 2

Solve inside parenthesis is ALWAYS first, then anything with an exponent. Mulitplication and division are next but go in order of which comes first in equation from left to right. After all that, addition and subtraction come first and in order of which comes first, just like with multiplication or division.
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 Caitsith.Madmaxximist
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By Caitsith.Madmaxximist 2011-04-11 01:35:15  
Oh and btw, calculators can be fooled, this is how it is written:

48 x (1/2) x [1/(9+3)] = 2

Anything in the denominator is 1 over the number,always.
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 Sylph.Citrelautame
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By Sylph.Citrelautame 2011-04-11 01:36:52  
wow did anyone actually cover math in school??? i kno some of you have to have jobs related to computers which require massive amount of math, in just my 2hr degree im up to calc 2, this is like grade 3 ***...its 288 w/o a doubt end of story...only reason at all that you might get the answer 2 is do to improper notations and horriable teaching of the math cycle but even then you should arrive w/ the answer of 288...just like add/subtract, mult/divide is done left to right
 Cerberus.Irohuro
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By Cerberus.Irohuro 2011-04-11 01:37:14  
Caitsith.Madmaxximist said:
P arenthesis
E xponent
M ultiplication
D ivision
A ddition
S ubtraction

48/2(9+3) --> 48/2(12) --> 48/24 = 2

Solve inside parenthesis is ALWAYS first, then anything with an exponent. Mulitplication and division are next but go in order of which comes first in equation from left to right. After all that, addition and subtraction come first and in order of which comes first, just like with multiplication or division.

which you obviously didnt do, or else you wouldnt have gotten 48/12
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 Phoenix.Kirana
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By Phoenix.Kirana 2011-04-11 01:37:53  
Caitsith.Madmaxximist said:
P arenthesis
E xponent
M ultiplication
D ivision
A ddition
S ubtraction

48/2(9+3) --> 48/2(12) --> 48/24 = 2

Solve inside parenthesis is ALWAYS first, then anything with an exponent. Mulitplication and division are next but go in order of which comes first in equation from left to right. After all that, addition and subtraction come first and in order of which comes first, just like with multiplication or division.

You went from right to left in your solution.

Either way, I request the OP to write the equation in RPN.
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 Unicorn.Moldtech
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By Unicorn.Moldtech 2011-04-11 01:42:01  
Multiplication comes first. The answer is indeed 2.

EDIT: Not only multiplication but with this problem it's a set of brackets that need to be eliminated which come before everything.
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 Unicorn.Tarowyn
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By Unicorn.Tarowyn 2011-04-11 01:42:05  
Bahamut.Jetackuu said:
I like that article Tarowyn, I wonder if there's been any luck in getting a set rule established. I would say it's easier though to just throw up more parenthesis to be 100% but hey that's me.
I kind of doubt it, in a way it's a lot like any other language, where what is correct can change over time as the language evolves. And mathmeticians just don't seem the type of people to really care enough about this kind of stuff to put it down in writing anyways, lol.

Technically, I'd say either parentheses or just using explicit multiplication is the correct thing to do in this case.
 Cerberus.Irohuro
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By Cerberus.Irohuro 2011-04-11 01:51:59  
copied from an instructional site:

Example 3: Evaluate 9 - 5 ÷ (8 - 3) x 2 + 6 using the order of operations.

Solution:
Step 1: 9 - 5 ÷ (8 - 3) x 2 + 6 = 9 - 5 ÷ 5 x 2 + 6 Parentheses
Step 2: 9 - 5 ÷ 5 x 2 + 6 = 9 - 1 x 2 + 6 Division
Step 3: 9 - 1 x 2 + 6 = 9 - 2 + 6 Multiplication
Step 4: 9 - 2 + 6 = 7 + 6 Subtraction
Step 5: 7 + 6 = 13 Addition

In Examples 2 and 3, you will notice that multiplication and division were evaluated from left to right according to Rule 2. Similarly, addition and subtraction were evaluated from left to right, according to Rule 3.
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 Caitsith.Madmaxximist
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By Caitsith.Madmaxximist 2011-04-11 01:52:18  
Cerberus.Irohuro said:
Caitsith.Madmaxximist said:
P arenthesis
E xponent
M ultiplication
D ivision
A ddition
S ubtraction

48/2(9+3) --> 48/2(12) --> 48/24 = 2

Solve inside parenthesis is ALWAYS first, then anything with an exponent. Mulitplication and division are next but go in order of which comes first in equation from left to right. After all that, addition and subtraction come first and in order of which comes first, just like with multiplication or division.

which you obviously didnt do, or else you wouldnt have gotten 48/12
It IS (48/2) x [1/(9+3)] where did the two go? you conveniently dropped it.

Let's talk about Calculus for a min:

dy/dx = y/x(9+3) for example,
you could try to take the derivative of this as a fraction, but you're in for some hell. OR, you can rewrite it as
dy/dx = (y/x)[(1/(9+3)] = (yx^-1)(1/12),
same thing in order of operations.
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 Unicorn.Moldtech
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By Unicorn.Moldtech 2011-04-11 01:52:58  
A numerator of 26 and a denominator of 3 is also an answer 26/3

If you distribute the 2 in the parethisis to eliminated it then you have 48/18+6 which = 8.666666666667 in fraction form 26/3
 Ifrit.Airius
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By Ifrit.Airius 2011-04-11 01:54:06  
This is a logic problem. You were given false logic where the denominator was not clearly defined and expected to get a correct answer when there is none.
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 Unicorn.Moldtech
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By Unicorn.Moldtech 2011-04-11 01:55:13  
Ifrit.Airius said:
This is a logic problem. You were given false logic where the denominator was not clearly defined and expected to get a correct answer when there is none.

The solution is there is no solution? :o
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 Phoenix.Kirana
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By Phoenix.Kirana 2011-04-11 02:00:14  
Unicorn.Moldtech said:
Ifrit.Airius said:
This is a logic problem. You were given false logic where the denominator was not clearly defined and expected to get a correct answer when there is none.

The solution is there is no solution? :o

There are two possible solutions, the rules with which to process the infix notation are not given, therefor we must assume a set of rules, or we cannot determine the correct solution.

The best way would be to just write it in RPN(postfix) or prefix notation.
 Ifrit.Airius
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By Ifrit.Airius 2011-04-11 02:00:48  
Pretty much. As for the PEMDAS rule many Mathematicians and Engineers find exceptions around it such as multiplying through parenthesis. Keep in mind it's a rule meant to guide elementary school kids not a mathematical law
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 Gilgamesh.Meldity
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By Gilgamesh.Meldity 2011-04-11 02:01:34  
I find it a little funny people aren't arguing over a more difficult problem.. and even more scary that most people are still getting this wrong.
 Unicorn.Moldtech
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By Unicorn.Moldtech 2011-04-11 02:03:05  
I'm sticking with my 26/3 -.-

EDIT: or 2
EDIT: or 288
 Phoenix.Kirana
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By Phoenix.Kirana 2011-04-11 02:03:29  
Gilgamesh.Meldity said:
I find it a little funny people aren't arguing over a more difficult problem.. and even more scary that most people are still getting this wrong.

No one is "getting it wrong" per se. They are just using a different set of rules to solve it. OP did not supply the rules with which the problem should be solved, so there are two "correct" answers.
 Ifrit.Airius
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By Ifrit.Airius 2011-04-11 02:03:42  
Next unanswerable problem: the Montey Hall 3 doors!
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 Sylph.Oddin
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By Sylph.Oddin 2011-04-11 02:10:11  
Solve the problem, save the world.

Also, I give this another 2 pages tops before it devolves into bickering, name-calling and flat out flaming. Prove me wrong FFXIAH. Prove me wrong.
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 Cerberus.Irohuro
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By Cerberus.Irohuro 2011-04-11 02:22:37  
Sylph.Oddin said:
Solve the problem, save the world.

Also, I give this another 2 pages tops before it devolves into bickering, name-calling and flat out flaming. Prove me wrong FFXIAH. Prove me wrong.

you're wrong and you suck and should feel bad
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By moyo 2011-04-11 03:03:15  
there is no answer because the question is wrong. unless you use brackets the question is undefined, or if you wrote it down you could make it look more obvious as to the order that the functions are in. untill you do this there is no answer because its not a proper question

also i thought this was appropriate ^^
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 Gilgamesh.Etherstorm
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By Gilgamesh.Etherstorm 2011-04-11 03:32:32  
Its 42
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 Odin.Godofgods
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By Odin.Godofgods 2011-04-11 10:29:08  
you people realy need to go back to elementry school and relearn what the order of operations actuly are. Some of your math skills are worse then my spelling skills.

While the order of opperations are indeed PEMDAS, their broken into groups. PE-MD-AS. As a group you do them in order. But withing the group you do them as you come across them. So while Perenthsis are done before subtraction, their not nessacerly done before exponent. With in each group you do them as you come across them.

To further clarify, you start with the first group PE, run through the problem doing both of those as u come across them. THEN you move on to the 2nd group MD. Do them both as u come across them. THEN move on to the 3rd group AS, and do those two as you come across them.


And btw, unless your using a mroe advanced calculator such as the graphing clacs or better, it wont give you the answer your looking for because all basic calculators do each problem/peice as they are entered. They have no order of operation.
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