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Is there a point in PLD anymore?
 Fenrir.Yinsha
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 263
By Fenrir.Yinsha 2010-10-09 22:29:19
Bahamut.Aiyana said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Serj said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Paladins are still useful for things that spam Magic and Elemental weaponskills/damage. /thread
*** that. Whm tanks are the way to go for that! When WHM obtains access to Aegis and Blessed gear +1 without -enmity let me know.
+/- enmity has no real bearing on enmity generation. It helps, but it is not necessary when tanking.. (Outdated idea. Apparently this is pointless with DDs just raping the ***out of everything.) More enmity can be gained with just having capped recasts and spamming medium-high enmity actions as fast as possible. I think in the case of whm, a Yagrush and tightly-packed group are required to tank with spamming -na spells for enmity... Or perhaps Cure VI cheats with lolAbyssea hp/mp ratios.
What exactly does Aegis have to do with anything? Now, I'm not exactly sure what gear whm can wear to cap -MDT (Which is ALL Aegis is good for.) but it shouldn't be that hard. (And IS possible with ***like D.ring/Minerva's Ring/Vallus grip.)
Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra
サーバ: Quetzalcoatl
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3987
By Quetzalcoatl.Sectumsempra 2010-10-09 22:31:06
Don't forget, WHM has a capped stoneskin, more haste, and more fast cast.
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11681
By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2010-10-09 22:31:45
Phoenix.Excelior said: When I fight temperance I duo it as pld and rdm. What do you do? Solo it with cor or smn? I don't lol, haven't fought it since 75 cap. Was just curious how that fight goes these days.
Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Serj said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Paladins are still useful for things that spam Magic and Elemental weaponskills/damage. /thread
*** that. Whm tanks are the way to go for that! When WHM obtains access to Aegis and Blessed gear +1 without -enmity let me know.
Aegis is mad good bro. Can't cap MDT without it!
Bahamut.Dasva said: Blu is the best job at getting hate without giving any and arguably the best when casting dmg spells too.
And has a survivability that is just below rdm. ^
 Bahamut.Dasva
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13835
By Bahamut.Dasva 2010-10-09 22:31:49
Whm really needs a mythic weapon though
Bahamut.Aiyana
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 235
By Bahamut.Aiyana 2010-10-09 22:32:38
Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Aiyana said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Serj said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Paladins are still useful for things that spam Magic and Elemental weaponskills/damage. /thread
*** that. Whm tanks are the way to go for that! When WHM obtains access to Aegis and Blessed gear +1 without -enmity let me know.
+/- enmity has no real bearing on enmity generation. It helps, but it is not necessary when tanking.. (Outdated idea. Apparently this is pointless with DDs just raping the ***out of everything.) More enmity can be gained with just having capped recasts and spamming medium-high enmity actions as fast as possible. I think in the case of whm, a Yagrush and tightly-packed group are required to tank with spamming -na spells for enmity... Or perhaps Cure VI cheats with lolAbyssea hp/mp ratios.
What exactly does Aegis have to do with anything? Now, I'm not exactly sure what gear whm can wear to cap -MDT (Which is ALL Aegis is good for.) but it shouldn't be that hard. (And IS possible with ***like D.ring/Minerva's Ring/Vallus grip.)
Congratulations on selective reading. You aren't worth the time or energy, as you won't even read an argument.
You skimmed the first sentence of my response and assume I didn't continue further.
Bahamut.Dasva
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13835
By Bahamut.Dasva 2010-10-09 22:32:38
Fenrir.Nightfyre said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Serj said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Paladins are still useful for things that spam Magic and Elemental weaponskills/damage. /thread *** that. Whm tanks are the way to go for that! When WHM obtains access to Aegis and Blessed gear +1 without -enmity let me know. Aegis is mad good bro. Can't cap MDT without it! You mean you can't cap it from gear only without it. You can however quite easily cap it with shell IV/V on. And since they are counted together all aegis really lets you do is put as much MDB and idk int in every other slot
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11681
By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2010-10-09 22:33:59
Bahamut.Dasva said: You mean you can't cap it from gear only without it. You can however quite easily cap it with shell IV/V on No, I mean what I said (or rather, I don't~). You're going to have some form of Shell when tanking, so that's really a nonissue.
Bahamut.Dasva
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13835
By Bahamut.Dasva 2010-10-09 22:35:55
Fenrir.Nightfyre said: Bahamut.Dasva said: You mean you can't cap it from gear only without it. You can however quite easily cap it with shell IV/V on No, I mean what I said (or rather, I don't~). You're going to have some form of Shell when tanking, so that's really a nonissue. That was my nice way of saying YOU IS WRONG!
 Fenrir.Snick
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 906
By Fenrir.Snick 2010-10-09 22:37:12
It's comforting to know Yinsha is just as stupid as always.
Continue though.
Bahamut.Aiyana
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 235
By Bahamut.Aiyana 2010-10-09 22:37:23
It isn't like WHM has a native Shell V, and PLD has a native Shell IV. I mean if you had an AEGIS you don't need to cast shell! I mean, what if it gets DISPELLED or some ***?
EDIT: For the love of god I hope this sarcasm is obvious.
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11681
By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2010-10-09 22:38:09
Bahamut.Dasva said: Fenrir.Nightfyre said: Bahamut.Dasva said: You mean you can't cap it from gear only without it. You can however quite easily cap it with shell IV/V on No, I mean what I said (or rather, I don't~). You're going to have some form of Shell when tanking, so that's really a nonissue. That was my nice way of saying YOU IS WRONG!
Why you hatin on my sarcasm bro? Especially since I was obviously talking about WITH SHELL given that we're *** talking about tanking here. Whether you can cap without Shell is completely irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
Fenrir.Yinsha
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 263
By Fenrir.Yinsha 2010-10-09 22:41:56
Bahamut.Aiyana said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Aiyana said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Serj said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Paladins are still useful for things that spam Magic and Elemental weaponskills/damage. /thread
*** that. Whm tanks are the way to go for that! When WHM obtains access to Aegis and Blessed gear +1 without -enmity let me know.
+/- enmity has no real bearing on enmity generation. It helps, but it is not necessary when tanking.. (Outdated idea. Apparently this is pointless with DDs just raping the ***out of everything.) More enmity can be gained with just having capped recasts and spamming medium-high enmity actions as fast as possible. I think in the case of whm, a Yagrush and tightly-packed group are required to tank with spamming -na spells for enmity... Or perhaps Cure VI cheats with lolAbyssea hp/mp ratios.
What exactly does Aegis have to do with anything? Now, I'm not exactly sure what gear whm can wear to cap -MDT (Which is ALL Aegis is good for.) but it shouldn't be that hard. (And IS possible with ***like D.ring/Minerva's Ring/Vallus grip.)
Congratulations on selective reading. You aren't worth the time or energy, as you won't even read an argument.
You skimmed the first sentence of my response and assume I didn't continue further. No, I read it. There is no point to WHM tanking unless it can out tank PLD or other jobs.
Bahamut.Dasva
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13835
By Bahamut.Dasva 2010-10-09 22:42:47
Fenrir.Nightfyre said: Bahamut.Dasva said: Fenrir.Nightfyre said: Bahamut.Dasva said: You mean you can't cap it from gear only without it. You can however quite easily cap it with shell IV/V on No, I mean what I said (or rather, I don't~). You're going to have some form of Shell when tanking, so that's really a nonissue. That was my nice way of saying YOU IS WRONG! Why you hatin on my sarcasm bro? Especially since I was obviously talking about WITH SHELL given that we're *** talking about tanking here. Whether you can cap without Shell is completely irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Your sarcasm didn't didn't have the proper tags on it!
Fenrir.Snick
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 906
By Fenrir.Snick 2010-10-09 22:42:58
Why have WHM tank? Why have anything but MNK tank?
You guys are really wasting your time here.
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11681
By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2010-10-09 22:43:52
Needs more
?
Bahamut.Serj
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6179
By Bahamut.Serj 2010-10-09 22:45:54
Wow, my semi-witty and sarcastic comment got all of this going.
Phoenix.Excelior
サーバ: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2093
By Phoenix.Excelior 2010-10-09 22:45:59
Nightfyre how the *** do you know anything? You only have 85 Blu. Noob
Sorry I just wanted to do that; its been awhile.
Fenrir.Snick
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 906
By Fenrir.Snick 2010-10-09 22:47:00
I make him go BLM to events though. No way I'm gonna play with a *** BLU.
Quetzalcoatl.Giazz
サーバ: Quetzalcoatl
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1308
By Quetzalcoatl.Giazz 2010-10-09 22:47:57
Hey don't be hating on BLU!
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11681
By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2010-10-09 22:48:27
Phoenix.Excelior said: Nightfyre how the *** do you know anything? You only have 85 Blu. Noob
Sorry I just wanted to do that; its been awhile. ilu
RDM's actually been 85 for a week or so and DNC will be once I get off my *** and get some dagger trials done ._.; Never use DRG, not really worried about getting it to 85 in the near future.
 Ragnarok.Corres
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1217
By Ragnarok.Corres 2010-10-09 22:49:03
Quetzalcoatl.Giazz said: Hey don't be hating on BLU! but but..... they are so...... blue.
.....not anymore with Af3, but still.
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11681
By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2010-10-09 22:49:28
Fenrir.Snick said: I make him go BLM to events though. No way I'm gonna play with a *** BLU. You *** lol.
Bahamut.Dasva
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13835
By Bahamut.Dasva 2010-10-09 22:50:11
Phoenix.Excelior said: Nightfyre how the *** do you know anything? You only have 85 Blu. Noob Sorry I just wanted to do that; its been awhile. Cause blu is the best tank!
Bahamut.Aiyana
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 235
By Bahamut.Aiyana 2010-10-09 22:52:36
Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Aiyana said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Aiyana said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Serj said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Paladins are still useful for things that spam Magic and Elemental weaponskills/damage. /thread
*** that. Whm tanks are the way to go for that! When WHM obtains access to Aegis and Blessed gear +1 without -enmity let me know.
+/- enmity has no real bearing on enmity generation. It helps, but it is not necessary when tanking.. (Outdated idea. Apparently this is pointless with DDs just raping the ***out of everything.) More enmity can be gained with just having capped recasts and spamming medium-high enmity actions as fast as possible. I think in the case of whm, a Yagrush and tightly-packed group are required to tank with spamming -na spells for enmity... Or perhaps Cure VI cheats with lolAbyssea hp/mp ratios.
What exactly does Aegis have to do with anything? Now, I'm not exactly sure what gear whm can wear to cap -MDT (Which is ALL Aegis is good for.) but it shouldn't be that hard. (And IS possible with ***like D.ring/Minerva's Ring/Vallus grip.)
Congratulations on selective reading. You aren't worth the time or energy, as you won't even read an argument.
You skimmed the first sentence of my response and assume I didn't continue further. No, I read it. There is no point to WHM tanking unless it can out tank PLD or other jobs.
Who said it couldn't? WHM puts out a LOT of enmity with AoE-na and Yagrush. (Which I mentioned if you had actually read that.) I haven't done the math, but I would speculate it kicks the ***out of PLD without Sentinel. (For mobs with hate reset.)
Bahamut.Dasva
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13835
By Bahamut.Dasva 2010-10-09 23:00:22
All I gotta say is Diffusion Exuviation
Fenrir.Yinsha
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 263
By Fenrir.Yinsha 2010-10-09 23:01:04
Bahamut.Aiyana said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Aiyana said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Aiyana said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Serj said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Paladins are still useful for things that spam Magic and Elemental weaponskills/damage. /thread
*** that. Whm tanks are the way to go for that! When WHM obtains access to Aegis and Blessed gear +1 without -enmity let me know.
+/- enmity has no real bearing on enmity generation. It helps, but it is not necessary when tanking.. (Outdated idea. Apparently this is pointless with DDs just raping the ***out of everything.) More enmity can be gained with just having capped recasts and spamming medium-high enmity actions as fast as possible. I think in the case of whm, a Yagrush and tightly-packed group are required to tank with spamming -na spells for enmity... Or perhaps Cure VI cheats with lolAbyssea hp/mp ratios.
What exactly does Aegis have to do with anything? Now, I'm not exactly sure what gear whm can wear to cap -MDT (Which is ALL Aegis is good for.) but it shouldn't be that hard. (And IS possible with ***like D.ring/Minerva's Ring/Vallus grip.)
Congratulations on selective reading. You aren't worth the time or energy, as you won't even read an argument.
You skimmed the first sentence of my response and assume I didn't continue further. No, I read it. There is no point to WHM tanking unless it can out tank PLD or other jobs.
Who said it couldn't? WHM puts out a LOT of enmity with AoE-na and Yagrush. (Which I mentioned if you had actually read that.) I haven't done the math, but I would speculate it kicks the ***out of PLD without Sentinel. (For mobs with hate reset.) Lack of HP, Shield Mastery, Rampart, Sentinel, Shield Bash? PLD can easily cap MDT and use other gear such as resistance or MDB aswell. I'm not saying WHM can't tank but it sure isn't safer.
Bahamut.Aiyana
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 235
By Bahamut.Aiyana 2010-10-09 23:01:17
Bahamut.Dasva said: All I gotta say is Diffusion Exuviation
Freaking BLUs. /cry
Someday I will be one of you. Maybe.. I wish. Not likely.
Bahamut.Dasva
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13835
By Bahamut.Dasva 2010-10-09 23:04:37
Also whms need mythic to tank effectively
Bahamut.Dasva
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13835
By Bahamut.Dasva 2010-10-09 23:05:00
Bahamut.Aiyana said: Bahamut.Dasva said: All I gotta say is Diffusion Exuviation Freaking BLUs. /cry Someday I will be one of you. Maybe.. I wish. Not likely. I could use a blu duo partner as long as you dont suck
Bahamut.Aiyana
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 235
By Bahamut.Aiyana 2010-10-09 23:05:38
Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Aiyana said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Aiyana said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Aiyana said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Bahamut.Serj said: Fenrir.Yinsha said: Paladins are still useful for things that spam Magic and Elemental weaponskills/damage. /thread
*** that. Whm tanks are the way to go for that! When WHM obtains access to Aegis and Blessed gear +1 without -enmity let me know.
+/- enmity has no real bearing on enmity generation. It helps, but it is not necessary when tanking.. (Outdated idea. Apparently this is pointless with DDs just raping the ***out of everything.) More enmity can be gained with just having capped recasts and spamming medium-high enmity actions as fast as possible. I think in the case of whm, a Yagrush and tightly-packed group are required to tank with spamming -na spells for enmity... Or perhaps Cure VI cheats with lolAbyssea hp/mp ratios.
What exactly does Aegis have to do with anything? Now, I'm not exactly sure what gear whm can wear to cap -MDT (Which is ALL Aegis is good for.) but it shouldn't be that hard. (And IS possible with ***like D.ring/Minerva's Ring/Vallus grip.)
Congratulations on selective reading. You aren't worth the time or energy, as you won't even read an argument.
You skimmed the first sentence of my response and assume I didn't continue further. No, I read it. There is no point to WHM tanking unless it can out tank PLD or other jobs.
Who said it couldn't? WHM puts out a LOT of enmity with AoE-na and Yagrush. (Which I mentioned if you had actually read that.) I haven't done the math, but I would speculate it kicks the ***out of PLD without Sentinel. (For mobs with hate reset.) Lack of HP, Shield Mastery, Rampart, Sentinel, Shield Bash? PLD can easily cap MDT and use other gear such as resistance or MDB aswell. I'm not saying WHM can't tank but it sure isn't safer.
In order:
Normal, non-tank WHMs have HP sets. Atma says hi.
Aquaveil > Shield Mastery. Try again.
Stoneskin > Rampart. Try again.
Sentinel. Okay, I can give you that one. It is nice.
Shield Bash. Again, very nice ability.
You forgot to mention:
BIGGER FREAKING CURES. WHM can easily fully heal itself for massive enmity and safety.
Fast Cast. It's amazing, and a reason RDM is cool. WHM has more of this than PLD. Try it some time.
Self-Haste/status cures/regen III. Very awesome tools, though WHM still suffers a lack of Refresh.
More haste gear than PLD!
EDIT: I'm done. Someone else call Yinsha a dumbass. Or a Troll. Whichever works.
Not trolling or anything... But really, wouldn't it be better to put a DD in where a PLD normally is in nearly every situation these days?
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