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Abyssea - Casual or hardcore ?
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 432
By Asura.Masekase 2010-07-26 21:06:12
Carbuncle.Zanno said: SCH and DNC was released at the same time werent they? And SCH 70 cap fight, i dont know. But something tells me that as good as everyone who plays this game already had atleast 1 job at 75 when SCH and DNC came out.
Either way that doesnt matter, his attempt was to prove with this list that PUP > COR. And that failed, as everything else he has posted in this thread so far.
Was just showing there is so many factors involved which makes that list mean jack s**t.
The only way you would get a true result on popularity. Is if they where all available at the very start. All expansions where available at the start.
As people have adapted and changed with each expansion to the ideal jobs wanted in a party.
Leviathan.Pimpchan
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 756
By Leviathan.Pimpchan 2010-07-27 02:37:22
Asura.Masekase said:
according to that list, bard isnt really that usefull either. Who would have thought?
me
Quote: I guess everyone just wants us bards in their party/EG events/everything just to be nice to us and to not hurt our feelings.
Elitist. I want to bring any job to abyssea, why are you forcing me to come on brd over pld ?
Bard is not needed for anything in the game, unlike, say, whm or rdm. Inbefore "brd is needed for my abyssea runs". I though abyssea was casual and that you didn't reproduce the models of normal merits PTs ? The reason BRD is so low is because it's one of the most boring job to play, hence the fail job.
Leviathan.Pimpchan
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 756
By Leviathan.Pimpchan 2010-07-27 02:39:30
Asura.Masekase said:
The only way you would get a true result on popularity. Is if they where all available at the very start. All expansions where available at the start.
As people have adapted and changed with each expansion to the ideal jobs wanted in a party.
Wrong, COR is last and came in 2006, and there are 3x more DNC that CORs. I mean keeping hiding your eyes. This is statistical evidence.
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 33979
By Bismarck.Dracondria 2010-07-27 02:40:14
I hate BRDs or CORS in Abyssea when I'm trying to open a chest, when I'm DDing I don't mind though lol. Double-edged sword go
Leviathan.Pimpchan
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 756
By Leviathan.Pimpchan 2010-07-27 02:42:35
Asura.Masekase said:
The game data list proves nothing for popularity. Of course whm,rdm,blm,thf,war,mnk would be at the top. They are the first jobs available. The most reliable list would be the survey results and this is why:
Next comes pld (not 100% sure if first unlockable jobs where available from start or came in an update) Same available at 30 before expansions. Also would be popular job as its a tank.
Next NIN, SAM, DRK, BRD and DRG. See where im gonna go with this. Available pre first expansion and first expansion.
Next comes Dancer and BLU released later in TOAU and WOTG. Of course it wont sway everyone from their loved job. Which they have played for a long time.
Also BLU takes alot of work. Only dedicated players are gonna stick at it learning the spells.
DNC has only really just started making its place in parties etc. As of late and had to solo for exp.
Only reason DNC is so far up the list they realised it was an easy job to solo. After they had levled it to 37 to help there main in solo activities.
Ok now onto BST same again not everyone likes to solo. So this job only caters for a small market.
SMN need to be dedicated to lvl it. Only way to get avitars is either minis. Which not everyone can do or get 75 on another job/pay. Or you can leech while someone else killed primes.
Can argue smn burns but that only came along with level sync. I bet previous vanadiel_census's you would find smn lower than middle pre level sync. I know Astral burn where available from start but didnt gain popularity til COR and level sync came along.
Then rng can be expensive without crafting. This put alot of people off RNG early on in the game. Only dedicated players stick with it.
Scholar not only one of the newest jobs. It also has the hardest 70 cap fight to unlock getting to 75. When it came out it was in the era of bird parties.
At this time people would only take SCH if there was no RDM. Which made it slower to lvl.
Last but not least PUP and COR two of the most expensive jobs in the game. Only people who really lvl these are people who have a reliable gil source.
Thanks for listing us the reasons why these jobs suck more than others. Problem with jobs added with expansions is that they offer nothing more, and often offer something worse, than pre-existing jobs.
サーバ: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2084
By Gilgamesh.Samuraiking 2010-07-27 02:58:05
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Thanks for listing us the reasons why these jobs suck more than others. Problem with jobs added with expansions is that they offer nothing more, and often offer something worse, than pre-existing jobs.
This from a pup...
How have you not been banned yet for pure ignorance. They need to run IQ tests to get an account and if it's below 80 you get your IP *** banned.
If you're trolling fine, you are epic and have total dedication to your role of idiocy, but you are just totally *** HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE if you are serious.
Sylph.Kimble
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2912
By Sylph.Kimble 2010-07-27 03:00:40
Gilgamesh.Samuraiking said: Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Thanks for listing us the reasons why these jobs suck more than others. Problem with jobs added with expansions is that they offer nothing more, and often offer something worse, than pre-existing jobs.
This from a pup...
How have you not been banned yet for pure ignorance. They need to run IQ tests to get an account and if it's below 80 you get your IP *** banned.
If you're trolling fine, you are epic and have total dedication to your role of idiocy, but you are just totally *** HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE if you are serious.
Well, he was banned form BG for generally being annoying/stupid as hell and wrong about anything so take that for what its worth.
[+]
サーバ: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2084
By Gilgamesh.Samuraiking 2010-07-27 03:03:19
Sylph.Kimble said: Gilgamesh.Samuraiking said: Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Thanks for listing us the reasons why these jobs suck more than others. Problem with jobs added with expansions is that they offer nothing more, and often offer something worse, than pre-existing jobs.
This from a pup...
How have you not been banned yet for pure ignorance. They need to run IQ tests to get an account and if it's below 80 you get your IP *** banned.
If you're trolling fine, you are epic and have total dedication to your role of idiocy, but you are just totally *** HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE if you are serious.
Well, he was banned form BG for generally being annoying/stupid as hell and wrong about anything so take that for what its worth.
Aside from lurking rarely for NM information I haven't seriously browsed BG since like 2005 so idr him and his ***. I never kept up with the drama there but thnx for the info, I'm not exactly shocked.
I'm pretty sure he's just extremely dedicated to his trolling character. I mean I'm bad as hell but right now even I'm breaking character. If I actually thought people like this existed in real life and WEREN'T legally diagnosed with some form of mental illness pertaining to brain function then I would just have to kill myself right now.
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 704
By Sylph.Lotusbluete 2010-07-27 03:09:21
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Asura.Masekase said:
The only way you would get a true result on popularity. Is if they where all available at the very start. All expansions where available at the start.
As people have adapted and changed with each expansion to the ideal jobs wanted in a party.
Wrong, COR is last and came in 2006, and there are 3x more DNC that CORs. I mean keeping hiding your eyes. This is statistical evidence.
Leviathan.Pimpchan
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 756
By Leviathan.Pimpchan 2010-07-27 03:10:16
Sylph.Kimble said:
Well, he was banned form BG for generally being annoying/stupid as hell and wrong about anything so take that for what its worth.
Nope, that's because someone paid 100$
Caitsith.Linear
By Caitsith.Linear 2010-07-27 03:12:11
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Asura.Masekase said: according to that list, bard isnt really that usefull either. Who would have thought? me You're making yourself seem stupider every time you post.
Haste from Marches alone more than replaces a DD. Ballad's are *** amazing. Minuet and Madrigal are situationally awesome.
Are Bards absolutely needed? No, not at all. But they make ***much easier to do. And boredom being a reason for being a fail job? Uh, no. Just because people don't find it fun doesn't mean it's fail.
The reason it's boring is because of the way the player base has dictated how Bard should be played. Bard has decent Dagger skill and amazing equipment they can use. We don't allow the to use it. Ever. It's not the jobs fault it's played the way it is.
Sylph.Kimble
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2912
By Sylph.Kimble 2010-07-27 03:13:56
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Sylph.Kimble said:
Well, he was banned form BG for generally being annoying/stupid as hell and wrong about anything so take that for what its worth.
Nope, that's because someone paid 100$
Either way, point would still stand.
サーバ: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2084
By Gilgamesh.Samuraiking 2010-07-27 03:15:28
Sylph.Kimble said: Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Sylph.Kimble said:
Well, he was banned form BG for generally being annoying/stupid as hell and wrong about anything so take that for what its worth.
Nope, that's because someone paid 100$
Either way, point would still stand.
*** sign me up, let's start a 'Ban Pimpchan' fund and put 100$ in a pot to send to Jaerik for his banning. More than 100 ppl hate him so $1 each isn't too bad.
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By Zekko 2010-07-27 03:15:52
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Sylph.Kimble said:
Well, he was banned form BG for generally being annoying/stupid as hell and wrong about anything so take that for what its worth.
Nope, that's because someone paid 100$
Someone paid 100$ to ban you? Rofl what an idiot
[+]
Caitsith.Linear
By Caitsith.Linear 2010-07-27 03:16:03
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Sylph.Kimble said:
Well, he was banned form BG for generally being annoying/stupid as hell and wrong about anything so take that for what its worth.
Nope, that's because someone paid 100$ Wonder how annoying you have to be for someone to pay $100 just to shut you up.
Leviathan.Pimpchan
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 756
By Leviathan.Pimpchan 2010-07-27 03:16:13
Caitsith.Linear said:
Are Bards absolutely needed? No, not at all.
k, so we agree.
Quote:
But they make ***much easier to do. And boredom being a reason for being a fail job? Uh, no. Just because people don't find it fun doesn't mean it's fail.
whm 14%
brd 3%
why ? Are going to use the "expensive" argument again ?
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 704
By Sylph.Lotusbluete 2010-07-27 03:17:06
Zekko said: Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Sylph.Kimble said:
Well, he was banned form BG for generally being annoying/stupid as hell and wrong about anything so take that for what its worth.
Nope, that's because someone paid 100$
Someone paid 100$ to ban you? Rofl what an idiot must have been well worth it then :P
[+]
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 704
By Sylph.Lotusbluete 2010-07-27 03:18:00
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Caitsith.Linear said:
Are Bards absolutely needed? No, not at all.
k, so we agree.
Quote:
But they make ***much easier to do. And boredom being a reason for being a fail job? Uh, no. Just because people don't find it fun doesn't mean it's fail.
whm 14%
brd 3%
why ? Are going to use the "expensive" argument again ?
Can I use the "you are HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE" argument?
Caitsith.Linear
By Caitsith.Linear 2010-07-27 03:19:43
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Caitsith.Linear said:
Are Bards absolutely needed? No, not at all.
k, so we agree.
Quote:
But they make ***much easier to do. And boredom being a reason for being a fail job? Uh, no. Just because people don't find it fun doesn't mean it's fail.
whm 14%
brd 3%
Are going to use the "expensive" argument again ? Nope. Using the popularity =/= useful argument.
Example: Lindsay Lohan
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 432
By Asura.Masekase 2010-07-27 03:20:27
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Caitsith.Linear said:
Are Bards absolutely needed? No, not at all.
k, so we agree.
Quote:
But they make ***much easier to do. And boredom being a reason for being a fail job? Uh, no. Just because people don't find it fun doesn't mean it's fail.
whm 14%
brd 3%
why ? Are going to use the "expensive" argument again ?
Yes cause comparing a support job with a healer really makes sense.
Sylph.Kimble
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2912
By Sylph.Kimble 2010-07-27 03:20:31
If WHM is the most useful job in the game, why don't you have it?
If PUP is the 2nd worst job in the game, why do you have it?
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 33979
By Bismarck.Dracondria 2010-07-27 03:30:39
How old are those statistics anyway?
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 432
By Asura.Masekase 2010-07-27 03:33:45
Bismarck.Dracondria said: How old are those statistics anyway?
2009
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 432
By Asura.Masekase 2010-07-27 03:39:09
Quote: For the breakdown of players’ main jobs, we used the results from the survey for the question “What is your favorite main job?” and the data from the game regarding which main jobs players had actually set their characters to.
I see you missed this off the top of the census too.
So really that census proves nothing at all.
Sylph.Kimble
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2912
By Sylph.Kimble 2010-07-27 03:39:26
Hmm, side note, when you get banned from the AH site, doesn't your avatar get removed from your profile?
Ifrit.Vextra
サーバ: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 397
By Ifrit.Vextra 2010-07-27 03:48:44
I cannot believe this thread is still going....
Leviathan.Pimpchan
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 756
By Leviathan.Pimpchan 2010-07-27 03:51:03
Asura.Masekase said: Quote: For the breakdown of players’ main jobs, we used the results from the survey for the question “What is your favorite main job?” and the data from the game regarding which main jobs players had actually set their characters to.
I see you missed this off the top of the census too.
So really that census proves nothing at all.
You take a picture of the distribution of the game jobs at a given time. Some people do endgame, some people farm, some people do exp, some people farm zeni. Some do campaign. Some do missions. This picture is not giving you a picture of which job is the most usefull for a given activity, it gives you a picture of which jobs are the most and the least usefull globally. I don't bring double marches when I'm doing campaign, I am not farming on monk, I don't do nyzlulz on BLM. Simple. Statistical. Evidence. If you don't agree with this, fine, post a picture of the jobs distribution in your "alice's wonderlands adventure" abyssea exp ***. Count the CORs. Then come back to me. Count the DRGs, then come back to me. Do eet.
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 33979
By Bismarck.Dracondria 2010-07-27 03:54:29
DRGs and CORs aren't actually that uncommon in Abyssea.
Sylph.Kimble
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2912
By Sylph.Kimble 2010-07-27 04:01:07
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Asura.Masekase said: Quote: For the breakdown of players’ main jobs, we used the results from the survey for the question “What is your favorite main job?” and the data from the game regarding which main jobs players had actually set their characters to.
I see you missed this off the top of the census too.
So really that census proves nothing at all.
My mommy let me off my leash and forgot to put my helmet on.
Oh, that makes sense.
[+]
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 704
By Sylph.Lotusbluete 2010-07-27 04:08:24
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: Asura.Masekase said: Quote: For the breakdown of players’ main jobs, we used the results from the survey for the question “What is your favorite main job?” and the data from the game regarding which main jobs players had actually set their characters to.
I see you missed this off the top of the census too.
So really that census proves nothing at all.
You take a picture of the distribution of the game jobs at a given time. Some people do endgame, some people farm, some people do exp, some people farm zeni. Some do campaign. Some do missions. This picture is not giving you a picture of which job is the most usefull for a given activity, it gives you a picture of which jobs are the most and the least usefull globally. I don't bring double marches when I'm doing campaign, I am not farming on monk, I don't do nyzlulz on BLM. Simple. Statistical. Evidence. If you don't agree with this, fine, post a picture of the jobs distribution in your "alice's wonderlands adventure" abyssea exp ***. Count the CORs. Then come back to me. Count the DRGs, then come back to me. Do eet.
I usually see 1 BRD in Abyssea, 1 COR, 2-3 WHMs, 2-3 BLMs, 2-3 RDMs, 1-2 PLDs, rest DDs (Drg, Sam, War, Mnk, Rng, Drk, actually any kind of heavy DDs).
Dunno whats bad about that, alice in grumpyland.
After reading a lot of posts on different websites like ffxiah, alla, BG on abyssea, a lot of people consider abyssea the event "that everyone was waiting", especially "casual" players, whatever that means.
* I have seen reports of 5 hours exp parties in abyssea being awesome - how is that casual ?
* I checked the requirement for Verethragna, the empyrean H2H :
It requires 50 "Two-leaf Chloris Bud" ; this drops from "Chloris", an abyssea NM with unknown drop rate, not 100%. Requirements for popping Chloris are 4 key items :
*Veinous Hecteyes Eyelid => requires killing "Olphanim" not 100%
*Torn Bat Wing => requires killing "Treble Noctules" not 100%
*Gory Scorpion Claw => requires killing "Hedeteted" not 100%
*Mossy Adamantoise Shell => requires killing "Chukwa" not 100%
olphanim requires 3 "rare" items : "Bloodshot Hecteye" "Shriveled Wing" and a "Shriveled Pincer" - which themselves drop from either normal mobs or NMs that requires another item to pop. Hedetet and treble noctules work the same. Chukwa doesn't require pop (key) items.
Poping just *one* Chloris seems like more of a headache than poping a tier4 ZNM or the tier4 VNM, and you need 50 of its drop (hopefully 100% drop rate), making the difficulty to get the item much longer than getting a pandemonium warden drop.
How is this casual ? Did SE really manage to make us pay 10$ for a retardly time consuming event. It's not like Chloris is the only NM looked after, as there is one equivalent for each weapon it seems, and there a lot of other NMs dropping gear.
Did we really get an event 10x more cock blocking than Salvage ? Doing NMs in abyssea is not exactly the same as normal exp, you will quickly consume your time and be only able to enter once every few days alla dynamis/limbus.
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