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Level cap update information, discussion.
 Asura.Rule
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 220
By Asura.Rule 2010-06-11 10:53:21
Ramuh.Krizz said: Asura.Rule said: Ramuh.Krizz said: Fairy.Basilo said: Uncapped dynamis in a zone like Jueno is gonna be ridiculously *easy* ... Well for a small group say 10ppl 2blms 2 rdm 1 whm 1 pld 1 brd 2 sam and a thf. Some mass links could still cause a wipe but even at lvl80 we talking 1 rana >> gekko from a sam should kill a goblin outright, which it pretty much does now at 75. I'm wondering if this might be done with the intention to make gearing in the 70s easier. Obviously most relic is situational, but not the point. The emphasis will be on AF3 and whatever else they put out.
Also, maybe to take some emphasis away from dynamis and other current EG for the new EG.
If a cap isn't imposed, I also expect to see more relic wielders as currency crashes.
Edit: Same can be said about sky as far as gear goes. Not like it can't already be low manned except for Kirin.
currency will not crash imo, in fact it has increased quite a bit. When dynamis cost 1 mil. the buying rates of currency were around 6k, 7k, and 8k (or at least thats what i was quoted).
Now that dynamis is 500k the prices are around 6k, 12k, 13k respectively.
If you make low man dynamis, you will have the same amount of people doing the event but will be divided into many more runs. Amount of currency increases but so do the number of people going for relic. Currency fluctuates quite a bit. Even if it doesn't crash in the long term, it's quite possible it will in the short term. The LSs that can destroy city zones like Bastok (hi2u Ramuh.Remnants) will be able to with even more efficiency.
If Dynamis isn't instanced and a level cap isn't imposed, I fully expect all hell to break lose over dyna zones once people hit the new cap.
TBH, I don't think 80 will make a HUGE difference. I'm looking more towards 90-99 later on.
Theres already plenty of zone jacking. Just glad my members are patient with me.
 Gilgamesh.Nezea
サーバ: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 200
By Gilgamesh.Nezea 2010-06-11 10:56:29
Why in the world would you require Hastega AND Refreshga for your entire party? There are few situations where every person in your party actually requires both of these buffs and it's probably going to take you more effort trying to manage the stratagems for it as a RDM/SCH than to say..AoE one and cast individually with the other.
With that said I think Hastega and Refreshga are being way overhyped. It's not as if people lack the capability to Haste and Refresh their whole party already. Now they can be super lazy about it - so what? That still doesn't increase the utility of the job a whole pile and if you ask me, for WHM/SCH and RDM/SCH, you're better off saving those charges for things that you can't single target on people (Stoneskinga) and things that actually have a demand to be used quickly (Erasega, Paralynaga...) or perhaps Curaga in the case of RDM/SCH. Once you get a single target Haste rotation going you can easily keep it on everyone full time. Conversely, if everyone gets paralyzed they're sure not gonna want to wait for you to individually para everyone in your party, or if they get slow that's stronger than haste, man it takes forever to go and individually erase all of those people.
This is why even as SCH/RDM now, I use Firestorm on my DD party single target and not via Accession. As someone using SCH as a sub job, you have half the charges. You probably should think a bit more wisely about how to use them instead of blowing them all on stupid conveniences.
 Fairy.Basilo
サーバ: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 650
By Fairy.Basilo 2010-06-11 10:57:23
Titan.Cripnicc said: Fairy.Basilo said: Titan.Cripnicc said: Still waiting on video footage (lowman 6 ppl) byakko You can 6 man byakko now with 6 rdm/sch chainspell drain. Interesting that would be cool to see.
Ive seen it done with about 12 people in my old linkshell but I only did about 1k dmg as blm off 3 nukes and 1 drain before it got killed. Had about 5 other pretty useless jobs in there too pld, 2 dd which stood away didnt do anything. And the 6-8ish rdm we did have werent all that good tbh I think only 1 had sj sch too wasnt that long after sch was released bout 18months- 2yrs ago. Anyway yeah rdm/blms for about 5 of them 1-2 rdm/whm and 1 rdm/sch average gear chainspell drain.
Im pretty sure this is on other forums isnt new at all infact I read about it the time we were gonna pop because I was sceptical but yea math is like 30ish drains per rdm for avg 200dmg 6000dmg per rdm x6 = 36k hp.
サーバ: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2328
By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-06-11 10:58:04
Ramuh.Krizz said:
Currency fluctuates quite a bit. Even if it doesn't crash in the long term, it's quite possible it will in the short term. The LSs that can destroy city zones like Bastok (hi2u Ramuh.Remnants) will be able to with even more efficiency.
If Dynamis isn't instanced and a level cap isn't imposed, I fully expect all hell to break lose over dyna zones once people hit the new cap.
TBH, I don't think 80 will make a HUGE difference. I'm looking more towards 90-99 later on.
Currency would only really crash if it becomes instanced. Since it isn't, there's only really so much currency that gets generated per week. The only thing that will change is everyone and their mother thinking they can get a relic easy, therefore increasing demand causing prices to go up rather than down.
Also at 80 you could expect to see 6man clear zones, mobs should be hitting significantly less harder thanks to level correction, and we should be doing a lot more damage. By 99 I expect to see DL duos!
Ramuh.Dasva
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-06-11 10:58:29
Fairy.Basilo said: Uncapped dynamis in a zone like Jueno is gonna be ridiculously *easy* ... Well for a small group say 10ppl 2blms 2 rdm 1 whm 1 pld 1 brd 2 sam and a thf. Some mass links could still cause a wipe but even at lvl80 we talking 1 rana >> gekko from a sam should kill a goblin outright, which it pretty much does now at 75. I think you overestimate increases in dmg. With gekko you are probably coming close to capping ratio/Cratio granted your Cratio cap will be higher since they wont have as many lvls on you. As far as more str goes... chances are the lvl modifier on ws will also increase which is mitigate gains from that. And it will take alot of base dmg to beat haguns boost so can't really count on weapons making a huge difference for sam.
サーバ: Sylph
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Posts: 15065
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-06-11 11:00:32
Titan.Cripnicc said: Fairy.Basilo said: Titan.Cripnicc said: Still waiting on video footage (lowman 6 ppl) byakko
You can 6 man byakko now with 6 rdm/sch chainspell drain.
Interesting that would be cool to see. Can be done w/ 6 w/o any special full 2hr strats, such as this one
サーバ: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2328
By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-06-11 11:01:34
Gilgamesh.Nezea said: Why in the world would you require Hastega AND Refreshga for your entire party? There are few situations where every person in your party actually requires both of these buffs and it's probably going to take you more effort trying to manage the stratagems for it as a RDM/SCH than to say..AoE one and cast individually with the other.
Except, your melee won't be standing with the mages, so run to them, AoE haste, run to mages, AoE refresh, done and done. Only have to individually cast on a DRK/PLD/BLU etc after that, while saving around 200mp. Overrated?
Gilgamesh.Nezea
サーバ: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 200
By Gilgamesh.Nezea 2010-06-11 11:05:31
Ifrit.Darkanaseur said: Gilgamesh.Nezea said: Why in the world would you require Hastega AND Refreshga for your entire party? There are few situations where every person in your party actually requires both of these buffs and it's probably going to take you more effort trying to manage the stratagems for it as a RDM/SCH than to say..AoE one and cast individually with the other.
Except, your melee won't be standing with the mages, so run to them, AoE haste, run to mages, AoE refresh, done and done. Only have to individually cast on a DRK/PLD/BLU etc after that, while saving around 200mp. Overrated?
Maybe you're unaware that Accession actually doubles MP cost? So you spend 160 MP instead of 240 MP, saving you only 80 MP.
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サーバ: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2328
By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-06-11 11:07:04
Point still relevant, MP saved, time saved.
 Ramuh.Krizz
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 23561
By Ramuh.Krizz 2010-06-11 11:07:21
Ifrit.Darkanaseur said: Ramuh.Krizz said:
Currency fluctuates quite a bit. Even if it doesn't crash in the long term, it's quite possible it will in the short term. The LSs that can destroy city zones like Bastok (hi2u Ramuh.Remnants) will be able to with even more efficiency.
If Dynamis isn't instanced and a level cap isn't imposed, I fully expect all hell to break lose over dyna zones once people hit the new cap.
TBH, I don't think 80 will make a HUGE difference. I'm looking more towards 90-99 later on.
Currency would only really crash if it becomes instanced. Since it isn't, there's only really so much currency that gets generated per week. The only thing that will change is everyone and their mother thinking they can get a relic easy, therefore increasing demand causing prices to go up rather than down.
Also at 80 you could expect to see 6man clear zones, mobs should be hitting significantly less harder thanks to level correction, and we should be doing a lot more damage. By 99 I expect to see DL duos! That is a valid point.
Keep in mind what I said about it at least crashing short term. Dynamis will be packed and the initial flood of currency will cause undercutting.
Asura.Rule said: Theres already plenty of zone jacking. Just glad my members are patient with me. That's no joke. Ramuh has calmed down for the most part, but it still happens every now and then.
Ramuh.Dasva
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-06-11 11:07:28
Ifrit.Darkanaseur said: Gilgamesh.Nezea said: Why in the world would you require Hastega AND Refreshga for your entire party? There are few situations where every person in your party actually requires both of these buffs and it's probably going to take you more effort trying to manage the stratagems for it as a RDM/SCH than to say..AoE one and cast individually with the other. Except, your melee won't be standing with the mages, so run to them, AoE haste, run to mages, AoE refresh, done and done. Only have to individually cast on a DRK/PLD/BLU etc after that, while saving around 200mp. Overrated? It depends on how many people you hit.
As a rdm you probably composured haste and refresh on yourself and those wont go in the same cycle.
Remember you are doubling the mp cost not to mention doubling casting time and tripling recast time. Which means you need to hit at least 3 people that matter with that spell for it to save any mp. And even then you could've used a strat on cure IV instead and saved more. And the odds of you getting 3 or more people with each of those 2 spells that need it in 1 pt.... yeah ok
Either way there are more efficient uses of your stratagems unless for some reason you need several people buffed right then. Ie full AOE dispel or Unexpected aggro whatever.
Gilgamesh.Nezea
サーバ: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 200
By Gilgamesh.Nezea 2010-06-11 11:09:10
Ifrit.Darkanaseur said: Point still relevant, MP saved, time saved.
Point still relavent yes, but significantly less relavent. My point is that while it's certainly useful there are still going to be much BETTER ways to manage your charges in most situations.
Fairy.Basilo
サーバ: Fairy
Game: FFXI
Posts: 650
By Fairy.Basilo 2010-06-11 11:10:17
Sylph.Tigerwoods said: Titan.Cripnicc said: Fairy.Basilo said: Titan.Cripnicc said: Still waiting on video footage (lowman 6 ppl) byakko You can 6 man byakko now with 6 rdm/sch chainspell drain. Interesting that would be cool to see. Can be done w/ 6 w/o any special full 2hr strats, such as this one
I guess, anth on pld, me as sam, rdm/drk fastcast gear on stun 1 whm another dd drk would be good and a brd would do it 6 man. But chainspell drain just came to mind when I hear him say originally would be nice to see 6 man byakko.
Valefor.Ivaan
サーバ: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 605
By Valefor.Ivaan 2010-06-11 11:11:29
did i see a drk casting stunga?
seeeeeeeeeexxxxiiiiiiiiiii.
サーバ: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2328
By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-06-11 11:11:55
Was speaking more from a standard setup, like meripo, all melee are gonna be together, you'd hit all 4 and self with haste, costing 80 MP vs 200. In a typical tank party you'd refreshga all the support at once etc. Less useful in a custom setup I guess.
サーバ: Titan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 268
By Titan.Cripnicc 2010-06-11 11:12:20
Sylph.Tigerwoods said: Titan.Cripnicc said: Fairy.Basilo said: Titan.Cripnicc said: Still waiting on video footage (lowman 6 ppl) byakko
You can 6 man byakko now with 6 rdm/sch chainspell drain.
Interesting that would be cool to see. Can be done w/ 6 w/o any special full 2hr strats, such as this one Still have not seen it >< (sorry not trying to derail post) but 6 man byakko i hear about but have never seen it and cant find a video on youtube so... That must mean if it is possible very few ppl have the gear+skill to do it. i still say 6 ppl at lvl 80 would be the sufficent amount
Ramuh.Dasva
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-06-11 11:12:30
Fairy.Basilo said: Sylph.Tigerwoods said: Titan.Cripnicc said: Fairy.Basilo said: Titan.Cripnicc said: Still waiting on video footage (lowman 6 ppl) byakko You can 6 man byakko now with 6 rdm/sch chainspell drain. Interesting that would be cool to see. Can be done w/ 6 w/o any special full 2hr strats, such as this one I guess, anth on pld, me as sam, rdm/drk fastcast gear on stun 1 whm another dd drk would be good and a brd would do it 6 man. But chainspell drain just came to mind when I hear him say originally would be nice to see 6 man byakko. I've done it with 2nin/drk 2 sam/thf 1 brd 1 rdm. In evasion gear the nins don't really get touched. Without much meleeing yakko doesn't tp much. And as nin/drks well the sams could SA most the ws after the first little bit lol. Actually I think we had 1 thf too for TH but not like he helped in the fight really
Ramuh.Dasva
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-06-11 11:15:00
Ifrit.Darkanaseur said: Was speaking more from a standard setup, like meripo, all melee are gonna be together, you'd hit all 4 and self with haste, costing 80 MP vs 200. In a typical tank party you'd refreshga all the support at once etc. Less useful in a custom setup I guess. I was more arguing like Nezea that the odds of you needing refreshga AND hastega are slim.
Having 1 or the other be useful is a different story entirely. Just be careful not to overwrite your own buff accidentally without composure up or you will mitigate the savings more.
Though often my tank pts only need the 2 tanks and me refreshed and often they aren't in range of each other
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 382
By Asura.Tristean 2010-06-11 11:15:06
I guess the people who can 6 man byakko don't really have time to show the world their skill and want to let other people figure it out for themselves.
Haven't you heard? FFXI is a selfish game so stop asking. People only post videos for bragging rights. Rarely do they post for strategies. If they do post for strategies they put it on ffxiclopedia or another site supporting that site.
If people atest to having done it, just believe it and move on. Of course byakko can be 6 man'ed at 80 if you have people aren't stupid.
サーバ: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2328
By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-06-11 11:18:33
Titan.Cripnicc said: Still have not seen it >< (sorry not trying to derail post) but 6 man byakko i hear about but have never seen it and cant find a video on youtube so... That must mean if it is possible very few ppl have the gear skill to do it. i still say 6 ppl at lvl 80 would be the sufficent amount
It's not really that gear demanding. I won't lie and say it's incredibly easy either, Byakko can still drop a tank fast and turn it into a ***storm. Just need a good tank and great mages (ie: curing/stunning exctly when needed).
I did it PLD/RDM/WHM/BRD/SAM/THF.
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6558
By Odin.Zicdeh 2010-06-11 11:25:52
Titan.Cripnicc said: Sylph.Tigerwoods said: Titan.Cripnicc said: Fairy.Basilo said: Titan.Cripnicc said: Still waiting on video footage (lowman 6 ppl) byakko
You can 6 man byakko now with 6 rdm/sch chainspell drain.
Interesting that would be cool to see. Can be done w/ 6 w/o any special full 2hr strats, such as this one Still have not seen it >< (sorry not trying to derail post) but 6 man byakko i hear about but have never seen it and cant find a video on youtube so... That must mean if it is possible very few ppl have the gear skill to do it. i still say 6 ppl at lvl 80 would be the sufficent amount
Easiest way to 6man Byakko (And it takes skill and good equipped DD to get him down in a timely manner) is 2x DRK/NIN, WHM,BRD,RDM,COR. Byakko's Mighty Triple attack is nothing when you Have 2x fully hasted stunners with Slow/Elegy support. Dread Spikes also Proc's Full on Byakko. Severely mitigating the damage the Dark Knight would take.
It's best, before they go balls-*** insnae on DD, for the DRK/NIN's to try and build to hate cap with spells. That way if one gets in trouble, the other can take over hate with nothing more than a Ja/Hate spell (Bind, Sleep, Ect,)
Byakko can also be taken down a little more conventionally, and he's possible to solo tank, but I don't condone solo tanking, because if the Internet connection of your tank goes out... well... trouble? lol
I still consider Byakko one of the hardest NM's to tank, Right up there with Cerb. (Hard maybe wrong word, Irritating is probably better) despite being an old NM.
Ramuh.Dasva
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-06-11 11:26:43
Valefor.Ivaan said: did i see a drk casting stunga?
seeeeeeeeeexxxxiiiiiiiiiii. Fast way to die... but yes doable. Or you could absorb-str ga ;). Go out in a blaze of glory
サーバ: Odin
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2010-06-11 11:30:29
Ramuh.Dasva said: Valefor.Ivaan said: did i see a drk casting stunga?
seeeeeeeeeexxxxiiiiiiiiiii. Fast way to die... but yes doable. Or you could absorb-str ga ;). Go out in a blaze of glory
Stunga isn't new, SCH/DRK got it. It's uses, quite limited.
Dread Spikes is Dark Magic, and Manifestation effects dark Magic... Soooo One must wonder if this will allow a Dark Knight to Dreadspikes a party...
And just to give you some precedence, Klimaform too is Dark Magic, and it DOES work (Self cast, dark Magic spell) sooooo, the Age of DRK support has come?!
Gilgamesh.Nezea
サーバ: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 200
By Gilgamesh.Nezea 2010-06-11 11:31:59
Odin.Zicdeh said: And just to give you some precedence, Klimaform too is Dark Magic, and it DOES work (Self cast, dark Magic spell) sooooo, the Age of DRK support has come?!
My opinion is that there's a 0% chance of Klimaform being accessible via sub job, since it's basically SCH's "AF weapon."
Ramuh.Krizz
サーバ: Ramuh
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By Ramuh.Krizz 2010-06-11 11:33:04
Cerb is such a cockblocker.
サーバ: Odin
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2010-06-11 11:33:06
I wasn't talking about Klimaform, I was using that as an example of how Self-cast Dark Magic does extend to the Party with Manifesation, to substantiate speculation that Dark Knight will soon be able to Dread Spikes a party.
Ramuh.Dasva
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-06-11 11:34:16
Odin.Zicdeh said: Ramuh.Dasva said: Valefor.Ivaan said: did i see a drk casting stunga? seeeeeeeeeexxxxiiiiiiiiiii. Fast way to die... but yes doable. Or you could absorb-str ga ;). Go out in a blaze of glory Stunga isn't new, SCH/DRK got it. It's uses, quite limited. Oh I know I use stunga on blu semi often (at least as much as that like 3 min recast timer lets me well for the good one) But needless to say I don't think I'd ever use it except as an extra single target stun if I wasn't /nin
Ramuh.Dasva
サーバ: Ramuh
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Posts: 40469
By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-06-11 11:34:53
Drain 2 ga!!!
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4
By Fenrir.Soulslasher 2010-06-11 11:36:34
refresh will be f***** useless... mp full will be increase.. we need refresh II here...
Ramuh.Krizz
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 23561
By Ramuh.Krizz 2010-06-11 11:37:36
Fenrir.Soulslasher said: refresh will be f***** useless... mp full will be increase.. we need refresh II here... lolwut
As previously announced at VanaFest 2010, the impending version update will usher in the first stage of the long-awaited level cap increase! What factors led to this monumental decision? What implications will it have for adventurers? Today, we would like to take the opportunity to address pressing questions and concerns about the latest major evolution to hit Vana'diel.
Q: What inspired the decision to increase the level cap?
A: With the cap set at level 75 for quite some time now, a wide variety of monsters, equipment, and game content has been introduced over the years for players who had reached this limit. With such content having been fleshed out to the development team's satisfaction, it was deemed that the time was right to usher in the sort of new challenges that could only come with the ability to achieve higher levels.
Q: What changes can we expect to see after the cap is lifted?
A: Beginning with the upcoming version update, the level cap will be gradually increased to an eventual maximum of 99, with new job abilities, magic spells, weapon skills, and equipment to be made available at these higher levels. These additions, as well as refinements to existing abilities and spells, will focus on preserving and strengthening the unique roles that each main job serves, while increasing the tactical options available to each support job. Needless to say, new game content will also be introduced that will demand every onz of adventurers' newfound might.
Q: What specific changes will be implemented in the coming version update?
A: The level cap will be raised to 80, and new abilities, magic, weapon skills and equipment for players up to this level will be added. Level restrictions placed on certain areas will also be removed, creating additional high-level battlegrounds for players to explore. The level cap increase will also result in a number of existing skills becoming newly available to support jobs, with a few exceptions and adjustments to preserve balance and ensure that main jobs do not see their thunder stolen.
Unusable by Support Jobs
- The white magic job abilities "Afflatus: Misery" and "Afflatus: Solace", and the ninja job abilities Yonin and Innin will not be available to support jobs.
Usable by Support Jobs, with Altered Effects
- The ranger job ability Shadowbind will be subject to an accuracy check, with a miss generating no effect.
- The scholar job abilities Accession and Manifestation will triple (rather than double) recast time for the spells used.
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