Haste Vs. Accuracy Endgame

Truth, I admit defeat. Did not even think on that ><;
Bah I need to campaign and finish gettings notes for my awesome Iron Ram boots! or should I go and do floor 20 nyzuls over and over and *** up the nyzul static I am because Iron Ram is subpar!

I'll agree if you can give me a valid reason why I should care about other people's opinion over my own. Especially if their opinion is nothing more than a random jab, then disappear.

I'm going to completely ignore you from now on unless you can prove to me that you actually understand my point. Remember, I don't lose anything from not responding to you. If you're going to attempt to claim the same, then we can agree that everything is good, no?


Maybe it's just me but are you missing the whole second portion to that post?

You've shown that P.harpe/Blau produces more WS damage. Now you need to show how much more frequency Blau/Sirocco WSs over P.harpe/Blau and then compare them.

Before you do that, remember Blau has a weapon ranking of 26/9 => 2 where P.harpe has a weapon rank of 4, so go back and correct your math.

Basic fundamentals of the game, huh.


That makes even less sense. Why bother working on two pieces of gear that performs the same function if one is obviously weaker than the other. Why not devote all your time into the better piece? If you can't, I'm sure there are other slots where you can devote your time into getting the best for. Why not work on that?


Do you want to know the downfall of Virtuosus's argument? It's his attachment to the word 'subpar'. When I used subpar earlier, I said 'subpar to the best'. You can go back and check it out yourself, it's on page 2.

So yes, if you're going to use subpar that way, subpar really does mean the same as decent. The way he's distorting my argument is that he's transforming 'subpar' from 'subpar to the best' to 'subpar to average', which completely misrepresents what I'm saying. Which is why he's an idiot and rather obsessive about winning this argument. I've already pointed out how he's quoting single words and passing it off as my argument, I've already pointed out how he's distorting what I want to say, I've already pointed out how he's trying to put words in my mouth. Because of his mutilation of the word 'subpar', he is guilty of all of it.


I, on the other hand, haven't distorted anything, to the best of my knowledge. If I have, tell me where so I can correct you or I can correct myself.


Because Mandau costs alot. Once I thought my gear was good enough, I decided to stop upgrading little things and focus on the Mandau. The Voyager Sallet does annoy me, but getting heca cap+1 right now would set back the Mandau way too much. And Merman's harness is impossible to fine.

He has differentiated between the two, so their meanings would be different. Such as Amemet+1 being decent, and NQ being sub par. I don't agree with that but it draws a line in that contradiction crap going back and forth.

It has nothing to do w/ correcting the math.

For example, let's say we have a 65/35% rate on DoT/ws dmg.

You had Pharp/Blau as an 18% increase total.

But if you apply the dot/ws ratio

(18 x .65) + (8.1 x .35) = 14.35% total increase instead of your projected 18%.

My point was that excluding WS damage, your number was a lot higher in the DMG+ portion of pharp than it should have been.

Again, *** basics. Next thing you know, you won't understand this and I'll have to hold your *** hand as I walk you through every step.

Considering neither weapon was capping fstr, there is nothing to correct. Again, if you want to create a WS set and have me compare them, I'd be more than happy to, but I'm fine w/ my basic example.


Again, the point being that I'm actually able to do this ***and you just continue w/ the DOT portion of increase and consider it as the fulltime increase.

That's just quoting out of context, and I'm not gonna go back and forth arguing semantics, but by that logic you can call Blau sub-par because comparatively to Mandau it's worse. You'd call an average geared player decent (or another variant), and a weaker player subpar for not being at least average.

lol.. but he suggested "decent" options.

Ihina, I'll put this in a form that even you can understand.

You have it as 18% decrease in speed and 18% increase in DoT. The second you get anything less than an 18% increase in WS damage, then the total increase in terms of DMG will be less than 18% total, while the attack speed will remain 18%, thus making Blau/Sirr superior, and not the two of them being "on par"

pharpe is in no way 18% increase in dps thats what im going to say

pharpe/blau dps (23% DW here which can be used on a later tp gain test if needed) = (37+33)*60/ 298 = 14.09

blau/sk dps = (33+26)*60/ 252 = 14.04

14.09/14.04 = 0.36% higher

Thats without factoring fstr which boosts blau/sk more. So in the end, blau/Sk has to be at least 0.3% faster to equal pharpe/blau. Since you already showed that blau/sk is 18% faster, we got the deal set.

No, he was saying that Pharp/blau was 18% more dmg/hit and blau/sirr was 18% faster, making them practically even for DPS, not saying that Pharp/blau is 18% more dps


Edit: And yea, you were right about him not accounting for fstr. He also didn't account for Pharp/blau not being an 18% increase total because the increase for WS is going to be less than 18% in terms of average dmg/hit

He did say 18% more dot, i thought this was the same as dps? lol damage per hit (which he should have used then) certainly is not damage over time imo.

He worded it confusingly, but that's not what he meant. He meant in pure dmg her hit its a 18% increase and yea he did say dot, but then he followed it up with while being 18% slower and he did say that they were on par with each other.

So he technically did say DoT, but that's not what he meant.

Dancing edge, really?

Explain the cuch belt.

Hurray for having your whole post erased because you hit refresh.

Anyways...

Do you know what a red herring is?

It really doesn't matter if he's already differentiated between the two. If he's going to claim I said something, he needs to make sure that his intended definition matches mine; not dictionary.com's.


That's nice that you've already said that, but I've already covered it too. See:

You missed the point. First of all, I've already stated that while P.harpe/blau hits 18% harder, Blau/Sirocco hits 18% faster. Thanks for covering something that's already void.

Also, going back at your original math, you added +7 to each weapon for each fStr. P.harpe has a weapon rank of four, so could you kindly go back and fix that before I continue. If you don't know how, ask me and I'll do it for you.

Ok. My bad. Up to this point, I made the assumption that you people knew how to reason. Obviously you don't, because you made the statement that Blau is subpar to the Mandau. NATURALLY, you're all going to take this out of context and claim I stated the blau is better than the Mandau. HOWEVER, I feel the need to remind you that THFs often sub /nin and can actually use TWO weapons.

You're switching back and forth between two definitions of subpar and frankly, I don't care enough to keep up. I'm here to argue my point, I couldn't care less what yours is.

See Above

See thread

Wrong. Dot remains roughly the same. The only difference is WS frequency and WS damage, which you need to figure out. You've been going at it wrong from the beginning, or do you not realize the Blau/Sirocco hits faster than the P.harpe/blau?

And I'm working on it. Are you trying to claim that the best gear are easy to get?

If you want to be consistent with what I'm saying, it's straight to decent, than straight to the Mandau.

Blau/Sirocco then Mandau/Blau. X's knife is situational.

The P.harpe dropped on my lap, and on par with the Blau/Sirocco, and I don't have to worry about wind damage against certain mobs, so I'm going to use that until I get my Mandau.


Tell me I'm mistaken(please), but did you just claim you can pull off 18% more WSs with Blau/Sir over P.harpe/Blau?

It's better than the Warwolf belt.

Done.

Since you mentioned Firefox earlier.

I love you.

edit: Please have my babies

Now this is getting interesting. I am looking forward to the full formulae written out and filled in for each weapon set.

Chuch belt vs Warwolf belt(unaugmented).
6DEX 10att
5DEX 5STR - 2.5att (I believe, for one-handers)

Difference: 1DEX 7.5att, or 5STR
From what I have gleaned of other job's and gear choices.. Att vs stat is extremely situational.
Augment the Warwolf with +5att and this isn't even a contest anymore.

You're welcome
You're a *** moron. Weapon rank doesn't just give you extra DMG, it raises the cap the DMG you can gain from fstr. You're not hitting 7 caps neither pharpe nor blau, so there's no diff in the two weapons until you have more str than will cap for blau. In my case, I don't, since fstr is only 7. You're a *** moron if you think there is anything there to correct.



What am I wrong about? Please point out where I said the DOT increase would be less than 18%. I said the TOTAL increase from DMG+. Total includes both DoT and WS, not just DoT.

Blau/sirroco is 18% faster for DoT, Pharp/Blau hits 18% harder for melee damage. This means that if you gain a higher percentage of WS from Blau/Sirroco than Pharp/Blau provides DMG increase in % for ws, then Blau/Sirroco wins over all. If you want to make a TP and a WS set, I will do the math for it, but other than that, I can't compare attack speeds w/o proper sets (by the way though, it's going to be a higher increase in number of WS than you get from DMG increase, since we're not comparing mainly blau to pharp when it comes to WS DMG).


Before you talk more about weapon rank, I'll educate you on how it works, so that you can shut the *** up.


Greater Colibri have 67 AGI.
Blau Dolch, rank 2, caps at 10 fstr
Pharp, rank 4, caps at 12 fstr

I said 7 fstr in my comparison. In this case, 7 fstr is 91 STR (yes you should have more than this, but I pulled a make believe set out of my ***. If you want a better set, then make it yourself and I'll do the math on it).

You do not exceed cap on either, so both weapons get DMG+7.

Now, let's say you have 111 STR. This is rank 12 for colibri.

Since Blau caps at rank 10, you'd get 10 dmg to blau and 12 dmg to Pharp.

When you hit don't hit cap on blau though, you don't get *** extra damage from pharp and when you're not capping fstr on either, than weapon rank doesn't mean ***.

Don't see how(unless fstr is capped). You gain 0 dmg in your first hit (because of the 1-2 fstr) from dex bonus. Then you lose 1 fstr for hits 2, 3, 4, 5, and 6. Unless you're going to claim 7 attack is better than 1 DMG for 5 of the 6 hits.

Did you mean VIT? Small typo perhaps, but STR-AGI check on fSTR doesn't sound right.

Yea, was a typo, but they do have 67 agi too. Both stats are 67, which is why I mixed them up. I'm sure that's the only mistake he's gonna be able to call me on though.

Let's make it so the dagger combination I favor is played at its maximum/best but fall short on the dagger combination I'm not favoring.

Either you fully account for fStr or you set them all to 0. Correct it, or don't. It's really up to you. I'm not going to argue on unequal terms that you shrewd because you want to give one side an unfair advantage.

*sigh*

First of all, the Str will apply to all hits.

Second, it's not 7atk advantage, it's 7.5.

Third, it's not 0DMG increase, it's .3DMG increase. To all hits, not just the first.

True that it floors to 0, but the game adds everything up in decimals first, and then it floors at the end. If you do the math, it's a 30% chance of gaining another DMG.

Fourth, true that you lose 1fStr, but that does cap, whereas DEX never caps.

In short

1DEX + 7.5atk > 5str + 2.5atk

k

BTW, I think it's kinda cute how you attributed 1DEX to 0DMG but you then said 5STR = 1-2 fSTR. Your desperation is showing.

And can we not bring in birds. If you're going to center your gear on birds, then so be it. Don't have it apply to all mobs in the game.

Edit: And since we're playing with decimals, I'd like to throw in that the cuchulain's belt has an additional +.5acc to it.

Oh please, I'm not as petty as you are.