NIN Can't DD

actually, this is pretty true everywhere for every job it seem, wtf's been going on recently!?

Saying NINs can DD is like saying RDMs can nuke. Sure it can be done, and even geared properly it can put up respectable numbers within their realm of limitations, but it's still a gimp form of whatever role you're trying to fill.

Inb4 Rdms that claim they can nuke over 9000 dmg.

Nin's only practical usefulness in endgame is /rdm and /drk for tanking.

k.

t.

this about sums it up, can first voke in merits i guess, but just get a war lol

All I can say is thank god only about 10-15% of the game is endgame.

I had a brd princess last night who wanted me to come drg/war and voke. I offered to come war/nin for voke, he refused. I dropped party and said bye.

idiot brd

I never understand princess brd's.

Especially leaving before gauging the pt. But really if you have sam's they should of been /war anyways.

Who was this bard?

He wanted me on drg cause birdies are weak to polearm was his explanation.

The party setup was 4drgs, cor, brd.... He got the galka to come drg/war after I dropped

... Yeah in that situation all the drg's should of been /sam...

Shinphoenlx

I was /sam... but apparently the brd knows something I dont

But there's only one way to play this game, and hybrids don't exist! Adapting to situations don't exist! One way ONLY ALWAYS!

We've gotten to the point in this game where we've determined optimal jobs, party/alliance builds, and gear selection. There really is little room for originality unless you want to be deemed subpar.

Try doing endgame with dark knight tanks, blue mage main healers, and puppetmasters providing damage. Tell me how much of a success your group has experienced while keeping things "original".

There isn't only way to do most situations but to assume bringing a monk has any real value in Dragon's Aery is a joke.

Well, if you read around on BG, they all swear by DRK being the best tank in the game.

No we don't. In certain situations it's the optimal tank, but not always.

my ls has had drk/nins off tank when we are low tanks before, its not as bad as saying nin=2h jobs at DD lol

DRK tanks have access to PLD gear but can generate hate like NIN/drks, they seem to have the best of both worlds except they lack a few important things like: Shield Mastery, Defensive abilities like Sentinel/Rampart, and the inability to cure themselves along with the lack of the 4th shadow from Utsusemi Ni leaves them being another mediocre substitute for a tank.

They're not a horrible pick, but then again neither are NIN tanks. There's a reason why every endgame linkshell utilizes PLD tanks more so than any other type. They REQUIRE less support and offer more survivability in 'oh ***' situations.

If it's on BG it must be true... /sigh

hence my "All I can say is thank god only about 10-15% of the game is endgame." comment.

I've tried most end-game and it just isn't fun to me, I prefer originality, I prefer being able to try out new things.

You people in the Aery can keep your SAM and war are the only viable DD attitudes, I'll be doing my own thing on mnk out of the aery.

Not that I avoid all end-game, the only end-game I really avoid is the kings as it's boring and stale as ***.

If you're talking HNM, that's even less of the game, maybe 5%?

Exactly Koz.

Sorry, didn't mean I agree with it, just saying you would be shocked how many people greatly support DRK/NIN tanks, lol.

Tbh, if you've never tried HNM, i would suggest giving Dark Ixion a shot. It's the most dynamic fight FFXI has offered and it's *** ADDICTIVE.

I would gladly reactivate my FFXI content ID knowing I can fight DI again, but I'm not interested in the petty politics/drama associated with lolendgame. Been there, done that. Moved on.

Done all the kings, Khim and Cerb.

Also done all the major tier 3 VNM's.

That's about as far as I got with HNM, and it's boring as *** on brd.

Dark Ixion is nothing like all the other fights. It's actually quite refreshing.

well, falling back a bit on the discussion

Argettio the numbers you used for nin are actually wrong. Cause you proposed a 13 hit nin but used the delay of a whole round in your calculations. You should have used 120 where you used 240 because thats the real delay per hit.
Still i don't think a 13 hit nin exist, does it? With 19stp the lowest number number i can think of is 17 hits after wsing.

So let me try a different approuch with the tp gained per second.

I'm going to use 450 delay and 250 delay (from senj+perdu and af+suppa).

SAM:
If a sam is 6 hitting he will have 16.7tp/hit at least. There are some considerations though, like less stp on melee phase and more stp on ws and stuff like that. But ill sum it up with a 16.7tp/hit.

16.7*60/450 = 2.23 tp/sec
a merited sam can meditate every 2.5min, which adds with relic and af:
160/2.5*60 = 1.07 tp/sec

So, a 6 hit sam total tp gain is 3.3tp/sec.

NIN:
250 delay is 125 delay to each hand and 4.5tp/hit. 19stp will bring this up to 5.3tp/hit.

5.3*60/125 = 2.54 tp/sec

I think there is no need to account subjob, since war would affect them equally. Double attack from brutal earring would also affect them equally and that's why i didn't add it to those numbers. Same thing would happen with haste on equip, Argettio proposed they were the same, and since it would affect both equally, there is no need to discriminate it.

So there we go. Hit by hit nin gets tp faster. A sam would have to be very agreesive to get the tp/sec number i got here, but still, sam can easilly win. A complete lazy sam that maditates every 5min would still have 2.76tp/sec.

edit: oh yeah, and of course nin dps is higher
71 dmg every 250 delay > 85 dmg every 450 delay

Haste doesn't effect them both equally. Sam has hasso, which makes the haste gear more valuable for sam than it does for nin