New Character Development System: Master Level.

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2010-06-21
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New Character Development System: Master Level.
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 Ragnarok.Lordjecht
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By Ragnarok.Lordjecht 2021-11-04 10:08:05  
From the patch note

Quote:
First up, we are introducing a new battle system known as Master Levels.
This is a new character advancement system to power up jobs for which you have earned the job master designation. Increasing master levels increases your basic attributes.
Although you can increase you master level in your usual stomping grounds, we have a couple of adjustments coming for those of you who want to cut your teeth on foes a little more challenging. This includes some adjustments to monster spawn locations, which will continue in future version updates. Take a look at the official patch notes once they go live for more information.

It sounds you have the option to either grind or some new challenge to increase your "Master level"

We have a week to speculate until the patch hit.
 Asura.Sirris
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By Asura.Sirris 2021-11-04 10:55:34  
Merit points, job points, and now Master Levels. Unless Master Levels provide a meaningful enhancement to a job's power instead of just some random stats, it's not very exciting, just having another thing to grind away at, honestly.
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 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2021-11-04 10:57:07  
It's the perfect concept. Grind 10,000 hours for str+1 and you'll all do it. Forever. Can't possibly have one less str than everyone else, think of the shame!
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 Shiva.Thorny
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By Shiva.Thorny 2021-11-04 10:57:50  
Look how long it took people to hop on the job points train when it was new and had poor time:reward balance. This isn't even unique traits, just base stats.

I'd love to be proven wrong, but I don't expect people to be drooling over this.
 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2021-11-04 11:04:24  
They fight it at first. They'll ***. There's no way I'll do that. Then a month later they'll fall in line.

I mean sure, they won't be excited for it, but they'll do it. What else will there be to do, nothing. This is it.
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By ksoze 2021-11-04 11:48:28  
New CP spots sound cool
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By Mattelot 2021-11-04 12:44:05  
This ought to fill up some of the good CP spots with all those multi-boxers who's characters play while they're afk.

I'm not going to be optimistic or pessimistic about this until I see exactly what it does.
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By Zubis 2021-11-04 12:46:30  
{Master Level}+1 {Do you need it?} AFK 10M /tell
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By RadialArcana 2021-11-04 12:47:48  
From what I gather you don't even need to grind these out, you get job points and merits just doing normal content. Until now they had no use, I'm happy to get some use out of them.

All they need to do is give this new level different color stars and everyone will want it.
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 Lakshmi.Avereith
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By Lakshmi.Avereith 2021-11-04 12:51:13  
Well at least the system might contribute to me getting mastery rank 9.. Stupid more grind
 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2021-11-04 12:59:47  
Shiva.Thorny said: »
Look how long it took people to hop on the job points train when it was new and had poor time:reward balance. This isn't even unique traits, just base stats.

I'd love to be proven wrong, but I don't expect people to be drooling over this.

Of course people will drool over this. We grinded literal thousands of monsters for ToM weapons. They could have made an extension off that line for +1str indefinitely and people would STILL be doing it. Shinryu Drop rate is horrible, people still doing it. And I recall a lot of people pushing back on how many of the Relic+3 pieces were not worth the money, and then they made it anyways. It is inevitable. Odyssey grind is over, nothing to do besides old content, "might as well".

You might not know this community well if you don't think people will break their back to earn an extra few critical hit rate or whatever.
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 Ragnarok.Jessikah
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By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2021-11-04 13:04:03  
It'd be interesting if instead of grinding more experience points, new leveling/development systems only worked by clearing content as a specific job.

That way it wouldn't be about using the system to make oneself that tiny iota stronger and more of a "I actually use this job a lot, and it shows because I've got fancy rainbow stars instead of gold stars over my head" or something. It would be a byproduct of actually using that job, so your main jobs would stand out more.

In fact, I wouldn't doubt if that was the original intention behind even systems like Merit Points and Job Points in the first place. But anywhere players can find that 0.001% strength boost, we see as a means to an end instead of as an end itself.
 Shiva.Thorny
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By Shiva.Thorny 2021-11-04 13:06:35  
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
an extra few critical hit rate

It reads like it's just going to be STR/DEX/etc not specialty stats. If you go back to when job points were released, people were not thrilled to jump into it and it only became expected and common once a ton of boosts were given to both pacing and results.

I'm sure diehards will farm it, but I don't think it's going to be content worth logging in for to the average player.
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By Mattelot 2021-11-04 13:11:16  
It will depend how much you can grind out.

If you're talking 10-ish STR, it will be high hanging fruit.

If it's quite a bit, I can see some people botting grinding out these stats to stay on top.
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By Pantafernando 2021-11-04 13:17:55  
Permanent boost all jobs.

No doubt, it will be a big hit
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By SimonSes 2021-11-04 13:23:16  
Empy gear +3 will be MR5. Requires Master Rank 5, which will be 2100 Master Levels to equip :D
 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2021-11-04 13:28:01  
Shiva.Thorny said: »
If you go back to when job points were released, people were not thrilled to jump into it and it only became expected and common once a ton of boosts were given to both pacing and results.

We are in a different time now. Back then there were still many things to do, and Job Points were just like a "hey, here's a cool way to expand your job". Also, not everyone knew of optimal ways to earn CP, nor were there all of the bonuses available that later came. I think the difference here is that there is practically nothing to do in the game once you've farmed Odyssey to death, so this is the first thing players can do that is new and fresh.

The base stats thing we have to wait and see what it all entails, but it could be more job-specific than just attributes. And with the amount of gear creep we now have available to us, including buffs and insane stat food, I can't see it being a measley +20 STR on your Warrior. That would amount to nothing.
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By SimonSes 2021-11-04 13:41:09  
I misunderstood or some people assuming you will need exp/CP for this? I dont think so. Sounds more like killing xxxx amount of mobs or x amount of hard mobs as alternate route.
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By Pantafernando 2021-11-04 13:45:21  
I also think its unlikely they gonna reuse current "currency"... because killing all shitz hoarded is what they have been doing for quite some time already
 Valefor.Prothescar
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2021-11-04 14:08:51  
Some dudes be trippin about this. Depending on the amount of extra base stats this could still be good. More fSTR, more acc, better crit rates, less TP feed to mobs, higher dINT...

Base stats do plenty of things, especially on high level enemies. Let's just wait and see how big the boosts are before we ***.

Assuming everything that currently gives CP will also give master points or whatever (big assumption but I digress) you will just get them passively by doing ***like Omen and Odyssey anyway.
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By ksoze 2021-11-04 14:12:22  
might be by turning in your extra job points?
 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2021-11-04 14:17:45  
Using already gained jp would be silly.

You'll have to use GP (good points, cause you have to be good at the game to earn them), that you earn the same way, by killing trashmobs, but it's new. And slower. no bonus points on kills. and you have to get a new cape to double your points. from new shitty FANTASTIC content they won't add until next year. it's totally different.
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 Valefor.Prothescar
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2021-11-04 14:19:53  
If you can use already accumulated JP then it is going to be like Oboro; a shitload of points, way more than 500 per level.
 Asura.Azagarth
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By Asura.Azagarth 2021-11-04 14:31:49  
maybe it just closes the racial gaps in ffxi to be politically correct that taru and elves should have the same STR
 Fenrir.Melphina
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By Fenrir.Melphina 2021-11-04 14:52:11  
Quote:
And with the amount of gear creep we now have available to us, including buffs and insane stat food, I can't see it being a measley +20 STR on your Warrior. That would amount to nothing.


You underestimate how important base stats are, especially with weaponskills that have high stat mods and large fTP scaling. Savage blade or rudra's storm anyone? My thief and dancer would love an extra 20 dex, because with rudra's storm 4-5 dex is worth 1 WSD, so 20 dex is worth about 5 WSD. That's the same effect you get from equipping an Epaminondas's Ring, and that thing sells for friggin 50 million gil. And it's a permanent character boost, so it doesn't even affect your wardrobe capacity! That's the kind of bonus that players drool over.
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 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2021-11-04 14:55:02  
Fenrir.Melphina said: »
because with rudra's storm 4-5 dex is worth 1 WSD, meaning 20 dex is the same as 5 WSD

Isn't this an overgeneralization that doesn't factor in diminishing returns?
 Fenrir.Melphina
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By Fenrir.Melphina 2021-11-04 14:59:51  
Quote:
Isn't this an overgeneralization that doesn't factor in diminishing returns?

Somewhat, but it's still pretty accurate because of the way the weaponskill calculations work. Base stats affect WSC, which is then multiplied by fTP and then by WSD. We've gotten so much WSD lately that with rudra's generous TP scaling that ratio is still very reliable. Savage blade follows the same truth, especially for the jobs that can use a TP bonus weapon to increase its consistency. Monk's weaponskills, leaden salute, aeolian edge.... they all follow similar trends. Base stats matter just as much now as they ever have.

Also keep in mind that base stats are at the opposite end of the equation as WSD, so the more WSD we get the more impactful base stats become. When one end of the equation becomes top heavy then increasing the other end has growing returns. With JSE capes and nyame gear and epa ring and all the other WSD gear we have now I wouldn't be surprised if 20 base stats made the generalizations hold more true.
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By SimonSes 2021-11-04 15:10:15  
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Fenrir.Melphina said: »
because with rudra's storm 4-5 dex is worth 1 WSD, meaning 20 dex is the same as 5 WSD

Isn't this an overgeneralization that doesn't factor in diminishing returns?

It kinda is. 20DEX is something like +3.6% to current bis set. Dagger is also very specific, because it has very low damage, so WSC takes highest part of WS base damage.

For example 20VIT for Torcleaver, which is also 80% modifier, only increase damage by around 2.3%

EDIT: 20STR for Vsmite is ~2.58%, not counting fSTR

EDIT2: There is a lot of WSs that will need +20 to few Stats, because WSC is split and just 20 in one is like less than 1%. For example Insurgency with it's 20%STR/20%INT or Expiacion with 30%STR/30%INT/20%DEX and many more WSs with various split of 30%/30% or 40%/40% or 20%/50% etc.
 Asura.Arico
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By Asura.Arico 2021-11-04 15:24:17  
SimonSes said: »
For example 20VIT for Torcleaver, which is also 80% modifier, only increase damage by around 2.3%

If it means I can show the other DRK in my dynamis group he's trash, I'll do it.
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 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2021-11-04 15:25:54  
How much is irrelevant.

I can't wait for the "discussion" (argument) about which stat on which job I should raise first and the 300 clonethreads through 2025. I just got back and I bought master but I'm not sure which stat I should raise first, who wants to play my character for me?

I can't even properly convey my excitement with a gif that matches the tone. None of them are quite strong enough to rise to the occasion.
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