Items Updated - 2018.07.09

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Items Updated - 2018.07.09
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By Rooks 2018-07-09 17:59:49  
Enjoy.
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 Asura.Geriond
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By Asura.Geriond 2018-07-09 18:00:09  
Hooray for idiot boy!
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 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-07-09 18:01:36  
That's a lot of idiot tax on whm torques kemistry made out
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By Asura.Toralin 2018-07-09 18:37:22  
Asura.Eiryl said: »
That's a lot of idiot tax on whm torques kemistry made out
Not sure I follow?

Waktza Crest, .65m
Dark Matter 2m
Khoma Thread 1.1m
Seedstone Crystal 3m
Moldy Torque 3m
Total: 9.75m

He is selling them for 8-9m.... What am I missing?
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 Asura.Geriond
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By Asura.Geriond 2018-07-09 18:48:36  
He's saying that he managed to find someone willing to buy the +2 for 300m, despite the only current difference being 5% cure potency and 20 mp.
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By Justuas 2018-07-09 18:57:19  
Asura.Geriond said: »
He's saying that he managed to find someone willing to buy the +2 for 300m, despite the only current difference being 5% cure potency and 20 mp.
Every 0.1% performance increase counts.
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By Bahamut.Agerine 2018-07-09 20:36:22  
Praise be unto idiot boy when he do what he can!
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By Leviathan.Kingkitt 2018-07-10 00:55:48  
300m? I'll sell my +2 RDM torque right now for that, and buy another one when price drops in a few months lol
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-07-10 01:36:55  
Leviathan.Kingkitt said: »
300m? I'll sell my +2 RDM torque right now for that, and buy another one when price drops in a few months days lol

^ This is how you're supposed to play. Let someone else pay idiot tax

Being the first to own something isn't special, it just means you weren't smart enough to sell it.
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By Nyarlko 2018-07-10 06:30:27  
Asura.Eiryl said: »
Leviathan.Kingkitt said: »
300m? I'll sell my +2 RDM torque right now for that, and buy another one when price drops in a few months days lol

^ This is how you're supposed to play. Let someone else pay idiot tax

Being the first to own something isn't special, it just means you weren't smart enough to sell it.

It's also quite possible that the price will hold steady (or even increase) once we find out about the incoming augments..
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By Bismarck.Laurelli 2018-07-10 07:42:44  
OMG, stop calling people stupid and idiot when they do something differently from what you would do. It's not real money. People who spend 300M on something are not giving up food or rent. Gil is fake money.

Feels like people are so insecure they need to laugh at everyone else just to feel better about themselves.
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 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-07-10 08:24:20  
"Idiot tax" is not calling anyone an idiot.

Bismarck.Laurelli said: »
OMG, stop calling people stupid and idiot when they do something differently from what you would do. It's not real money. People who spend 300M on something are not giving up food or rent. Gil is fake money.

And it is real money. If it can be sold, then it has value. It's loosely why there is such a big deal with "loot boxes". While not being "directly" gambling. They do have "real world value".
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-07-10 08:28:21  
Nyarlko said: »
Asura.Eiryl said: »
Leviathan.Kingkitt said: »
300m? I'll sell my +2 RDM torque right now for that, and buy another one when price drops in a few months days lol

^ This is how you're supposed to play. Let someone else pay idiot tax

Being the first to own something isn't special, it just means you weren't smart enough to sell it.

It's also quite possible that the price will hold steady (or even increase) once we find out about the incoming augments..

Extremely unlikely.

The initial prices are always inflated by 2~3x the actual market value due to non-existent supply vs initial demand. After a few weeks the supply has stabilized and the demand has leveled off. Even if SE introduces decent augments, the pattern will repeat on a smaller scale.

This is why it's called an "idiot tax", its a rush of people trying to buy something that's value is going to plummet and be much cheaper within a week or two.
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By fonewear 2018-07-10 08:37:32  
Bismarck.Laurelli said: »
OMG, stop calling people stupid and idiot when they do something differently from what you would do. It's not real money. People who spend 300M on something are not giving up food or rent. Gil is fake money.

Feels like people are so insecure they need to laugh at everyone else just to feel better about themselves.

They don't understand that items value declines over time. It's really that simple.

There really is no rational reason to overpay for something because it is new.
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By Asura.Geriond 2018-07-10 08:46:35  
Asura.Eiryl said: »
"Idiot tax" is not calling anyone an idiot.

Bismarck.Laurelli said: »
OMG, stop calling people stupid and idiot when they do something differently from what you would do. It's not real money. People who spend 300M on something are not giving up food or rent. Gil is fake money.

And it is real money. If it can be sold, then it has value. It's loosely why there is such a big deal with "loot boxes". While not being "directly" gambling. They do have "real world value".
It's only real money if the person parting with said gil would ever consider selling for said money at any point.
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 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-07-10 08:47:55  
Common misconception.

Whether you actually sell it or not, it still has value.

Actually, addendum, it only has value because most of you think it has no value. If everyone sold it wouldn't be worth anything lol.
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By Asura.Geriond 2018-07-10 08:52:25  
It doesn't have effective real life value (when on your person) if there are literally no circumstances where it would be converted into real life value. If you throw a ton of gold into the sun, it still technically has monetary value, but not real value, because it can't ever be exchanged or used.
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-07-10 09:18:26  
Asura.Geriond said: »
It doesn't have effective real life value (when on your person) if there are literally no circumstances where it would be converted into real life value. If you throw a ton of gold into the sun, it still technically has monetary value, but not real value, because it can't ever be exchanged or used.

Time = Money

Currency is just a numerical representation of someone's time, thus when someone spends X of currency Y they are really spending time. Time always has value.
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By Asura.Geriond 2018-07-10 09:20:02  
Asura.Saevel said: »
Asura.Geriond said: »
It doesn't have effective real life value (when on your person) if there are literally no circumstances where it would be converted into real life value. If you throw a ton of gold into the sun, it still technically has monetary value, but not real value, because it can't ever be exchanged or used.

Time = Money

Currency is just a numerical representation of someone's time, thus when someone spends X of currency Y they are really spending time. Time always has value.
Time only has monetary value if there were any circumstances where you'd have instead been using that time to create real life value of some kind.
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-07-10 09:21:40  
Asura.Geriond said: »
Time only has monetary value if there were any circumstances where you'd have instead been using that time to create real life value of some kind.

That's literally every second you're logged in. You could be out networking, or improving your life, or cooking prep meals, workin OT etc etc etc etc
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By Asura.Geriond 2018-07-10 09:24:07  
Asura.Eiryl said: »
Asura.Geriond said: »
Time only has monetary value if there were any circumstances where you'd have instead been using that time to create real life value of some kind.

That's literally every second you're logged in. You could be out networking, or improving your life, or cooking prep meals, workin OT etc etc etc etc
Only if you're willing to do those things. If you are not willing at all to do anything else monetarily value-based during the time you spend on FFXI, that time doesn't have monetary value because even if you didn't use it on FFXI, it would still never be "used".


Regardless, this is off topic (well, doubly off topic); talking about direct monetary value is different from talking about indirect opportunity cost, and my original point was about the former.
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 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-07-10 09:34:57  
I mean, this thread doesn't even have a topic. It wasn't even a thread to be a thread... so, can it really be off topic?
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By Nyarlko 2018-07-10 09:44:41  
Asura.Saevel said: »
Nyarlko said: »
Asura.Eiryl said: »
Leviathan.Kingkitt said: »
300m? I'll sell my +2 RDM torque right now for that, and buy another one when price drops in a few months days lol

^ This is how you're supposed to play. Let someone else pay idiot tax

Being the first to own something isn't special, it just means you weren't smart enough to sell it.

It's also quite possible that the price will hold steady (or even increase) once we find out about the incoming augments..

Extremely unlikely.

The initial prices are always inflated by 2~3x the actual market value due to non-existent supply vs initial demand. After a few weeks the supply has stabilized and the demand has leveled off. Even if SE introduces decent augments, the pattern will repeat on a smaller scale.

This is why it's called an "idiot tax", its a rush of people trying to buy something that's value is going to plummet and be much cheaper within a week or two.

Even at the low end of prices (ie: pre-update) we were looking at ~20mil per weapon synth (plus cost for Demon's Medal) and ~7-8mil per neck synth. Those prices have gone up since the update, so unless there is some catch that we don't know of yet, the idiot tax on these items is not actually that large a portion of the current prices. I also expect +2's to come down a bit, but I don't see less than 200mil happening anytime soon unless the augments flat-out suck, and even then, certain ones may still retain their value just due to their base stats.
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-07-10 09:59:39  
Asura.Geriond said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
Asura.Geriond said: »
It doesn't have effective real life value (when on your person) if there are literally no circumstances where it would be converted into real life value. If you throw a ton of gold into the sun, it still technically has monetary value, but not real value, because it can't ever be exchanged or used.

Time = Money

Currency is just a numerical representation of someone's time, thus when someone spends X of currency Y they are really spending time. Time always has value.
Time only has monetary value if there were any circumstances where you'd have instead been using that time to create real life value of some kind.

Other way around, Money isn't the universal currency Time is.

Currency ~always~ has Time value and Time always has value. When you spend currency, both real and virtual, there is a time value attached to that. How long did it take person X to generate currency Y, that time is the basis for the value of that currency. Even materials costs is just an expression of someone else's time since someone had to gather or produce those materials.
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-07-10 10:03:47  
Nyarlko said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
Nyarlko said: »
Asura.Eiryl said: »
Leviathan.Kingkitt said: »
300m? I'll sell my +2 RDM torque right now for that, and buy another one when price drops in a few months days lol

^ This is how you're supposed to play. Let someone else pay idiot tax

Being the first to own something isn't special, it just means you weren't smart enough to sell it.

It's also quite possible that the price will hold steady (or even increase) once we find out about the incoming augments..

Extremely unlikely.

The initial prices are always inflated by 2~3x the actual market value due to non-existent supply vs initial demand. After a few weeks the supply has stabilized and the demand has leveled off. Even if SE introduces decent augments, the pattern will repeat on a smaller scale.

This is why it's called an "idiot tax", its a rush of people trying to buy something that's value is going to plummet and be much cheaper within a week or two.

Even at the low end of prices (ie: pre-update) we were looking at ~20mil per weapon synth (plus cost for Demon's Medal) and ~7-8mil per neck synth. Those prices have gone up since the update, so unless there is some catch that we don't know of yet, the idiot tax on these items is not actually that large a portion of the current prices. I also expect +2's to come down a bit, but I don't see less than 200mil happening anytime soon unless the augments flat-out suck, and even then, certain ones may still retain their value just due to their base stats.

Umm the "idiot tax" is about 10x right now because Crafting Shields exist. Your looking at the prices for the NQ's yet NQ's should be rare of simply not exist, it's the +1's we should be basing our cost estimates on. The +2's are going to be super expensive because the Shields don't protect you from producing a +1 and +2's are a fraction of the rate of +1's.
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By Asura.Geriond 2018-07-10 10:14:01  
Asura.Saevel said: »
Asura.Geriond said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
Asura.Geriond said: »
It doesn't have effective real life value (when on your person) if there are literally no circumstances where it would be converted into real life value. If you throw a ton of gold into the sun, it still technically has monetary value, but not real value, because it can't ever be exchanged or used.

Time = Money

Currency is just a numerical representation of someone's time, thus when someone spends X of currency Y they are really spending time. Time always has value.
Time only has monetary value if there were any circumstances where you'd have instead been using that time to create real life value of some kind.

Other way around, Money isn't the universal currency Time is.

Currency ~always~ has Time value and Time always has value. When you spend currency, both real and virtual, there is a time value attached to that. How long did it take person X to generate currency Y, that time is the basis for the value of that currency. Even materials costs is just an expression of someone else's time since someone had to gather or produce those materials.
I was making no claim as to what the most basic currency is, and was talking specifically about monetary value, not all types of value. As soon as you invest time into something, it immediately loses at least some degree of potential monetary value, up to possibly all of it.
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-07-10 10:28:45  
Asura.Geriond said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
Asura.Geriond said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
Asura.Geriond said: »
It doesn't have effective real life value (when on your person) if there are literally no circumstances where it would be converted into real life value. If you throw a ton of gold into the sun, it still technically has monetary value, but not real value, because it can't ever be exchanged or used.

Time = Money

Currency is just a numerical representation of someone's time, thus when someone spends X of currency Y they are really spending time. Time always has value.
Time only has monetary value if there were any circumstances where you'd have instead been using that time to create real life value of some kind.

Other way around, Money isn't the universal currency Time is.

Currency ~always~ has Time value and Time always has value. When you spend currency, both real and virtual, there is a time value attached to that. How long did it take person X to generate currency Y, that time is the basis for the value of that currency. Even materials costs is just an expression of someone else's time since someone had to gather or produce those materials.
I was making no claim as to what the most basic currency is, and was talking specifically about monetary value, not all types of value.


Quote:
Time only has monetary value if there were any circumstances where you'd have instead been using that time to create real life value of some kind.

Time = Money

If A = B and B = C, then A = C

All things ultimately have a time value, and thus all things also have a currency value. RMT functions on the concept that they can spend their time creating value that is then sold to someone else. That other person is using their time to generate value that is being used to pay for the RMT's time. Ultimately all transactions are just exchanges of time.

Your only thinking of direct first order exchanges without taking into account the much bigger picture. You typing on this forum is you spending your time for something you feel has value. When you buy something at the store your spending your time to acquire something that itself is representative of thousands of other peoples time.
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By Asura.Geriond 2018-07-10 10:31:23  
Time = Money is a gross oversimplification, and is not true in all situations. Just because it's the primary (but not only) basis for currency and means of trade does not mean that said relationship does not vary due to circumstances, nor does it mean that time spent always has monetary value.
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By Asura.Saevel 2018-07-10 10:37:03  
Asura.Geriond said: »
Time = Money is a gross oversimplification, and is not true in all situations.

It's 100% true in all situations across the universe.

Time is a universal currency, you only have a limited amount of it and it can never be created. Once Time is spent it can never be regained again. Money is just a numerical representation of somebodies time. Because time has different value to different people, currencies are created as a universal method of exchanging that time.

Again you have the relationship reversed, Time is the universal currency, Money is just a way to represent it numerically. Because of that relationship, Time = Money is always true to all things in all places. Someone not realizing it's true doesn't stop it from being such.
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