Low Man Kirin

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2010-06-21
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Low man Kirin
 Caitsith.Mahayaya
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By Caitsith.Mahayaya 2011-11-01 22:41:30  
Nah, a half-decent RDM/NIN can hold forever even without movement speed. Just have to keep moving. Well, at 95 you can probably bind and gravity accurately so don't really even need to worry about running all the time.

Just make sure nobody does any actions on the RDM/NIN kiter since RDM has since lost the ability to build hate quickly.

THF and SAM make terrible kiters for this since they can't heal themselves and a lot of what Kirin does will bypass shadows. 2-4 bad hits and they're toast. RDM/NIN will have no issues whatsoever as long as they use bind/gravity when/if they need it.
 
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 Caitsith.Mahayaya
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By Caitsith.Mahayaya 2011-11-01 22:46:47  
As far as doing Kirin with 3, that might be pushing it unless you're all well geared and skilled. Though 4 is probably safe: 2 strong DDs, 1 healer, 1 RDM/NIN for kiting and additional help for Genbu when he 2hrs.
 Bahamut.Aeronis
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By Bahamut.Aeronis 2011-11-01 22:55:04  
There's a video of an Ukon WAR and PD SMN duoing it.
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 Fenrir.Skadoosh
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By Fenrir.Skadoosh 2011-11-01 22:57:03  
It does say he's resistant to bind/grav, I take it thats not the case as a 95 RDM? Anyways, I just really don't want to wipe.. Think a jug pet could hold Kirin for a good 12 minutes or whatever it takes?
 Leviathan.Draylo
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By Leviathan.Draylo 2011-11-01 22:58:03  
Thought that was fake and he had a brd somewhere, he seemed to be attacking really fast. I could definitely see a WAR SMN BRD doing it fairly easily, ukon war obviously.
 Caitsith.Mahayaya
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By Caitsith.Mahayaya 2011-11-01 22:59:55  
The exception isn't the rule. BLU or RDM may even be able to solo with enough luck/skill, but I doubt Skadoosh wants to waste a pop on an attempt. 4 average players at 95 who let Kirin pop all the summons has a good chance of winning. 3 average players who try to kill it before it summons starts to get a bit riskier.
 Fenrir.Nightfyre
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2011-11-01 23:00:19  
The SMN originally came BRD and he ??? locked buffs during job change iirc.
 Caitsith.Mahayaya
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By Caitsith.Mahayaya 2011-11-01 23:01:11  
Fenrir.Skadoosh said: »
It does say he's resistant to bind/grav, I take it thats not the case as a 95 RDM? Anyways, I just really don't want to wipe.. Think a jug pet could hold Kirin for a good 12 minutes or whatever it takes?

At 75, bind was nearly impossible to land, but you could still sometimes get gravity. At 85 both were relatively easy to land, so I imagine at 95 it should be no problem to land.

Dunno about BST, but keep in mind he spams a lot of TP moves so avoiding damage by evasion isn't going to help much.
 Ragnarok.Nemesio
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By Ragnarok.Nemesio 2011-11-01 23:04:18  
MNK WHM SMN THF could do np.

Did the other day with this and the fight lasted about a minute.
 Bahamut.Ecodin
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By Bahamut.Ecodin 2011-11-01 23:05:59  
Caitsith.Mahayaya said: »
The exception isn't the rule. BLU or RDM may even be able to solo with enough luck/skill, but I doubt Skadoosh wants to waste a pop on an attempt. 4 average players at 95 who let Kirin pop all the summons has a good chance of winning. 3 average players who try to kill it before it summons starts to get a bit riskier.

Soloing is asking a lot with its regen. My ls(only has 4 people) recently fought 3 kirins, rdm/nin(me and yes bind/grav stick easy but he does build some resistance, but I never resisted) 2x bst/nin and thf/nin(mandau). Overall was a really easy fight suzy was the hardest part firega 3 spam can be bad.
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 Caitsith.Mahayaya
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By Caitsith.Mahayaya 2011-11-01 23:11:10  
Bahamut.Ecodin said: »
Caitsith.Mahayaya said: »
The exception isn't the rule. BLU or RDM may even be able to solo with enough luck/skill, but I doubt Skadoosh wants to waste a pop on an attempt. 4 average players at 95 who let Kirin pop all the summons has a good chance of winning. 3 average players who try to kill it before it summons starts to get a bit riskier.

Soloing is asking a lot with its regen. My ls(only has 4 people) recently fought 3 kirins, rdm/nin(me and yes bind/grav stick easy but he does build some resistance, but I never resisted) 2x bst/nin and thf/nin(mandau). Overall was a really easy fight suzy was the hardest part firega 3 spam can be bad.

I'm just saying that just because WAR+SMN is doable, I wouldn't recommend it if you don't want to risk losing your pops.
 Fenrir.Nightfyre
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2011-11-01 23:14:18  
A nigh-invincible WAR with buffs puts out a shitton of damage without much issue and never even sees the adds, I have no idea how you're extrapolating that to BLU or RDM soloing it. You'd need to survive Kirin + add and actually kill each add before the next popped, then deal enough damage to break its fairly potent regen without dying in the process. Keep in mind that some of his moves can still one-shot or nearly so at 95 if you're not in -DT gear.

And a reminder: it was really WAR + BRD + SMN.
 Sylph.Suzanoo
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By Sylph.Suzanoo 2011-11-01 23:17:49  
Done kirin a number of times our setup was

rdm/nin kites it solo may need to send someone to wake him up occasionaly tho.

Then had a whm nin 2 smns and a thf waiting for the minis to spawn.
whm, thf, and the nin fight all the gods but suzaku normally, for suzaku we had the smns throw leviathans on it and just fight it away from everyone else. once the minis were down smns just spammed wind blade on kirin averaging about 1.5k-2k a hit with full merits
 Caitsith.Mahayaya
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By Caitsith.Mahayaya 2011-11-01 23:20:35  
Fenrir.Nightfyre said: »
A nigh-invincible WAR with buffs puts out a shitton of damage without much issue and never even sees the adds, I have no idea how you're extrapolating that to BLU or RDM soloing it. You'd need to survive Kirin + add and actually kill each add before the next popped, then deal enough damage to break its fairly potent regen without dying in the process. Keep in mind that some of his moves can still one-shot or nearly so at 95 if you're not in -DT gear.

The reason a SMN would be brought along for a WAR is to keep it alive. Without the SMN, it's as you said - some of his moves can still one-shot or nearly so at 95.

RDM or BLU bring "survivability" to the table. If you can bind/gravity(both of which are available to RDM+BLU) Kirin long enough to fight off the adds, you can potentially get to a point where it's just you vs. Kirin.

But again, I'm in no way suggesting someone try solo'ing it. I'm just say it may be possible, but just because it can be done doesn't mean you should recommend it to someone who just wants to kill Kirin and get his drops.
 Fenrir.Kut
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By Fenrir.Kut 2011-11-01 23:35:32  
It can be dual boxed by a MNK(Vere) and WHM. Start with 300% TP and 2 hour. Shouldn't last very long.

EDIT: This was at 90.
 Odin.Eikechi
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By Odin.Eikechi 2011-11-01 23:40:12  
Well ya Kut.. ODD with hundred fists is pretty silly dmg in a short period of time.

Edit: How much hp does Kirin have? I mean I'm not condoning this at all, but how well would an Azure Lore blu fair if he had like maybe a rdm for refresh 2? You can do some stupid SC dmg with Azure Lore up on blu these days with SC spam.
 Bismarck.Themuffingirl
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By Bismarck.Themuffingirl 2011-11-02 00:05:18  
Is astral flow still liable to one shot you if you get say, Carby on lightsday? Assuming merited shellra 5, I would assume it shouldn't be a big deal but thought I'd ask. Wanted to try this soon as I can get a PC up and running that will let me dual box again. I have a Twash THF and a WHM/RDM/BRD mule and a handful of Masa/Vere/Ukon friends to choose from but no SMNs with Alex (I could get it but I've been lazy about SMN since I never use it). Debating on how to go about kiting, assuming THF kiting is going to need some cures and hate could get screwy and drain the mule's MP. Not really sure how I feel about kiting and main healing the adds at the same time either. I was hoping to do like 3 pops in a row so 2 hour usage would be limited. Is one WHM/RDM enough to heal a small group in a "non-zerged" fight? I could bring my RDM and just get another non-empy THF for TH probably. Haven't touched Kirin since the 75 days, just the lessers outside that I know are a joke now.
 Bismarck.Themuffingirl
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By Bismarck.Themuffingirl 2011-11-02 00:06:35  
Odin.Eikechi said: »
Well ya Kut.. ODD with hundred fists is pretty silly dmg in a short period of time.

Edit: How much hp does Kirin have? I mean I'm not condoning this at all, but how well would an Azure Lore blu fair if he had like maybe a rdm for refresh 2? You can do some stupid SC dmg with Azure Lore up on blu these days with SC spam.

Kirin has about 60,000 HP
 Fenrir.Nightfyre
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2011-11-02 00:10:04  
Bismarck.Themuffingirl said: »
Is astral flow still liable to one shot you if you get say, Carby on lightsday?
It might, not sure. I'm pretty sure one of our DDs got oneshotted by Deadly Hold, the damage on that can still get pretty high.
 Cerberus.Stalkster
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By Cerberus.Stalkster 2011-11-02 00:39:01  
Astral flow + TP move could kill you. 8wins 3wipes Apoc(Taru)+Thf+Whm.
Be less as hard if more HP, lol.
 Leviathan.Korialstrasz
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By Leviathan.Korialstrasz 2011-11-02 00:45:36  
I'd imagine Astral Flow shouldn't be an issue at all these days. Even if you don't get -MDT gear on in time, shellra V + Sacrosanctity should make him barely even scratch you.
 Bahamut.Echojin
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By Bahamut.Echojin 2011-11-02 01:14:47  
Was able to 5 man Kirin at lvl 80 with 4 rdm and a thf.

95 should be cake... *edit* especially with sch 2hr
 Bismarck.Yamimarikk
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By Bismarck.Yamimarikk 2011-11-02 01:17:49  
Not too long ago maybe about 3-4 weeks ago my LS did a low man group on Kirin easily. Our first run was with a SAM/WAR,DRG/SAM,BRD,THF,RDM,SCH. SCH 2hr'd w/ Embrava and BRD kept up haste songs on us. He stepped in real quick to do Scherzo before AF popped off. Was quite easy. Even after Embrava wore we did x3 more runs the second run got rough for some reason and we all wiped but the SCH,BRD and RDM. They kited him easily while we recovered and got back on track. But had no real issues with the last two. On a side note did it like a week or so afterwards with about the same setup just a WAR instead of the SAM and had a SMN w/ Alexander, went much safer lol
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2011-11-02 01:27:58  
Embrava + haste songs

Wait, what? Embrava + haste = capped magic haste, or even Embrava + Victory March if people were too lazy to keep Haste on for some reason.
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 Asura.Mekaider
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By Asura.Mekaider 2011-11-02 01:54:52  
Does anyone think it's feasible for 2x RDM to duo?

1 doing the simpler job of just holding him. I generally just bind him to *** 'cause even @90 i found in prolonged fights he does build a resistance to gravity where it begins to wear noticeably quicker, whereas bind doesn't.

The other RDM would have to stock up on meds etc to keep mp high i would think. Wait for first pop, burn it up on nukes, convert, finish it up. Depending on killspeed maybe time to hMP. Should have enough mp left for second with a mp med. Third would be the same however instead of convert use meds and what not to burn through it. 4th isn't anywhere near as stressful as there's no time limit it needs to be burned by. Suzy shouldn't be as troublesome as always as it should be relatively simple to stick silence. I've never actually fought the lesser version as i'm usually playing with Kirin but i have stuck it to "real" Suzy.

Now for the main fight, iirc Kirin's regen is 50/tick?(Please correct if not) So in theory with a bio III, Poison II and perhaps another DoT, i actually don't remember if RDM get any more than that /NIN. That should negate the regen consideribly but i doubt it would entirely. Would most likely require a very aggressive nuking style from both RDM's (similar to UFO) to actually overcome regen properly. However maybe 1 RDM expending his mp and then the other stepping in alternately so there's never a gap where kirin isn't taking damage would be better? Honestly idk.

Seems feasible to me but i can't afford a pop set lol.
 Caitsith.Mahayaya
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By Caitsith.Mahayaya 2011-11-02 02:31:15  
I think it's possible, but feel like the one who holds Kirin should be able to contribute as well for the adds. You'd preferably want Genbu in between since you can drag him out somewhere and just avoid him if need be.

For Kirin, Saboteur'd Poison II(20hp/tick I think) and Bio III(11+hp/tick) should keep his regen low enough to where it isn't a big deal. 2 nukers should be able to down him no problem, have one rest and the other kite - then switch off when the other is rested.

Also "can't afford a popset" shouldn't matter since if you have 2 RDMs you can easily kill all pops for gods and the gods themselves.
 Fenrir.Nightfyre
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2011-11-02 02:32:20  
It's doable, it just takes a while because of the regen. Having them alternate kiting Kirin and taking down an add will probably be your most efficient method for that phase and should allow you to nuke > vert > nuke on every add if I remember correctly.
 Asura.Mekaider
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By Asura.Mekaider 2011-11-02 02:37:04  
Caitsith.Mahayaya said: »
Also "can't afford a popset" shouldn't matter since if you have 2 RDMs you can easily kill all pops for gods and the gods themselves.

And? Doesn't mean i have the time to do so.
 Asura.Mekaider
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By Asura.Mekaider 2011-11-02 02:37:52  
Fenrir.Nightfyre said: »
It's doable, it just takes a while because of the regen. Having them alternate kiting Kirin and taking down an add will probably be your most efficient method for that phase and should allow you too nuke > vert > nuke on every add if I remember correctly.

Actually i never thought of that, would negate the need for temps entirely.
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