Macros And Indi/Geo Utilization Question

言語: JP EN DE FR
2010-06-21
New Items
users online
フォーラム » FFXI » Jobs » Geomancer » Macros and Indi/Geo Utilization Question
Macros and Indi/Geo Utilization Question
 Asura.Miroku
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Miroku
Posts: 7
By Asura.Miroku 2015-11-29 01:36:09  
Recently decided to pick up my Geomancer again and make a new macro set for higher level shenanigans. Since I haven't played with Geo (mine or others) in a high level setting, I'm wondering what spells are usually used as Indi-'s and which ones are usually used as Geo-'s.

From what I gather, people will generally do Indi-Focus/Geo-Languor if they're staying back with other mages, and Indi-Frailty/Geo-Torpor if they plan on staying in melee range. Are there any other "combos" I should know about before I get used to an organizational system that isn't optimal.

Thanks!
 Phoenix.Libbien
Offline
サーバ: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
user: Alttp
Posts: 314
By Phoenix.Libbien 2015-11-29 02:01:11  
The bubbles you use will largely depend on the party setup as you said, but also the difficulty of the content you are taking on. The higher you go, the more you need to focus on acc/macc rather than atk/matk. Here are some fairly common combos though...

Indi Precision / Geo Torpor
Indi Fury / Geo Frailty
Indi Frailty / Geo Torpor (typically for pets)
Indi Attunement / Geo Vex (to resist magic/status effects)
Indi Focus / Geo Lang
Indi Acumen / Geo Malaise

There are numerous other combos to use, but those are your most common. That said, keep in mind that geo spells are more potent than indi spells due to ja enhancements and such, so when you are mixing buffs like acc+ / def- or macc+ / mdef-, use the geo version of whichever stat is more important for that content. If you're doing something 135+, it will almost certainly be acc/macc related unless you're on defensive bubbles.
[+]
 Asura.Miroku
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Miroku
Posts: 7
By Asura.Miroku 2015-11-29 02:43:03  
Awesome, thanks! So Bubbles will almost always be debuffs, and Indi are primarily used as party buffs. Simple enough. Would I be wrong in assuming that Entrust + Indi-debuffs aren't really worth it and should be reserved for something like Haste or Refresh?
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: swordwiz
Posts: 216
By Asura.Lordoftheseven 2015-11-29 11:33:42  
Entrust can be used to help with what ever is lacking e.i acc refresh def down on mob etc. Also to think that indi as for party buffing only and geo spells are only for debuffing is incorrect they can be used in many differnt combos also geo bublles are more potent because of geomancy+ stuff (dunna/idris) aswell as ja's
 Asura.Darvamos
VIP
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Demmis
Posts: 234
By Asura.Darvamos 2015-11-29 11:46:31  
Asura.Lordoftheseven said: »
also geo bublles are more potent because of geomancy+ stuff (dunna/idris) aswell as ja's
While most of what you said is sound. I hate to see wrong info like this get posted as fact. While yes the JA's, besides Bolster, only help Geocolure spells. The Geomancy + Gear helps Indicolure spells unless they are entrusted..
[+]
 Asura.Sechs
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Akumasama
Posts: 9876
By Asura.Sechs 2015-11-29 13:16:16  
Not sure if it has ever been tested but I *think* the tiers you get from geomancy skill do affect entrusted bubbles.
It's just the Geomancy+ (Idris and Dunna) that doesn't effect entrusted bubbles.

Hope someone can provide some data, I'm not 100% sure on this.



And yeah I confirm what Darvamos has said. Bubbles have potency tiers and you reach those with combined Geomancy/Handbell skill, cap is 900 combined skill.
Geomancy+ (unique stat on Idris and Dunna) is a different thing.
All of these affect both GEO- bubbles and Indi- Bubbles.
Duration of course only affect Indi bubbles and Blaze of Glory/Ecliptic Attrition (they do stack between themselves btw, but neither stacks with Bolster) only affect Geo- Bubbles.
 Asura.Darvamos
VIP
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Demmis
Posts: 234
By Asura.Darvamos 2015-11-29 13:34:55  
Skill does matter for entrust.
Offline
Posts: 369
By swordwiz 2015-11-30 03:21:07  
sechs i have tested it and no geomancy+ gear only works for geo spells . The geomancy and geomancy skill + are 2 very different things but yes the 900 skill does effect entrusted indi spells as its a 2nd indi spell
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: swordwiz
Posts: 216
By Asura.Lordoftheseven 2015-11-30 03:22:42  
@sechs yes skill does effect entrusted indi spells as there a 2nd bubble so would be the same effect you cast on yourself
 Asura.Darvamos
VIP
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Demmis
Posts: 234
By Asura.Darvamos 2015-11-30 03:37:06  
swordwiz said: »
sechs i have tested it and no geomancy+ gear only works for geo spells . The geomancy and geomancy skill + are 2 very different things but yes the 900 skill does effect entrusted indi spells as its a 2nd indi spell
You did some bad testing then. Did a real simple test to confirm prior testing:

Indi-Precision
Base Acc:736
844 Skill No geo+ Acc: 759 (Used Incantor's Torque for 10 Handbell and 10 Geomancy Skill)
842 Skill Geo + 5:807 (Used Dunna for 18 skill and GEO +5)

My skill isn't spot on because I was trying to account for Dunna's +18 Handbelll skill for a new tier.

That proves GEO + is working on Indi spells.

Same test Def this time:

Indi-Barrier
Base: 766
844 Skill: 948
842 + Geo +5: 1235

Update: Just to also show values for using the Geo-Presicion.
GEO-Presicion
Base Acc: 736
844 Skill No Geo +: 759
842 Skill Geo + 5: 807
Offline
Posts: 369
By swordwiz 2015-11-30 03:48:52  
No your right i got mixed up with entrusting spells vs normal casting as you lose the geomancy + on entrust my bad >.<
 Asura.Darvamos
VIP
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Demmis
Posts: 234
By Asura.Darvamos 2015-11-30 03:52:25  
swordwiz said: »
No your right i got mixed up with entrusting spells vs normal casting as you lose the geomancy + on entrust my bad >.<
No problem, that is 100% correct on entrusting. I just didn't want bad info like that getting out into the wild. If new GEO starting thinking that it would be horrible. Since GEO+ is so powerful.
 Asura.Sesono
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Zyanide
Posts: 95
By Asura.Sesono 2015-11-30 03:53:15  
Asura.Miroku said: »
Awesome, thanks! So Bubbles will almost always be debuffs, and Indi are primarily used as party buffs. Simple enough. Would I be wrong in assuming that Entrust + Indi-debuffs aren't really worth it and should be reserved for something like Haste or Refresh?
Its not always like that and not that easy either :D It all comes down to the situation. Also, i ask the party which bubbles they prefer (i've heared the weirdest combinations already^^) and i sure entrust whenever i can since its as powerful as your other indi spells... but not right away, i rather keep it a bit into the fight if content is higher than 130. So i can react if something goes wrong later on or w/e ...entrust can be anything, more atk, more def, or haste or refresh, depends on how the fight is going.

You get the "feeling" after playing a while ;)

btw. i thought "geomancy" on gear ment combined skill (handbell/geomancy skill) and buffs the spells itself too.
However, after reaching 900 skill, through JP, shall i keep getting higher? Or keep it at 900 and just change gear to boost other things like drain/aspir or SS or enfeebles?
 Asura.Darvamos
VIP
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Demmis
Posts: 234
By Asura.Darvamos 2015-11-30 04:04:25  
900 skill is the cap SE has in place atm anything higher will do nothing for you. Geomancy + is a totally different thing and its super powerful it has no set % increase it does for spells its on a spell to spell basis of what it does but all are very strong increases.

On GEO you should be aiming for 900 Skill + Dunna (Geomancy +5).
Asura.Sesono said: »
and i sure entrust whenever i can since its as powerful as your other indi spells...
This is part of what the last few posts were partly about... Entrusted spells are great but they are not as strong as non-entrusted spells if your using Geomancy + (Bells/Idris). Which I'll state you should always be using atleast a +5 Geomancy Bell. Nepote Bell is 5-20k on like every server if you can't afford a Dunna.

Asura.Sesono said: »
btw. i thought "geomancy" on gear ment combined skill (handbell/geomancy skill) and buffs the spells itself too.
Also Geomancy + does not give combined handbell/geomancy skill it simply just buffs the spells.
 Asura.Sechs
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Akumasama
Posts: 9876
By Asura.Sechs 2015-11-30 04:15:05  
Yeah, we can blame SE for using such a confusing wording, it makes talking about it confusing.
Darvamos explained pretty much everything but allow me to emphasize furthermore.

Geomancy Skill + / Handbell Skill + - You get these Skills naturally as you level up. You can also get bonuses to those skills from Gift and from gear. The sum of your current Geomancy Skill + Handbell Skill = combined skill. The number of your combined skill decides the potency of your Indi and Geo bubbles. It goes up in tiers and it currently caps at 900. That means once you've reached 900, adding more skill will produce no result in the potency of your bubbles.

Geomancy + - This is different from the Skill. It's an unique stat only found on Dunna and Idris. This greatly empowers your bubbles. Consider as for each "Geomancy +" you were bumping the potency of your bubbles up a tier. It's completely separate from the "combined skill" and has nothing to do with it. As a matter of fact this will allow you to increase the potency of your bubles well above the 900 combined skill cap.
Geomancy +10 roughly corresponds to 2x potency of your bubble. Geomancy +5 (dunna) roughly corresponds to 1,5 more potency. So 100% and 50% potency respectively.
 Asura.Darvamos
VIP
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Demmis
Posts: 234
By Asura.Darvamos 2015-11-30 04:19:04  
Geomancy + is found on a few Bells besides Dunna, with that said only one other one besides Dunna even matters: Nepote Bell +5 like a Dunna but should only be used since its so cheap (5k-20k) till you get yourself a Dunna.

I only posted this because I want any fresh 99 GEO to know there is a cheaper option that is quite powerful. Instead of not having anything because they can't afford a Dunna yet.
[+]
 Asura.Sesono
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Zyanide
Posts: 95
By Asura.Sesono 2015-11-30 05:12:08  
Asura.Darvamos said: »
900 skill is the cap SE has in place atm anything higher will do nothing for you. Geomancy + is a totally different thing and its super powerful it has no set % increase it does for spells its on a spell to spell basis of what it does but all are very strong increases.

On GEO you should be aiming for 900 Skill + Dunna (Geomancy +5).
Asura.Sesono said: »
and i sure entrust whenever i can since its as powerful as your other indi spells...
This is part of what the last few posts were partly about... Entrusted spells are great but they are not as strong as non-entrusted spells if your using Geomancy + (Bells/Idris). Which I'll state you should always be using atleast a +5 Geomancy Bell. Nepote Bell is 5-20k on like every server if you can't afford a Dunna.

Asura.Sesono said: »
btw. i thought "geomancy" on gear ment combined skill (handbell/geomancy skill) and buffs the spells itself too.
Also Geomancy + does not give combined handbell/geomancy skill it simply just buffs the spells.

I see where this is going... Idris or gtfo -.-
Would be nice to have but its a huge pile of gil you have to sink into this weapon. At the rate i can collect HP Bayld atm it would take me another 11 Years worth playing time to get one >_<

Dunna is cheap and easy to get imo - 1 mio or a few low man delve runs, not too hard at all. The really hard thing is to get to 900 skill, if you dont have a constantly playing group to CP with - even on Asura Apex party shouts are rare =/ And if you happen to get into one... (oh well thats a whole other discussion^^).
 Asura.Darvamos
VIP
Offline
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Demmis
Posts: 234
By Asura.Darvamos 2015-11-30 05:24:34  
Well Idris is awesome to have but I don't have one atm working on it but no wheres near it complete.

To further expand on this from what I've seen on Asura most groups/LSes I have helped out are happy to find a GEO that knows what they are doing even if no Idris. Now I have noticed a lot of groups do want 900 skill lately which makes sense.

Also half the Idris GEOs I have been in party with on Asura seemed to have an Idris and no other sets for geo. Can you enfeeble that? nope, nuke? umm nope. Sadly most groups will still take an Idris GEO over a well geared none one. Which sucks but I totally understand why and would do it myself as long as they know what there doing when it comes to bubbles. But it doesn't really matter since there is not a ton of Idris running around.

Also this pretty much goes with any R/E/M/ person there are the people that get and don't have the skill or gear to back it up. I just happen to notice it more often on GEOs probably because at this point there isn't 100 of them running around compared to other R/E/M/ types at this point.
Log in to post.