Dual Wield

Ive been away from thf for a while now but i was wondering something

With just the base dw job trait on thf it isnt better then sub nin correct?

i was wondering if thf dw + the enhances dual wield neck piece(forgot the name) and that dual wield dagger would make it viable to sub something other then nin?

thanks

DW gets better as you add more, so all that extra DW would actually make /NIN more desirable.

Not that you should wear those pieces though. Charis Necklace is DNC JSE and Auric is outdated now.

It's not as potent as /NIN, and no, because those items would stack with the higher DW too.

Edit: Okay beaten

Thief only got dual wield 1 at lv83 so thanks to SE we got another useless ability. Considering you get more DW subbing dnc or nin kinda makes it redundant

Real THF's sub BLM to D2 the alliance of useful jobs after their TH fails again.

Yea, I D2 bsts all the time

Or WHM to haste/Debuff Party members as their TH is failing

I`m not gonna get into an argument with THF haters, point is, THF got a pointless JT, nin gets it at 10, dnc got it at 20. The only 2 subs thf really uses and they both give more DW than we get natively.

Auric sucks now? What do you use? Kila+1 and Rapidus? but can't thf hit the haste cap already without Rapidus Sax?

Still a better dagger, Auric was good at 80, trial daggers have more than enough D to beat the DW enhancement. Sax is low delay too.

but isn't the subtle+10 kinda nice on auric? (i'm honestly not a dnc or thf, but im curious as i'm taking dnc up kinda soon and i might get thf past 71 one of these days lulz)

Not as nice as raw DPS no

I thought thf wasn't necessarily a DPS heavy job anyways, or dnc for that matter... /shrug idk just asking questions, honestly not trolling. I am not a top end thf by any means here....which is why I'm asking

Wat

All you're missing is the various delay reductions. While those are nice they aren't the end all of everything. You'll get the 15% reduction of DW II if you sub dancer, which can really aid your survivability. IMO, use any sub you want that makes sense to you.

It is nice as part of a Subtle Blow build, though you can get high/capped Subtle Blow without it on DNC and even still cap haste. It's better for DNC than THF given DNC's high natural DW, but there are still better options. I'm working on a Kila+1/Parazonium+1 combination for DNC at the moment, was also working on a STP Fusetto but FFFFFFFFFFFFFFF WS trials suck ***.

As for DNC DPS, it's actually fairly strong at the moment. High DW with capped haste gave it a nice bit of oomph and Razed Ruins is great for Evisceration. It's no MNK or WAR, but the extra DPS compliments DNC's support abilities quite nicely. I'm glad too, because Abyssea did a number on DNC's value as a healer... infinite MP and high HP all around made WHM the top healer by far.

well i mean thf isn't a heavy DD like the other DD's are since its a semi-support DD (with TH, and TA and accomplish/collab)

exactly how is dual wield calculated compared to haste? i mean i know dual wield is linear and haste is exponential. but i have noticed (ideally why i have maxed out dual wield instead of haste) that the more dual wield you have the more potent it is, not additive but multiplicative.

DW isn't linear - exactly the same as Haste.

y/(100 - (x+y)) * 100 will give you the % increase in adding y dual wield to a base of x dual wield.

Damn right it isn't.





I couldn't resist. >_>

sooooooo 53% dual wield 18% haste IS faster than 45% dual wield 25% haste?

If that's your total haste, yes. Should also be faster TP gain despite the TP penalty on DW since you're below 180 delay per hand. If you had haste buffs, it would be slower.

would be the same tp gain wouldn't it with the stp from mirke?

Maybe, maybe not. You didn't mention delays or STP and I don't know if it would compensate exactly in that case, but that's an extra factor that favors that build further. I take it the other 5% is Nusku's Sash? Sounds like you're overcapping (26%), which also helps the trade in the body slot. Waist is a little more iffy, especially if not-Swift is in play.

well you can tell my current tp setup from my page with the exception that i have ocelots now, and why do you think nusku is iffy? i mean sure bullwhip beats it in terms of speed but i cant see even goading beating it personally.

If played right thf can be an incredibly viable DD. Its DoT hits are weaker than any other 'dedicated' DD of the same gear grade, but if played and geared right for SA/TA > WS it is a true power house, especially when combined with atma RR. Having broken 4k repeatedly in abys with SA or TA evis, i'll say that its hard, but dont rule out thf as a DD.

Back on topic :D

/nin gives 15% dual wield as things stand. Thf dual wield is 10% meaning a 5% difference overall. The question is, would a different sub make up for the 5% difference? /whm haste is one option for pure attack speed, but lacks defence. /sam is an option for pure tp gain but again, lacks defence. /war would work for pure dmg but once more, no defence. Biggest thing, subjob is now even more situational than before. If in a situation where you will be taking shadow absorbed hits that would otherwise cause serious issue, then /nin. Otherwise its a question of whether another sub allows you to do your job better or not.

As of the 90cap, /nin dual wield will again be on top most likely, as it will give DW3, 25% reduction compared to 10% (maybe, MAYBE 15%) reduction from just thf.

nin should have triple attack. and so they can give thf a better dual wield.